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"Racism is dead in America." Bullshit

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Wednesday, June 12, 2024 15:52
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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 11:44 AM

CAVETROLL


Quote:

Originally posted by mal4prez:

Yes, yes and yes! I'm glad there are people going after this nonsense. The way Troll would have it, all I have to do is get in someone's face and talk smack until they try to push me out of the way, then I'm free to murder them in "self-defense'.


In Florida, yes. However, try not to have witnesses and remember to let him bloody your nose and the back of your head.

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 11:49 AM

CAVETROLL


Good news, Niki. You were right! Racism is alive and well in the United States!

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2012-03-04/news/31122324_1_white-boy-f
ire-tv-station


Quote:


Teens set kid on fire for being 'white boy'
MEENA HART DUERSON
Sunday, March 04, 2012
A 13-year-old boy who police say was doused with gasoline and lit on fire last week while walking home from school is recovering from first-degree burns to his face and head.

The boy was just two blocks from his home in Kansas City Tuesday when two teenagers began to follow him and then attacked him, his mother, Melissa Coon, said.

Police have described the suspects as black 16-year-olds, while the victim is white.

"We were told it's a hate crime," Coon told KTLA.


I can't wait to hear the howls of outrage and the demands for these two teenager's heads from Niki, KPO, and Anthony.

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 12:03 PM

OONJERAH


Cave, this thread already knows that, "Teens set kid on fire for being 'white boy'"

No one really approved of it, I think.
But that kid was clear-headed and saved his own life.

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 12:19 PM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg


Back in the day, I had a crew hunting me.

White ears earned you a place in the "fam". Nearly took a lead walking home one day. But a kid leaning out the cut doesn't have a really good aim, now do they?

I was 11.

Sorry, I don't really have patience for comfortable, middle class, people screaming raciss.

I actually feel bad for the kid trying to kill me. He probably had no father, no real family, and this was the best he thought he could do.

Glad he missed tho...

ETA: Just b/c Im remembering the bad ol days...



"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"



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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 12:28 PM

OONJERAH



Glad he missed you, Wulf.

The great thing about Racism is, It's an equal opportunity insanity.



                   

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 12:34 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Oonjerah:
Cave, this thread already knows that, "Teens set kid on fire for being 'white boy'"

No one really approved of it, I think.
But that kid was clear-headed and saved his own life.




I think only you commented on it.

Was it ignored, because thankfully, no one died, or because it didn't fit the standard template? The one which initially had the story wrong, where it was a WHITE guy who shot the black kid...





"The world is a dangerous place. Not because of the people who are evil; but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein

You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong. You cannot help the wage earner by pulling down the wage payer. You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich. You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves. - Someone.

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 12:53 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by CaveTroll:
Good news, Niki. You were right! Racism is alive and well in the United States!

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2012-03-04/news/31122324_1_white-boy-f
ire-tv-station


Quote:


Teens set kid on fire for being 'white boy'
MEENA HART DUERSON
Sunday, March 04, 2012
A 13-year-old boy who police say was doused with gasoline and lit on fire last week while walking home from school is recovering from first-degree burns to his face and head.

The boy was just two blocks from his home in Kansas City Tuesday when two teenagers began to follow him and then attacked him, his mother, Melissa Coon, said.

Police have described the suspects as black 16-year-olds, while the victim is white.

"We were told it's a hate crime," Coon told KTLA.


I can't wait to hear the howls of outrage and the demands for these two teenager's heads from Niki, KPO, and Anthony.




Why do you think that those "howls of outrage" are appropriate when a white kid is the victim (and lives), but it's "self defense" when a black kid is killed?

Hell, to hear from some here, this might have been "self defense" by the black kids against the white kid. Doesn't seem to matter if he was younger, smaller, outnumbered or unarmed...


Troll, I'm wondering if you're going to follow the well-established pattern set by Rappy and Wulfie, and tend to express your howls of outrage when only when it's whites who are the victims, and not when it's black people.

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 12:55 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Sorry, I don't really have patience for comfortable, middle class, people screaming raciss.



And yet you yourself have screamed it plenty of times here. I guess it's *different* when you do it, right?

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 12:56 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by CaveTroll:
Quote:

Originally posted by mal4prez:

Yes, yes and yes! I'm glad there are people going after this nonsense. The way Troll would have it, all I have to do is get in someone's face and talk smack until they try to push me out of the way, then I'm free to murder them in "self-defense'.


In Florida, yes. However, try not to have witnesses and remember to let him bloody your nose and the back of your head.




Yeah, next time you pick a fight with a kid a hundred pounds lighter than you, and get your ass handed to you, just murder the other guy and call it self-defense!

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 1:04 PM

OONJERAH



Sounds perfectly true.

As long as no witnesses, if killer is also bruised and scratched,
It is now Open Season on People in Florida.

This should include millions of senior citizens living there.


                   

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 2:16 PM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
Anyhows, them that DO the job deserve full credit Mal4, that I freely give ya.

Thanks. The only lawyer types I know well work on immigration domestic issues - ie, if an non-citizen gets beat up by her husband, how can she protect herself and her kids? It's a hard job, and the lawyers sure as hell aren't doing it for the money!

OK, that might not officially count as a public defender, but I think it's in the same vein.

You totally called it about Zimmerman. I had a feeling that it went as you said, but you summed it up perfectly. This guy was a time bomb - frightening, not unlike certain other time bombs out there... I wish they would learn from this, but it seems not.

It seems pretty clear from the evidence piling up that Zimmerman will get busted. Boy, if he doesn't, things could get ugly.


-----------------------------------------------
hmm-burble-blah, blah-blah-blah, take a left

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 2:44 PM

FREMDFIRMA



Well, there's another assumption down - during Zimmermans 911 call he mutters "Fuckin coons", and since he wasn't chasing a raccoon...
Although the "always get away" comment indicates to me it was both racial AND territorial, he didn't like them "on his turf", but that's no excuse neither.

