REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

JO 753 for Prezident!

POSTED BY: JO753
UPDATED: Monday, November 9, 2020 07:39
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Monday, March 13, 2017 10:31 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Wu? You hav another contender in mind?

Just added another How Stoopid Are We post.
https://howstupidarewe.blog/2017/03/13/its-big-it-stinks/#more-690

Altho its not strictly about stoopidity, the fact that our idiotic election system, GoP jerrymandering and gullible voterz conspired to get us in this situation mite qualify az the biggest goof up in history if we arent lucky.

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DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

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Monday, March 13, 2017 4:37 PM

SOCKPUPPET


Quote:

Originally posted by G:

OMG - we're approaching Hunger Games fake-iness. Live car crash involving a dumpster fire.


If Hillary is Coin, and Trump is Snow, than Maddow still ain't no Mockingjay

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Monday, March 13, 2017 5:57 PM

SOCKPUPPET


Quote:

Originally posted by G:
Quote:

Originally posted by SOCKPUPPET:
Quote:

Originally posted by G:

OMG - we're approaching Hunger Games fake-iness. Live car crash involving a dumpster fire.


If Hillary is Coin, and Trump is Snow, than Maddow still ain't no Mockingjay



I was thinking more Effie Trinket and Ceasar Flickerman fake.


Clearly Colbert is Flickerman (how fitting)


Unfortunately, he's also Effie Trinket


I vote Megyn Kelly as the new Effie Trinket

Pardon the cheesy photoshop. What's a google coming to when there's not a ready made Kelly Trinket shop?

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Monday, March 13, 2017 7:47 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Thanks for reminding me! I'v only seen the 1st Hunger Gamez. Got sum catching up to do.

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DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

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Tuesday, March 14, 2017 2:27 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


A little stratejic advise:

If youv ever felt that you hav no voise in the gummit, that you will be ignored no matter how lowly the elected official you are emailing or yelling at from a crowd uv similarly disgruntled sitizenz, nowz your chans.

On the off chans that I do get on the ballot and then win, I may remember sumthing youv ritten here and realize that its correct, the rite solution, a good idea, or sumthing.

I hav the same title thred going in several other forumz. I'm hoping to inspire and collect good ideaz from smart peepl.

If I win, I garrantee that I'm not going to hav a bunch uv free time to idle away type-yammering in forumz, so read my site and comment now.

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DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.7532020.com

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Friday, March 17, 2017 3:04 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Continued from the Iz Trump Nuts topic:

Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
HEY JO! I didn't want to have this discussion get lost in the shuffle! Right now this is one of the few intelligent ones going.



I think all the memberz hav sumthing intellijent to say. Not everybody all the time and not uv equal regularity, but at least on occasion even JSF haz a good point.


Quote:

By topic:

THE TPP/TTIP...
A nation relinquishing control over its internal policies (where they conflict with "usual and expected profits" ... which is pretty much everywhere) to a private tribunal of transnational corporations. That's a one-way step. Now, what kind of leader (President or Prime Minister) would sign such a deal except a traitor? This is so much bigger than Trump versus Hillary. The transnationals will, for sure, attempt to negotiate something similar in the future, whether in a series of "bilateral" deals (a la Trump) or as part of a whole new multi-party package. All new trade deals need to be examined closely, no matter who is President.



I agree. Az bad az goverments are, corporationz are naturally worse. Look at wut the oil companyz are doing in South America! They alwayz get the local goverment in on the deal, so wutever violationz there may be agenst anything in a trade deal woud be ignored anyway. The only time anybody raizez a stink iz wen they arent getting their cut.

And its not like the US iz immune to getting pooped on, the BP spill, for example. I think Obama missed a big political opportunity with that. He coud hav played up Chaney'z role in the mess and pressured the other branchez uv gummit to go along with booting BP out uv the country, maybe even fined Chaney'z company into oblivion.

That woud hav made him so pop that the midtermz woud hav gon Dem BIG TIME!

The argument that it woud destroy jobz woud hav been expozed az bad lojik az the other companyz eagerly rushed into fill the void. Plus, they woud be put on notis that sloppy & risky enviremental polisyz are a deadly risk to them, not just ducks & fish.

I'm bizzy with other stuff, so haf to chop your transfered post into seperate replyz.

Unansrd stuff:

Quote:

The simpl way iz to require all payroll recordz to be submitted along with their inkum tax filingz. Naturally, if they are dealing with forin vendorz, it gets much more complicated.- JO

Actually, it gets impossible. The vendors in this market (Walmart, The Gap, etc) simply "subcontract" to another company in another nation, and let THEM do the exploiting. It's called "the gig economy", haven't you heard? Everyone is paid piecework.- SIGNY

Ye, I no how it wrks. But not every company or even every industry iz able to do that and thoze that can cant do it 100%. So, wen Jimmy Lee in Shen Qua iz making 10x wut hiz nayborz are, it starts to spred. Pretty soon, even the novelty fake dog doo factory haz to start paying more to keep employeez.- JO

What you are talking about is a regulatory requirement: make payroll receipts and tax filings a necessary submission. Let's assume that extends to subcontractors and sub-subcontractors and down the the individual who has been "scraped off" the wage system and is working as a sub-sub-subcontractor him/herself. THEY have to submit their income statements, too!

Hey, I work in a regulatory agency, and we demand a lot of paperwork, and yet all of that paperwork has not prevented some terrible environmental crimes. So you need actual inspectors ... people going to the shops and homes to examine their standard of living etc to make sure that the paperwork is correct. And then, assuming you find a violation, you still need to have a hearing ... at which point the vendor will devolve responsibility to those below* ... and then assign a penalty. What's the penalty?

*the problem of "shared responsibility" where each party is guilty only of a small part of evil-doing. It makes participation much easier on the conscience of the individuals and much harder to prove guilt.

Quote:

JO .... WHO has killed more people and destroyed more nations in the past 20 years or so? Us? Or Russia? - SIGNY

US. And yet we are still sumhow the good guyz! - JO

Good lord, how is that? Because our intentions are pure?- SIGNY

Sumthing to do with the US being a nation uv lawz (more or less) rather than a jiant corrupt cleptocrasy like Russia, China, India, Pakistan. - JO

So being a nation of laws instead of a "giant kleptocracy" explains why we have been destroying and exploiting nations for years and why the system that WE stand behind- the IMF, the World Bank, and Free Enterprise has created a situation where 8 people own more than the bottom 50% of the world, and we have the largest wealth gap .... ever? Oh, you mean THAT "nation of laws"??? Hmmm.... maybe there's something wrong with our laws, then, because they don't seem to be preventing kleptocracy very well.

Quote:

Why is it in OUR interests to keep sway over an entire planet? What do YOU get out of it?- SIGNY

Good Q. The biggest paje on my site will probably end up being the ENVIRONMENT paje. Part uv it will go into that.

The short ansr iz individual power.- JO

Okay, you got me there. I have no idea what you're saying.

Quote:

Due to the great amount uv power, especially the power to destroy, available to each uv us AND to groups uv any size, the survival uv the planet iz dependent on having sum sort uv indesputable unchallenjable Cop keeping a watch on thingz. The big dog on the block haz to be a good guy.- JO

Can't figure this out, either.

If you're saying that individuals SHOULD have power, I disagree with that concept.
If you're saying that individuals DO have power, I disagree with that concept too. Most individuals have no power at all, not even over their own lives.

And then you propose that there has to be some "big dog" to ride herd on this group of death-dealing individuals, because that is the only way to survive.

And then you make some kind of tautology that the big dog has to be the good guy, but no way of defining what "the good guy" is or ensuring that the big dog WILL be the good guy.

I'm totally flummoxed. What are you saying? I feel that you're making sense, from your assumptions, and that your statements are connected, but I don't know how. Please explain.

Quote:

The immigration system iz krap. Total krap. The GoPs blocked Obama frum fixing it and you want to blame Hillary? - JO
What was Obama's "fix"? Let everyone in? Legalize everyone?- SIGNY
Hard to say sins the GoPs blocked it!!! I suppoze its available sumwhere anyway.- JO

I'm not blaming Hillary for whatever Obama did, I'm only blaming Hillary for what she said she would do, most of which I disagree with. https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/immigration-reform/ I have my own plan which I like a lot better.