Also, yes, he *WAS* a cop-wannabe, and got turned away or bounced from the idea at one time.
That can go a couple ways, either run off as a hair trigger psycho, which this guy was, can't pass the physical, or want the trappings but don't care to invest the time and effort - s'funny though, so long as you train them right and make the rules abundantly clear, the last two make pretty good guards.
Oh, and a third category - "I wanted to do the right thing, but they're sooo corrupt!", usually idealistic types who wound up storming out of the police academy in disgust.
THOSE guys make *excellent* guards, they're some of the few who can overcome the -50 for police training and/or experience in our interview process.

I am also hearing a lot of whining about the "Stand your ground" law, which this has NOTHING to do with, nor "Castle doctrine", neither one EVEN APPLIES since Zimmerman aggressively pursued a situation he shoulda stayed out of - but yes, you got folks with an anti self-defense agenda spinning it, of course you do, and it's assholes like Zimmerman which give em reason, as well as DIPSHITS who defend assholes like this even when they're clearly in the wrong cause of their OWN racial or partisan issues.
You hear me Wulfie ?
This guy's a murderin punk, and if you're gonna defend him cause YOU got racial issues, all you're doing is pissing all over the right to self-defense by proving those Better-World gun grabbers right.
You think race had shit to do with it in *MY* eyes ?

As Oojie says, equal opportunity insanity, racism - think I've never taken shit for being a whitebread cracker hillbilly ?
You think I ain't never been shot at ?
Unlike you, I don't hold it against everyone of that race, creed or culture, although admittedly I struggle to not have the same attitude against christians - the difference is I *TRY*, and you make no effort, you just try to rationalize and justify, a self-inflicted mental trap which leads right down the path Zimmerman took - you could, and should, learn a LESSON from that you pompous jackass.
But no, you can't bear to look at your own prejudices in the harsh light of truth, so you lie to yourself, well have at it, but don't try selling that bullshit to me.

And no, Zimmerman is NOT gonna walk it off - this is gonna go to grand jury, which it should have in the first place (even if it was an obvious no-bill) cause any time someone drops the hammer on another human being it should AT LEAST be questioned as a general policy, a standard procedure which prevents crap like this from NEEDING so much public outrage to grease the wheels of justice.
And he's gonna fry, since his flapping yap has ALREADY handed out enough evidence to sink him deep, from lying in his original statement, changing his story, ignoring procedure, common sense and the advice of a police dispatcher, making a racially charged comment on tape, not clearly identifying himself or his intentions at the beginning of the confrontation...

Again, I do know what the hell I'm talkin about, this is my official money-in-my-pocket, food-on-my-table aboveboard work, and I been doin it long enough to spot out a creep like Zimmerman miles away, cause hiring one of THOSE will sink your biz in the gutter with legal and liability problems before you can even blink.

-Frem

PS. Speakin of real racoons, the fuzzy kind, I scored a neat video clip last night playing peek-a-boo with one around a tree, it's quite cute...

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 5:25 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
Stereotypes don't just happen.

A lot of people have to see a behavior before one is born. Then that behavior has to be reinforced over time for it to be vetted.

Drunk Irish.

Covetous Jew.

Mob Italian.

Bookworm Asian.

Maybe instead of blaming the aftermath of said stereotypes... you should try changing them. (Tho I give a pass to Asians.... getting good grades is not a vice.)

Everyone was all set to jump on this. "WHITE MAN KILLS BLACK BOY!"... and all that entails.

But now that the guy was Hispanic... you backpeddle. Cus God knows, its only ok to cry raciss when the target is white.

When its an "other"... well then. That gets all sorts of complicated, right? Only white people are raciss, right?

Racism does exist. But you might want to look in the mirror first before you start throwing that word around.





Who do you accuse of backpedaling? And why do you say Zimmerman's NOT white? Because he's part Hispanic?

Clearly, not *only* white people are racist, because you claim Zimmerman's NOT white, and here he is on a 911 call talking about "fucking coons" while chasing an unarmed 17-year-old black kid who was breaking no laws.

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 5:28 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Wanna see how Fox News commenters are responding?

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/40088_Fox_News_Commenters_Reac
t_to_Trayvon_Martin-_Good_Shot_Zimmy


These are actual quotes left on the Fox News website in response to the story:

Quote:

What a shame—a tragedy, really— because the dead lil’ gangsta could’ve used “‘A-FIRM-TIV AK-SHUN” to go to kollige an play footballz and make lotsa cash munny!”

[…]

Fast and Furious didn’t work to pass new gun control so now Eric Holder will try the race card.

[…]

No matter how crime figures are massaged by those who want to acknowledge or dispute the existence of a Dirty War, there is nothing ambiguous about what the official statistics portray: for the past 45 years a large segment of bIack America has waged a war of v i o l e n t retribution against white America.

[…]

Zimmerman was attacked by the man and defended himself with a gun. Zimmerman’s wounds were verified by police.

[…]

17 = child. LOL!!!!!!

Let the LIB word games begin.

[…]

Yet the “justice department” refuses to prosecute any voter intimidation that involves a blac k as the intimidator.

[…]

Why should anyone care about this kid? Because he is of color? People don’t value kids period. They are property. BTW, I am a conservative that cares a great deal about kids. We follow hundreds of cases each year, many white babies and children, none of them get attention. But he does??

[…]

Zimmerman felt threatened by Martin’s gang’s actions…this could have possibly lead to these terrible circumstances. Gang violence MUST BE STOPPED OBAMA!

[…]

Blacks can do no wrong, period! That is the DOJ’s excuse for becoming involved. 50+ years of being told they are special and entitled and the gov’t’s only focus is to make it so!!

[…]

In any event, it appears to be a case of one sc u m bag Cuban-type (Zimmerman) offing some scummy b l a ck kid (Trayyy-Vonnnn)…in some trash neighborhood….

but now, because the dead kid’s a kneegrow, we have:

the BIG BAD FBI on this “important” case…and

the usual BLACK-RADICAL-PROTESTERS who can’t mind their own business!

[…]

Gated communities exist because people are afraid….& negros thrive on crime…Look at our prisons.