Quote:

Trump is being just like I said he would be: A LOOSE CANNON. Well, we need a loose cannon. - SIGNY

Az per abuv about power - no we do not.- JO

Not understnaind what you said about power, I have no idea about this either.

Quote:

What's your goal here, JO? What are you aiming at? - SIGNY
Same az alwayz. Increase averaj intellijens, wizdom and empathy. Redoos evil. Contain and incapasitate the bad guyz.- JO

First of all... does this apply worldwide? Do you feel that it is ethical to impose your views on others? and how do you intend to do this?


I do agree about the environment by the way.


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Friday, March 17, 2017 10:50 AM

DREAMTROVE


Hmm. Look at what governments are doing in south america. cutting down rainforests and exterminating the indigenous population. Poeple say corporations start wars, but I don't see a lot of corporate employees being marched to the front lines by their corporation.

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Friday, March 17, 2017 11:02 AM

THGRRI


Something for you to read sockpuppet/dreamtrove

Social Murder

corporate power is one of the strongest forces shaping our world. More than half of the top 100 economic entities today are private corporations. With their immense size comes commensurate influence, to the point where corporations are able to wreak social and environmental destruction with few serious consequences. Yet, amazingly, this subject is essentially absent from the study of economics.

http://arpbooks.org/books/detail/social-murder/

It's amazing you posted what you did without acknowledging the cuts to the EPA past and present. Cuts done at the behest of corporations. Too many here continually post without regard for the facts.

---------------------


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Friday, March 17, 2017 6:34 PM

DREAMTROVE


Quote:

Originally posted by THGRRI:
Something for you to read sockpuppet/dreamtrove

Social Murder

corporate power is one of the strongest forces shaping our world. More than half of the top 100 economic entities today are private corporations. With their immense size comes commensurate influence, to the point where corporations are able to wreak social and environmental destruction with few serious consequences. Yet, amazingly, this subject is essentially absent from the study of economics.

http://arpbooks.org/books/detail/social-murder/

It's amazing you posted what you did without acknowledging the cuts to the EPA past and present. Cuts done at the behest of corporations. Too many here continually post without regard for the facts.

---------------------




That's more the spirit!

And something for you to read, Si Shen:

https://collateralmurder.wikileaks.org/

Here's another. If you want to understand liberal economic theory, I recommend GK Chesterton, Hillaire Belloc and FA Hayek. Belloc's Servile State is a good place to start. Basically starting in 1912 he forecasts the 20th century economics from the point of view of what will happen when the govt. gets involved.


ps. yes, i'm familiar with the EPA. My uncle works there. Has for many years. It's a captured agency. Meaning it's run by the oil companies. Corporations aren't perfect, sure. However, I can start one tomorrow. Watch what happens if you try to go out and start a government.

Govts. are mutli-trillion dollar entities, which got their money through violence. A corporation doesn't have any money we didn't willing give it, unless a govt. did. At that point, is it really a corporation and a govt, or has the merged entity become something else?

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Saturday, March 18, 2017 10:44 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. SECOND: I am so very sorry I libelled you by labelling you a Russian Troll. I apologize for this. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=64646&p=2


Well, that's better JO!

The other thread was kinda noisy!

I really like your approach of running for President. Instead of focusing on Trump versus Hillary or Democrats versus Republicans ... limited choices, each with downsides .... you get to post your best solutions to the problems that you see.

So I'm looking forward to discussing your platform with you and ... I hope others throw their hat in the ring too.



-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake

THUGR IS A DEEP-STATE TROLL

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Saturday, March 18, 2017 5:27 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Thats the idea.

Peepl hav forgotten that America started with ideaz. The founderz had experiens with how thingz can go rong and came up with ideaz to hopefully prevent the same failurez.

Now we hav experiens with how thingz can go rong with their creation.