[…]

Need that too….But Negr0s only have their welfare checks….and in any event can’t follow rules

[…]

What time do the riots start? Gotta get my popcorn and munchies ready for the “hood” burning!

[…]

Funny you never see them rally against the drug dealing murderers that control their neighborhoods. LOL!!!

[…]

How does anyone know what this 17 yr old said, Most likely he threw the race card out ” you stop me because I*M B L ACK” and then became threatning. The media alway plants the seed of doubt when when a B l ac k is sh ot by a caucasian

[…]

maybe his gang brothers incited violence too?

[…]

How’d the kid get into the “gated” community in the first place?

[…]

Them monkeys can jump!

[…]

This is going to be a tough case. gang violence is hard to prosecute. martin’s gang may even want to retaliate. this is scary

[…]

Let’s find out why the “po’ baby” was REALLY there!

[…]

The little thug ghetto monkey should have been home doing his homework, not out gang bangin.

[…]

I’m just glad Zimmerman didnt miss and hit an innocent bystander.

[…]

THIS IS PURE RACIST!! When do you ever see the DOJ investigate the death of a white child??

[…]

This is pure B.S I want to see the kids police record even if something is expounged also why was he removed from facebook it says account terminated.Why because his parents are trying to cover his tracks just like if you hit a bus they see Dollar signs.People have dragged data about Zimmerman out where is the kids past.Don’t say he was a good boy prove it.Ask yourself what is more likely to happen any 17 year old kid when you ask a question.A smartass reply I have never and I mean never seen a teenager run unless he did something wrong.I guess no crinimal has ever cased a place when they went to a store.It takes me aback the way all these facts are quoted by people who read one story on a issue.

[…]

Who says his gang wasn’t hiding near by?

[…]

he could be a good kid, but being in a gang doesn’t help his case

[…]

An unfortunate death, but when will DOJ investigate the death of a Caucsasian?

[…]

Here we go again— a LOCAL law enforcement matter (no federal issues) is being hijacked by the FEDS because the alleged “victim” is bl a c k! We all KNOW this kid was up to no good and now he’s feedin’ worms. Too bad-ha ha ha!

[…]

Last night on CNN Anderson Cooper kept referring to zimmerman as white when he knew he was Hispanic I wonder why

[…]

maybe then the kid was not bIack maybe Hawaiian like tiger woods then we can say s p i c s h o o t s Hawaiian

[…]

This has Bl ack racist Holder and his all bl ack racist “DOJ Civil Rights Div” written all over it.

[…]

Crack Skittles the new disguise

[…]

Skittles actually has a couple slang meanings. Could be referring to recreational usage of Coricidin. Also refers to a male getting lipstick marks from young ladies on the member. Taste the rainbow..

[…]

You think the DOJ or main stream will report zimmerman was Hispanic not White

[…]

That is all it was — just another n i qq er. No loss

[…]

He was slinging crack.

[…]

Is tea and skittles slang for guns and crack.

[…]

Skittles is actually slang for recreational usage of Coricidin.

[…]

This is what happens when you join a gang. kids need to learn from Martin’s mistakes

[…]

They should have a hunting season in Florida for these drug crazed gang members.

[…]

This could have had a tragic outcome. His gun could have jammed. Whew!

[…]

At least he didn’t chain him to the back of his truck?!?!?

[…]

How long will it take to get all of those little blk curly nappys out of the White House bedding so that the next POTUS can sleep without that Creepy Crawly feeling .

[…]

The picture is of an innocent choir boy designed to evoke sympathy for the “victum” and justify the skewed actions of a corrupt department of justice.

[…]

the b!ack community has created a sense of fear with the excessive amounts of cr!me and v!olence and the glamorizing and glorification of cr!mes and v!olence through c rap music (term used lightly) and most are rude, crude, nasty and give others the tough guy BS attitude.You people (term also used lightly) made your beds and now have to lie in them………don’t be angry with us or blame us you did this all on your own.

[…]

Hunting, maybe thinning the herd…

[…]

It is obvious the un-civilized B!ACKS who dwell in the greatist nation on earth have never wanted to be part of the TEAM, they CRY and P!SS and MOAN at every given oportunity about fairness and equality, While lining up for the free ride at welfare.
The United States is cursed with these baboons, Who will never gain the ability to stand up and make it on their own without our help.
They are the eternal retarded stepchild , needfull and helpless until the end of time.

[…]

Now the family of the kid has lost there way out of the ghetto.

[…]

ANOTHER TOOKY WILLIAMS, ABORTED.
GOOD SHOT ZIMMY. lol


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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 5:46 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Irish millworker

Jewish physicist

Italian tenor

Asian gang

Oh, I just thought I'd contribute some equal but opposite stereotypes.

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 5:48 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Sad to say Kwicko, but all the facts in the world will only garner an equal and opposite reaction.

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 6:19 PM

OONJERAH



Last phone call may provide clues in Florida teen's shooting death =>
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-trayvon-martin-20
120321,0,6465227.story


The lawyer for Trayvon Martin's family says the conversation shows the 17-year-old was
killed 'in cold blood.' The gunman's father disagrees.


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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 6:20 PM

OONJERAH



An invitation to murder? by Clarence Page =>
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/columnists/ct-oped-0321-page-201203
21,0,7296267.column

(Chicago Tribune)

Mr. Page is saying what some of us said, the "stand your ground" law
is a license to kill. But he has researched the statistics to prove it.




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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 6:38 PM

CAVETROLL


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko


Why do you think that those "howls of outrage" are appropriate when a white kid is the victim (and lives), but it's "self defense" when a black kid is killed?

Hell, to hear from some here, this might have been "self defense" by the black kids against the white kid. Doesn't seem to matter if he was younger, smaller, outnumbered or unarmed...


Troll, I'm wondering if you're going to follow the well-established pattern set by Rappy and Wulfie, and tend to express your howls of outrage when only when it's whites who are the victims, and not when it's black people.


It is not about race. It is about the laws as they are written not the laws as the public mob thinks they should be.

The difference, and I'm wondering why certain folks are having such a hard time parsing this, is the sequence of the events. Z follows M. There's some confrontation. Eyewitnesses see M on top of Z. Z is calling for help. At some point Z gets free and shoots M. When the police arrive Z is bleeding from the nose and the back of the head. Injuries are substantive proof of assault and reinforce existing Florida law. Nothing indicates racial motivation that lead to the use of deadly force. The police do not have enough evidence to arrest, so Z goes free. The investigation is ongoing. With the public outcry, the police and the DAs office will feel pressured to pull together a case. Any case.

You know what this reminds me of? The Nicole Simpson murder trial. The police and the DAs office in LA blew it because the eyes of the world were on them.

Now, let's look at Kansas City. I don't believe there's an affirmative defense for setting someone on fire in Missouri. If you know of one, please let us all know.

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 7:25 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


'The investigation is ongoing.'

Only due to public pressure. Against dispatcher advice a 28 year old armed man stalks an unarmed 17 year old. In the phone conversation between the 17 year old and his g/f he says that he is being followed and he's trying to get away. The 17 year old is cornered, a scuffle ensues, the 17 year old is shot dead, and the police DO NOT INVESTIGATE. Instead, the 911 calls are withheld, then 'corrected' b4 being released. Witness statements are quietly shuffled away. The cell phone call to the g/f is ignored.

It takes the FEDERAL JUSTICE DEPARTMENT to prod the police department to investigate.

And this is what you're defending as just the normal workings of the law. Nothing about Zimmerman being in the wrong for stalking, intimidating and accosting. Nothing about the PD jiggering the evidence or the testimony. Just a regrettable meeting between a violent young black man, and a man who was only defending himself from unprovoked attack. This laughable piece of crap is what you would have us believe is the truth.

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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 10:28 PM

FREMDFIRMA



I call bullshit, Trollboy.

Zimmerman, AFTER making a racial slur and demonstrating obvious bias, then against common sense, procedure and good advice, follows and needlessly, deliberately provokes a confrontation, without identifying himself or his intentions, mind you - with a much smaller, younger person, has his ass handed to him for it, and then shoots the kid in a hissy fit.

That's second degree murder.

Spin it all you like, but your shine-job flies like a cement airplane in light of the demonstrated, proven facts of the case available, that is unless you wanna call a confirmed police dispatch recording a fake, you got nothin.

Heaven forfend if this kid had any kind of juvie rapsheet, which a lot of kids of all races do, cause then the howling from the shit throwing racist monkeys of fauxnews and asshats like you would be trying to spin a vandalism or shoplifting pop to make the boy look like some kinda hardened criminal, without an ounce of doubt.

And lest you forget, it works both ways - had the boy shot Zimmerman, from HIS end of the altercation he would have been defending himself against some creepy motherfucker who was following him, then confronted and laid hands on him, except of course our stupid magic-number laws don't allow young people to defend themselves, which is another issue I got with shit like this.

And once again it shows the true colors of the hateful, intolerant, misogynistic mighty-whitey-righty crowd, the pure evil that lies behind the mask, and the REASON that if I had my way there'd be a robespierrian purge, and them folk would wind up providing the only use they're any good for.

Fertilizer.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 3:29 AM

CAVETROLL


Frem, when have I ever insulted you? I'm going to ask that you withdraw your insult against me. I've tried to stay on the high road while you, Kwicko, Niki, KPO, Oonjerah, and 1kiki work yourself up into a lather. The law is what it says. I have only argued the points of the law. I've never said that Z was right. I think his actions were irresponsible, but not punishable, UNDER FLORIDA LAW.

Admittedly, I haven't listened to the tapes. They're just fuel for the fire of public opinion. You say Z used a racial slur, great. Z used a racial slur.

Overnight I've learned a fact that tells me the feds have Z on another charge. He'll cop a plea, if it is true.

ETA: Withdraw allegation of lathering against Anthony.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 3:36 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



CT - some folks just work with their prejudiced template, and anyone who colors outside of the lines, or suggests a different view, is to be mocked and ridiculed.

Especially here, of all places.

You should know that by now.





"The world is a dangerous place. Not because of the people who are evil; but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein

You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong. You cannot help the wage earner by pulling down the wage payer. You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich. You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves. - Someone.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 4:48 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Quote:

I've tried to stay on the high road while you, Kwicko, Niki, Anthony, KPO, Oonjerah, and 1kiki work yourself up into a lather.


Hello,

Perhaps you could be specific, in my case, where I lathered in disproportion?

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

Note to self: Mr. Raptor believes that women who want to control their reproductive processes are sluts.

Reference thread: http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=18&t=51196

Never forget what this man is. You keep forgiving him his trespasses and speak to him as though he is a reasonable human being. You keep forgetting the things he's advocated. If you respond to this man again, you are being foolish.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 5:43 AM

CAVETROLL


You are correct, Anthony. Edited to withdraw. My apologies.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 5:44 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Quote:

Originally posted by CaveTroll:
You are correct, Anthony. Edited to withdraw. My apologies.



Hello,

Accepted, and thank you.

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

Note to self: Mr. Raptor believes that women who want to control their reproductive processes are sluts.

Reference thread: http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=18&t=51196

Never forget what this man is. You keep forgiving him his trespasses and speak to him as though he is a reasonable human being. You keep forgetting the things he's advocated. If you respond to this man again, you are being foolish.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 6:38 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Yes, Cave; the law is what it is. And what it is says very clearly that the boy had the right not to answer questions of someone following him, AND had the right to protect HIMSELF against a stalker who he felt threatened him. I assume you missed that part, which I posted in detail. Nobody knows who attacked who initially, nobody can say who was on top, etc., just "two men who looked like they were wrestling", so how do we know it wasn't Zimmerman who tackled Travon? We don't.