Quote:

Actually, it gets impossible. The vendors in this market (Walmart, The Gap, etc) simply "subcontract" to another company in another nation, and let THEM do the exploiting. It's called "the gig economy", haven't you heard? Everyone is paid piecework.- SIGNY


Thats been going on forever. I worked with a guy who had worked at a tool forj - hammerz, renchez, plierz, etc. All piece work. Then they got a raw deal contract from Searz to make Craftsman stuff and went bankrupt and bought by a crony uv a Searz exec. That wuz SOP.

Quote:

Hey, I work in a regulatory agency, and we demand a lot of paperwork, and yet all of that paperwork has not prevented some terrible environmental crimes. So you need actual inspectors ... people going to the shops and homes to examine their standard of living etc to make sure that the paperwork is correct. And then, assuming you find a violation, you still need to have a hearing ... at which point the vendor will devolve responsibility to those below* ... and then assign a penalty. What's the penalty?


Wut ajensy?

Quote:

the problem of "shared responsibility" where each party is guilty only of a small part of evil-doing. It makes participation much easier on the conscience of the individuals and much harder to prove guilt.


A fundamental polisy stratejy iz to link the cost uv any problemz directly to thoze profiting. Whoever iz making money on sumthing gets to pay their share uv cleaning up messez, paying medical billz for workerz who get sick or injured.

So, lets say a Chineze subcontractor haz been dumping uzed solvent in a river. If anybody findz out EVER, the American company gets to pay to clean it up, plus wutever damaj it haz cauzed. They woud be open to lawsuits frum canser victimz or their surviving family. The damaj to the ecosystem woud be assessed a $ value. No time limit. No bankruptsy protection.

If the company goez out uv biz befor the crime gets discovered, the executivez who were in charj wenever it happened get to pay. Anybody who knew and didnt tell, anybody who tried to cover it up. Even workerz who were just following orderz.

A CEO woud haf to be seriously stoopid to think saving 100$ per barrel iz worth skipping proper disposal/recovery if it coud come back and bite him in the ass in 5, 10, 20, 50 yirz.

A smart CEO woud hire inspectorz to monitor subcontractorz and offer substantial rewardz for wisl blowerz.

If anybody complainz that they cant get their stuff made cheap enuf bekuz uv this, thats just too bad, kuz nobody can. Thered be no selling non-compliant products in this country. The prise uv the products goez up to wut it really costs!

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.7532020.com

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Saturday, March 18, 2017 6:29 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. SECOND: I am so very sorry I libelled you by labelling you a Russian Troll. I apologize for this. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=64646&p=2


Quote:

Peepl hav forgotten that America started with ideaz. The founderz had experiens with how thingz can go rong and came up with ideaz to hopefully prevent the same failurez.

Now we hav experiens with how thingz can go rong with their creation.

100% agreement here!

Quote:

Actually, it gets impossible. The vendors in this market (Walmart, The Gap, etc) simply "subcontract" to another company in another nation, and let THEM do the exploiting. It's called "the gig economy", haven't you heard? Everyone is paid piecework.- SIGNY

Thats been going on forever. I worked with a guy who had worked at a tool forj - hammerz, renchez, plierz, etc. All piece work. Then they got a raw deal contract from Searz to make Craftsman stuff and went bankrupt and bought by a crony uv a Searz exec. That wuz SOP.- JO

Sucks, doesn't it?

Quote:

Hey, I work in a regulatory agency, and we demand a lot of paperwork, and yet all of that paperwork has not prevented some terrible environmental crimes. So you need actual inspectors ... people going to the shops and homes to examine their standard of living etc to make sure that the paperwork is correct. And then, assuming you find a violation, you still need to have a hearing ... at which point the vendor will devolve responsibility to those below* ... and then assign a penalty. What's the penalty?- SIGNY

Wut ajensy? -JO

I prefer not to say. It's Southern CA environmental regulatory agency.

Quote:

the problem of "shared responsibility" where each party is guilty only of a small part of evil-doing. It makes participation much easier on the conscience of the individuals and much harder to prove guilt.- SIGNY

A fundamental polisy stratejy iz to link the cost uv any problemz directly to thoze profiting. Whoever iz making money on sumthing gets to pay their share uv cleaning up messez, paying medical billz for workerz who get sick or injured.