Zimmerman's description of the boy staring at the houses could easily have been (and probably was) his trying to figure out which house he came from; he may not have been there at night, and if it were me, I wouldn't have wanted to knock on just any door in a gated community until I was sure it was the right door. I've heard nothing about him having been drunk or on drugs, so I believe if Zimmerman really thought that (and wasn't just using it as an excuse to pursue), he may have been influenced by his own sense of authority to get the wrong impression.

I'm sorry to see people trying to work this out with what few facts we have, while the usual suspects need to jump to the conclusionthat nobody cares now they know Zimmerman is PARTLY Hispanic. It shows racism on their part, nobody else's, since the tide of opinion has turned due to further information coming out, not the race of the suspect.

I'm sure glad those were COMMENTS, Mike...when I first glanced at it, I thought it was FauxNews commentators saying that, and even for FauxNews, that shocked me. Looking again, I see it was commentators; so, while I only read the first few, none of them would surprise me. We know the portion of the population FauxNews cottons to, so their reaction shouldn't surprise anyone. That there are many, many ugly minds out there which FauxNews encourages we already know all too well.

As to "working up into a lather", I've never felt anything here was important enough for that, sorry to disappoint you. Everything here is just opinion, same as me, so why would any of it be important enough to get upset about? I express my opinions, sometimes my disgust or amusement, then walk away from here and don't think about it again until I return. That you feel people have gotten worked up is your perception; I'm sad it's that important to you.

I'm glad you think his actions were irresponsible, but I say again: The law is quite clear, and to be followed by car and then on foot, and accosted by someone 100 pounds heavier gave the boy the legal right to defend himself if he felt threatened. As to another charge against Zimmerman, could you post a link, please, because I hadn't yet heard anything on that. I also hadn't heard anything about Zimmerman muttering something and would like a link to that so I can read it for myself, if that's possible. I haven't yet listened to the news, so I may have missed both.

As to the phone call to the girlfriend, the fact that she didn't come forward earlier makes me suspicious. It talks about "transcript", but how can they get a transcript of a cell phone call? For me, if they can prove the call even HAPPENED (which I believe IS possible?), that would be sufficient to make me believe more than disbelieve her story, but I'll wait for that information.

Basically, the law was on the BOY's side; he didn't have to answer questions by someone who wasn't a law enforcement person, who followed him in a car then on foot, and who accosted him for no understandable reason. Zimmerman was the aggressor, any way you look at it, and the self-defense law states clearly who had the right to self-defense--first Travon, who was doing NOTHING illegal nor bothering anyone.

Just out of curiosity, who here is a "comfortable, middle class, people screaming raciss"? I know I'm not--we sunk out of the middle class some years ago and we haven't been "comfortable" for years, and I haven't heard anyone "screaming raciss". Not that the statement has any valid meaning, typically, but I'm curious. I'm also sad to see that supposedly becoming a volunteer fireman and a father has done nothing to mature your attitudes, Wulf. That's a shame.



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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 7:15 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg


I wonder if, just if, a white boy was walking down the street... in the same fashion and manner as this kid... if it would have been different.

Lots of angles as to WHY Z decided to approach said kid.

Btw... just fyi, in case you were ignorant of it... lots of ghettos are being turned to barrios as Hispanics have been moving in. Lot of brown vs black hate there.

Not every black is a drug-dealer, and Hispanics have been beating them in getting work. Granted, its untaxed so they might have an unfair advantage.

So, they have the ability to buy property, open businesses... and all of a sudden, the hood becomes Mexiville.

And after scratching and crawling your way from Mexico, dodging INS, and working any shit job you can find... you think they arn't willing to keep their area clean?

Like I said, lots of angles on this, lots of ins and outs...

All part of the fun of having every single, different, group living in the same area.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"



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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 7:16 AM

OONJERAH



*Oonjerah, who previously self-lathered, continues to lose it.*

NY Times => http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/21/us/justice-department-opens-inquiry-
in-killing-of-trayvon-martin.html?pagewanted=all


The state attorney in Tallahassee, Willie Meggs, who fought the law when it was proposed,
said: “The consequences of the law have been devastating around the state. It’s almost
insane what we are having to deal with.” ...

The National Conference of State Legislatures has found laws in nearly every state that allow
the use of deadly force, to a greater or lesser degree, in self-defense, and in defense of
property and premises.

“This wave of laws started back in the 1980s,” said Jon Kuhl ... Laws like Florida’s, which
give broad license to use deadly force and to claim self-defense, in many cases beyond the
home, are a more recent phenomenon, he said. Some of the more lenient ones are in Southern
states.

Dan Gross, the president of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, says that his
organization tracks laws in 21 states that extend the self-defense doctrine beyond the home.
The usual label for such laws — “stand your ground” — is politically charged, he said,
suggesting that a more apt label would be “Shoot first, ask questions later.”

Laws like the one in Florida allow situations like the Trayvon Martin killing, he said.
“We’re heartbroken, but we’re not surprised.”


ETA: BTW, I ran across this same discussion on a gun forum. The lean was the same, mostly
anti-Zimmerman.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 7:42 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg


Quoting the NY Times, Fox News, MSNBC, Examiner, don't really carry much weight in these parts.

I still say we need a news source that just reports fact, without opinion.

Yeah it would be boring as hell, but... you tell the truth, with no opinion... at least you could count on it.



"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"



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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 9:00 AM

KPO

Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.


Quote:

Originally posted by CaveTroll:
KPO,
http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute
&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0776/Sections/0776.013.html


Section 3 is the applicable statute.

I erred in referring to it as the Castle law. My apologies. The Florida law is called the "Stand Your Ground" law. If threatened you can use deadly force. Don't like the law? Move to Florida and get it changed.



Thanks for providing the exact law, it states (emphasis mine):

"A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself..."

The application of this law is dubious in this case because:
1) We have every reason to suspect it was Zimmerman who initiated the confrontation, and Martin simply 'stood his ground'.
2) Zimmerman had to reasonably believe he was in danger of death or great bodily harm at the moment that he fired - the facts of the case make this unlikely.

It's not personal. It's just war.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 9:12 AM

KPO

Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.