So, lets say a Chineze subcontractor haz been dumping uzed solvent in a river. If anybody findz out EVER, the American company gets to pay to clean it up, plus wutever damaj it haz cauzed. They woud be open to lawsuits frum canser victimz or their surviving family. The damaj to the ecosystem woud be assessed a $ value. No time limit. No bankruptsy protection.

If the company goez out uv biz befor the crime gets discovered, the executivez who were in charj wenever it happened get to pay. Anybody who knew and didnt tell, anybody who tried to cover it up. Even workerz who were just following orderz.

A CEO woud haf to be seriously stoopid to think saving 100$ per barrel iz worth skipping proper disposal/recovery if it coud come back and bite him in the ass in 5, 10, 20, 50 yirz.

A smart CEO woud hire inspectorz to monitor subcontractorz and offer substantial rewardz for wisl blowerz.

If anybody complainz that they cant get their stuff made cheap enuf bekuz uv this, thats just too bad, kuz nobody can. Thered be no selling non-compliant products in this country. The prise uv the products goez up to wut it really costs! - JO

Interesting. You plan sounds very much like the Superfund/ RCRA policy ... entities are held responsible for their toxic waste in perpetuity. When toxic sites are discovered, its history is evaluated and all still-existing companies are held responsible for the cleanup cost. Unfortunately, many sites have been contaminated by companies that are no longer in existence, don't even have successor companies (i.e. were never bought out, so liability was never transfered) and since the remaining companies are indivisibly responsible, they spend a lot of THEIR money on lawyers, in court. That is the failure of Superfund: too much $$ spent on lawyers, not enough on cleanup. Justice delayed really IS justice denied.



-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake

THUGR IS A DEEP-STATE TROLL

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Saturday, March 18, 2017 9:15 PM

THGRRI


That's funny, you have to have a country before you can start a government. I'm afraid this one is taken.

Quote:

Originally posted by DREAMTROVE:
Quote:

Originally posted by THGRRI:
Something for you to read sockpuppet/dreamtrove

Social Murder

corporate power is one of the strongest forces shaping our world. More than half of the top 100 economic entities today are private corporations. With their immense size comes commensurate influence, to the point where corporations are able to wreak social and environmental destruction with few serious consequences. Yet, amazingly, this subject is essentially absent from the study of economics.

http://arpbooks.org/books/detail/social-murder/

It's amazing you posted what you did without acknowledging the cuts to the EPA past and present. Cuts done at the behest of corporations. Too many here continually post without regard for the facts.

---------------------




That's more the spirit!

And something for you to read, Si Shen:

https://collateralmurder.wikileaks.org/

Here's another. If you want to understand liberal economic theory, I recommend GK Chesterton, Hillaire Belloc and FA Hayek. Belloc's Servile State is a good place to start. Basically starting in 1912 he forecasts the 20th century economics from the point of view of what will happen when the govt. gets involved.


ps. yes, i'm familiar with the EPA. My uncle works there. Has for many years. It's a captured agency. Meaning it's run by the oil companies. Corporations aren't perfect, sure. However, I can start one tomorrow. Watch what happens if you try to go out and start a government.

Govts. are mutli-trillion dollar entities, which got their money through violence. A corporation doesn't have any money we didn't willing give it, unless a govt. did. At that point, is it really a corporation and a govt, or has the merged entity become something else?



---------------------


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Sunday, March 19, 2017 2:13 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Quote:

So being a nation of laws instead of a "giant kleptocracy" explains why we have been destroying and exploiting nations for years and why the system that WE stand behind- the IMF, the World Bank, and Free Enterprise has created a situation where 8 people own more than the bottom 50% of the world, and we have the largest wealth gap .... ever? Oh, you mean THAT "nation of laws"??? Hmmm.... maybe there's something wrong with our laws, then, because they don't seem to be preventing kleptocracy very well.


Our military and capitalists hav been running amok from the beginning, here and abroad. A good reazon to elect candidates who arent assclownz.

Bush Jr. and hiz puppetmaster were all about helping their own oil interests. Remember that spase probe he canseld soon after taking offis?
http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2011-03/lost-satellite

But, even tho our gummit iznt doing a great job uv redusing the wealth gap, many other nationz are worse.