Quote:

Injuries are substantive proof of assault

CT, it's not 'assault' if it was Trayvon acting in self-defence, which seems to have been the case. Even if Trayvon jumped Zimmerman, HE WAS BEING STALKED - so such an action could reasonably be construed as defensive.

It's not personal. It's just war.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 9:12 AM

CAVETROLL


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Yes, Cave; the law is what it is. And what it is says very clearly that the boy had the right not to answer questions of someone following him, AND had the right to protect HIMSELF against a stalker who he felt threatened him. I assume you missed that part, which I posted in detail. Nobody knows who attacked who initially, nobody can say who was on top, etc., just "two men who looked like they were wrestling", so how do we know it wasn't Zimmerman who tackled Travon? We don't.


From ABC's story;
http://abcnews.go.com/US/trayvon-martin-family-seeks-fbi-investigation
-killing/story?id=15949879&page=2#.T2nbKPVCW8A

Quote:


Witnesses told ABC News a fistfight broke out and, at one point, Zimmerman, who outweighed Martin by more than 100 pounds, was on the ground and that Martin was on top.


Quote:


Zimmerman's description of the boy staring at the houses could easily have been (and probably was) his trying to figure out which house he came from; he may not have been there at night, and if it were me, I wouldn't have wanted to knock on just any door in a gated community until I was sure it was the right door. I've heard nothing about him having been drunk or on drugs, so I believe if Zimmerman really thought that (and wasn't just using it as an excuse to pursue), he may have been influenced by his own sense of authority to get the wrong impression.


Never tried to work it out. I'm more than satisfied to let the authorities work it out. But some seem to like the idea of trying this in the court of public opinion, which is where vigilante justice comes from.

From the same article;
Quote:


It may have been an allusion to a statement by a group called the New Black Liberation Militia, which planned to travel to Sanford, Fla., next week to enact a citizen's arrest against Zimmerman and bring him to federal authorities.


Yep, sounds like vigilante justice to me. I wonder if they're going to bring a rope?
Quote:


I'm sorry to see people trying to work this out with what few facts we have, while the usual suspects need to jump to the conclusionthat nobody cares now they know Zimmerman is PARTLY Hispanic. It shows racism on their part, nobody else's, since the tide of opinion has turned due to further information coming out, not the race of the suspect.


Sorry, racism can be called on the OP who outraged when they thought it was a white on black crime. Whatever.
Quote:


I'm sure glad those were COMMENTS, Mike...when I first glanced at it, I thought it was FauxNews commentators saying that, and even for FauxNews, that shocked me. Looking again, I see it was commentators; so, while I only read the first few, none of them would surprise me. We know the portion of the population FauxNews cottons to, so their reaction shouldn't surprise anyone. That there are many, many ugly minds out there which FauxNews encourages we already know all too well.

As to "working up into a lather", I've never felt anything here was important enough for that, sorry to disappoint you. Everything here is just opinion, same as me, so why would any of it be important enough to get upset about? I express my opinions, sometimes my disgust or amusement, then walk away from here and don't think about it again until I return. That you feel people have gotten worked up is your perception; I'm sad it's that important to you.


Yes, Niki. You work up a lather. You hurl epithets. People who don't work up a lather don't get that involved. Riona's recent experiment result shows that you are the 4th worst on the board. And I don't recall you ever apologizing. Denial in the face of evidence is delusional.

Quote:


I'm glad you think his actions were irresponsible, but I say again: The law is quite clear, and to be followed by car and then on foot, and accosted by someone 100 pounds heavier gave the boy the legal right to defend himself if he felt threatened. As to another charge against Zimmerman, could you post a link, please, because I hadn't yet heard anything on that. I also hadn't heard anything about Zimmerman muttering something and would like a link to that so I can read it for myself, if that's possible. I haven't yet listened to the news, so I may have missed both.


Wrong. Directions from a dispatcher do not have the force of law. They are not sworn officers. Zimmerman had as much right to be there as Martin.

Also, there's this;
http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/21/10791755-neighbor-comes-t
o-defense-of-trayvon-martins-shooter

Quote:


...Frank Taaffe pointed out the circumstances that he believes led his 28-year-old neighbor to react the way he did on the night of Feb. 26: Eight burglaries within 15 months, most done by young black males, he said...



Quote:


As to the phone call to the girlfriend, the fact that she didn't come forward earlier makes me suspicious. It talks about "transcript", but how can they get a transcript of a cell phone call? For me, if they can prove the call even HAPPENED (which I believe IS possible?), that would be sufficient to make me believe more than disbelieve her story, but I'll wait for that information.

Basically, the law was on the BOY's side; he didn't have to answer questions by someone who wasn't a law enforcement person, who followed him in a car then on foot, and who accosted him for no understandable reason. Zimmerman was the aggressor, any way you look at it, and the self-defense law states clearly who had the right to self-defense--first Travon, who was doing NOTHING illegal nor bothering anyone.


Zimmerman was doing the job that his neighborhood had asked and appointed him to do. The string of robberies and break ins just set the stage. They both had the right to self defense. Martin did not have the right to hit Zimmerman.

Oh yes, and while we're on the subject, that girlfriend's phone call? She said that Martin said (well into hearsay now) "I'm not running." So, is the 100 pound heavier, beefy guy also a track star and can catch up with a stringbean teenager? Or did Martin stand his ground with aggression in mind? Which scenario does the evidence fit?
Quote:


Just out of curiosity, who here is a "comfortable, middle class, people screaming raciss"? I know I'm not--we sunk out of the middle class some years ago and we haven't been "comfortable" for years, and I haven't heard anyone "screaming raciss". Not that the statement has any valid meaning, typically, but I'm curious. I'm also sad to see that supposedly becoming a volunteer fireman and a father has done nothing to mature your attitudes, Wulf. That's a shame.



Uh, you were the original poster of this thread and the title of this thread says it all. You screamed racism first.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 9:21 AM

KPO

Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by Oonjerah:
Cave, this thread already knows that, "Teens set kid on fire for being 'white boy'"

No one really approved of it, I think.
But that kid was clear-headed and saved his own life.




I think only you commented on it.

Was it ignored, because thankfully, no one died, or because it didn't fit the standard template? The one which initially had the story wrong, where it was a WHITE guy who shot the black kid...





"The world is a dangerous place. Not because of the people who are evil; but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein

You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong. You cannot help the wage earner by pulling down the wage payer. You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich. You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves. - Someone.



Auraptor,

My thoughts on the incident in the article you posted:

1) It's horrific.
2) The incident was probably not as bad as it sounds in that article - the boy was able to save himself by taking off his t-shirt? He can't have been heavily doused in petrol then. Not so much 'boy set on fire' as 'boy's t-shirt set on fire while he was wearing it'. But I'm guessing here.
3) No, it didn't gain widespread traction in the media but wait - neither did the Trayvon Martin case... (until public pressure brought it to attention)
4) I'll bet the police DID arrest the perpetrators and justice was served (at least I hope so), unlike in the Trayvon Martin case - hence less public outcry

It's not personal. It's just war.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 9:22 AM

CAVETROLL


Quote:

Originally posted by kpo:
Quote:

Originally posted by CaveTroll:
KPO,
http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute
&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0776/Sections/0776.013.html


Section 3 is the applicable statute.

I erred in referring to it as the Castle law. My apologies. The Florida law is called the "Stand Your Ground" law. If threatened you can use deadly force. Don't like the law? Move to Florida and get it changed.



Thanks for providing the exact law, it states (emphasis mine):

"A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself..."

The application of this law is dubious in this case because:
1) We have every reason to suspect it was Zimmerman who initiated the confrontation, and Martin simply 'stood his ground'.
2) Zimmerman had to reasonably believe he was in danger of death or great bodily harm at the moment that he fired - the facts of the case make this unlikely.



KPO,
See the link in my reply to Niki above. There's an eyewitness who saw Martin on top of Zimmerman. If you are down on the ground with someone on top of you, you can be beaten to unconsciousness. What happens after you're out, well, a prudent man wouldn't want to find out. If Zimmerman had pursued and then shot Martin it would be murder. Zimmerman pursued. He had as much right as Martin to be there. The dispatch operators advice had no force of law. Once Martin started hitting Zimmerman he opened the door for Zimmerman to defend.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 9:36 AM

KPO

Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.


CT, if Zimmerman shot Martin at that exact moment in their fight, then I would say you have a case. But that does not appear to be what happened: Zimmerman doesn't claim this in his statement, and nor does this fit with what can be heard on the tapes (a man's voice calling for help, silenced by gunshots).

It's not personal. It's just war.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 9:57 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg


If people were smart, they would use this as a way to talk about the real issues.

But no... we are subjected to the same old B.S.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"



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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 11:22 AM

OONJERAH



*I imagine if I were lathered, my eyes would be wider.*

"Sponsors of Florida ‘Stand Your Ground’ law say George Zimmerman should be arrested"
:> http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/trayvon-martin-case-sponsors-
florida-stand-ground-law-george-zimmerman-arrested-article-1.1048164


"The guy lost his defense right then," Peaden told the Herald.
"When he said, 'I'm following him,' he lost his defense."




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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 12:15 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by kpo:
Auraptor,

My thoughts on the incident in the article you posted:

1) It's horrific.
2) The incident was probably not as bad as it sounds in that article - the boy was able to save himself by taking off his t-shirt? He can't have been heavily doused in petrol then. Not so much 'boy set on fire' as 'boy's t-shirt set on fire while he was wearing it'. But I'm guessing here.
3) No, it didn't gain widespread traction in the media but wait - neither did the Trayvon Martin case... (until public pressure brought it to attention)
4) I'll bet the police DID arrest the perpetrators and justice was served (at least I hope so), unlike in the Trayvon Martin case - hence less public outcry




My intent was to show that , yes, racism exists, but it's not a 1 way street.

Also, in no way did I mean to suggest this was an apples to apples comparison, as the victim in Kansas City survived, and with only minor injuries. ( And this was because of quick thinking on HIS part, not because the attackers weren't capable enough, or didn't really MEAN to burn him alive )

And about that...and your 2nd point. THEY TRIED TO BURN HIM. What part of that do you see as " not as bad as it sounds " ? To me, this shows so much more malice and hatred aforethought, than what may or may not have gone down in FL. The punks intended to give the white boy what he deserved, the justice he was due, as they saw it in their eyes. Maybe the guy was a dick. Maybe he wasn't down with them, and some how 'dissed' them, who knows ? But burning folks alive ? Sorry to segue to a Jayne like tone, but where's THAT get fun?





"The world is a dangerous place. Not because of the people who are evil; but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein

You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong. You cannot help the wage earner by pulling down the wage payer. You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich. You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves. - Someone.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 1:14 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

CT - some folks just work with their prejudiced template, and anyone who colors outside of the lines, or suggests a different view, is to be mocked and ridiculed.

Especially here, of all places.



Especially by you, of all people.

Everyone should know that by now.




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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 1:19 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by kpo:
Quote:

Injuries are substantive proof of assault

CT, it's not 'assault' if it was Trayvon acting in self-defence, which seems to have been the case. Even if Trayvon jumped Zimmerman, HE WAS BEING STALKED - so such an action could reasonably be construed as defensive.

It's not personal. It's just war.




Exactly. Z's injuries are substantive proof of nothing.

As to the alleged eye-witness, we've already heard one witness state that their statements to police were changed from what they said they heard and saw.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 1:20 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
If people were smart, they would use this as a way to talk about the real issues.

But no... we are subjected to the same old B.S.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"







And what, in your estimation, are the "real issues"?

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 1:27 PM

OONJERAH


Quote Kwicko: "And what, in your estimation, are the 'real issues'?"

That puzzled me, too.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 3:32 PM

CHRISISALL


When someone is following you, RUN, & dive over fences & stuff- most stupid folk won't be able to keep up or shoot straight.
If you CONFRONT an as***le. be prepared for the lazy response (I.E., getting shot).
DO NOT be where the moron is. DO NOT BE in the vector of the muzzle. If you cannot do one of these two things, you can die.

Man, this world is reverting, again.


The Mal-like Chrisisall


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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 4:22 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Quote:

When someone is following you, RUN, & dive over fences & stuff-


Hello,

While this is certainly an option for many people, it isn't for me. My asthma means that I can run for less than 30 seconds before hitting serious trouble, and then if someone catches up with me, I'm done for.

My own technique is to plod away from threats while avoiding any behavior that might provoke an attack- while being ready to defend myself.

Today's incident was not people, but a dog.

On my daily 2 mile walk to work, a free-roaming bulldog ran towards me and barked frothily. Closed to within six feet.

I ignored him and plodded on at a steady pace. Never did more than glance his way. Eventually he satisfied himself about defending his adopted territory or sphere of influence and went away. Never bit me, which is nice, because a man who walks to work does not need holes in his legs.

I was prepared to defend against the dog if necessary, but keeping my cool made sure it wasn't necessary.

I wish all people were as easy to deal with as dogs.

--Anthony



_______________________________________________

Note to self: Mr. Raptor believes that women who want to control their reproductive processes are sluts.

Reference thread: http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=18&t=51196

Never forget what this man is. You keep forgiving him his trespasses and speak to him as though he is a reasonable human being. You keep forgetting the things he's advocated. If you respond to this man again, you are being foolish.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 4:26 PM

CHRISISALL


I had a strikingly similar situation once, dealt with it similarly ('cept I told the dog I'd kill it), and walked away too.
No need for violence in most cases.


The Mal-like Chrisisall


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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 4:45 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)





Police Chief loses "no confidence" vote by city officials.


Quote:

In a tense meeting Wednesday that highlighted growing tensions over the shooting death of an unarmed black teenager, local officials in Sanford, Fla., passed a vote of no confidence in the police chief as protests spread north to New York City, where the slain youth’s parents joined a Manhattan march demanding the killer’s arrest.

The no-confidence measure passed 3 to 2 after more than an hour of debate, and though it was not binding, the outcome and the public groans and applause that punctuated the debate underscored the anger pulsing through the Orlando suburb nearly a month after 17-year-old Trayvon Martin’s death on Feb. 26. Most of that anger is focused on the fact that the confessed shooter, 28-year-old George Zimmerman, who has been described as both Latino and white, has not been arrested.

Dozens of Sanford residents gathered in the Sanford City Hall, where City Commissioner Mark McCarty set the tone for the meeting by noting that he had called for Police Chief Bill Lee’s ouster 10 days earlier in a meeting with the city manager, Norton N. Bonaparte Jr.

“I take no pleasure in publicly flogging our police chief. He’s a good man,” McCarty said.

But McCarty said questions surrounding the case, and the negative publicity cast upon the city since the killing, were largely the result of mishandling of the investigation. The questions, he said, include whether police were too quick to accept Zimmerman’s claim that he fired in self-defense, despite the fact that Martin was unarmed and that witnesses described hearing someone wailing for help before a gunshot rang out.

A lawyer representing Martin's family, Benjamin Crump, has said that the teenager was on a cellphone with his girlfriend and expressed concern that he was being followed by a strange man in the seconds before he was shot. And two women who live near the shooting scene have said that Martin was lying face-down, with Zimmerman looming over him, after he was shot.

“If it was self-defense, why was he [Zimmerman] on Trayvon’s back?” one of the witnesses, Mary Cutcher, told CNN in an interview.




http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-trayvon-martin-s
anford-police-chief-20120321,0,4163905.story

for full story.






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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 4:50 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by AnthonyT:
Quote:

When someone is following you, RUN, & dive over fences & stuff-


Hello,

While this is certainly an option for many people, it isn't for me. My asthma means that I can run for less than 30 seconds before hitting serious trouble, and then if someone catches up with me, I'm done for.

My own technique is to plod away from threats while avoiding any behavior that might provoke an attack- while being ready to defend myself.

Today's incident was not people, but a dog.

On my daily 2 mile walk to work, a free-roaming bulldog ran towards me and barked frothily. Closed to within six feet.

I ignored him and plodded on at a steady pace. Never did more than glance his way. Eventually he satisfied himself about defending his adopted territory or sphere of influence and went away. Never bit me, which is nice, because a man who walks to work does not need holes in his legs.

I was prepared to defend against the dog if necessary, but keeping my cool made sure it wasn't necessary.

I wish all people were as easy to deal with as dogs.

--Anthony



_______________________________________________

Note to self: Mr. Raptor believes that women who want to control their reproductive processes are sluts.

Reference thread: http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=18&t=51196

Never forget what this man is. You keep forgiving him his trespasses and speak to him as though he is a reasonable human being. You keep forgetting the things he's advocated. If you respond to this man again, you are being foolish.




You did this just right. Most people simply don't realize how a dog's brain works. If it's a strange dog, not known to you, DO NOT make eye contact. Looking a dog in the eye is seen by the dog as a "challenge" - you're challenging its territory or its dominance, or trying to assert your own. DO NOT show your teeth, even in a smile. Think about it: how does a dog threaten? It shows its teeth. A strange dog sees a show of teeth as you threatening the dog, and may very well act out in self defense at such behavior.

When I encounter strange dogs, even dogs behaving aggressively, I cast my eyes down and sit on the ground, head down. The dog realizes almost instantly that I'm no threat, and at that point its natural curiosity kicks in, and if I'm not foe, I must be friend, or at least someone worth checking out and getting close to.

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 5:07 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Troll

I just want to know - have we finally, FINALLY gotten past the idea that if you are armed and you are stalking someone that you can't claim self-defense?

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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 5:16 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
When I encounter strange dogs, even dogs behaving aggressively, I cast my eyes down and sit on the ground, head down.

Ha ha, frack that; I looked my menacing German Shepherd in the eye and asked it if it wanted to be dead.
I was not in a good mood. It realized that I was not to be fracked with.
Intent is important when dealing with animals.


The Mal-like Chrisisall


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