Vladimir Putin iz probably the richest man in the world and I'v read that Moscow haz the highest consentration uv billionairez. There are billionairez in dirt poor south America, China, Africa, India, Pakistan.

Hard to tell the differens between capitalizm and kleptomania.


----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

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Sunday, March 19, 2017 2:28 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Speaking uv assclownz vs DSCOVR:
https://qz.com/934141/donald-trump-wants-to-shut-off-dscovr-the-orbiti
ng-space-camera-that-monitors-climate-change
/

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.7532020.com

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Sunday, March 19, 2017 2:32 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. SECOND: I am so very sorry I libelled you by labelling you a Russian Troll. I apologize for this. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=64646&p=2


Trump is ludicrous about some things. Especially the environment. You won't hear any arguments from me on those issues!


You have some misconceptions about the world which a little internet-searching would easily dispel.

The highest number, in absolute terms, of billionaires is in the USA at 536 (according to Wikipedia). The NEXT highest number is in China, at 251, but since China has at about three times our population their per-capita is 1/6 of ours.

After that, Germany is tied with the UK, then India, then Russia at 77. (Since the Russian population is about 1/3 of ours you can calculate the per-capita yourself). The richest Russian man - according to Wikipedia - is Vladimir Potanin, NOT Vladimir Putin.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_the_number_of_billi
onaires


Russia's skewed wealth distribution looks to be a leftover from it's "shock treatment" by the Chicago School of Business. China ... well, China claims it's socialist but it's not. It's a long story.

Wealth inequality is measured by the GINI coefficient or GINI Index. The higher the index, the higher the inequality. It's difficult to get a GINI index especially since it changes year-by-year, but it can be used to approximately rank nations against each other. Slovenia, Norway, Belarus, and Denmark are low. The USA is in the middle of the pack but worse than Morocco, Turkey, and Vietnam and only slightly better than Russia. The Comoros, South Africa, and Namibia are the worst. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_income_equality







-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake

THUGR IS A DEEP-STATE TROLL

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Sunday, March 19, 2017 11:27 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. SECOND: I am so very sorry I libelled you by labelling you a Russian Troll. I apologize for this. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=64646&p=2


Although both rich and poor nations have more-equal GINIs, the poorest nations tend to have very unequal GINIs.


A high GINI index is a symptom of corruption. It develops when the wealthy have gained complete control of law, bureaucracy, and internal security to force an unequal wealth distribution. Overall, it is also a harbinger of economic deterioration, since vast inequality and corruption cause economic decline.




-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake

THUGR IS A DEEP-STATE TROLL

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Sunday, March 19, 2017 1:31 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. SECOND: I am so very sorry I libelled you by labelling you a Russian Troll. I apologize for this. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=64646&p=2


Maybe I'll add $0.02: Possibly it's not the absolute GINI coefficient that's indicative, but the direction it's going in (up or down).



-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake

THUGR IS A DEEP-STATE TROLL

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Sunday, March 19, 2017 2:43 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
You have some misconceptions about the world which a little internet-searching would easily dispel...The richest Russian man - according to Wikipedia - is Vladimir Potanin, NOT Vladimir Putin.



http://time.com/money/4641093/vladimir-putin-net-worth/

Next to impossible to pin down a number, but 'the peepl in the no' will immediately name Putin if asked hooz the richest.



----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

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Sunday, March 19, 2017 3:18 PM

6STRINGJOKER


You can keep posting Rachel J0, but know that nobody is actually watching any of the videos.

Got that same video info from anybody else?

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Sunday, March 19, 2017 3:23 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Interesting that the US and Russia have the same GINI, while India has a better GINI than both.




Originally posted by G:
I coined the slogan "We Suck!"© many years ago.

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Sunday, March 19, 2017 3:27 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


OK JO

Since you're on the stump, I have two questions for you -

1) what are you going to do about global warming, and
2) what are you going to do about the total (public and private) US debt?





Originally posted by G:
I coined the slogan "We Suck!"© many years ago.

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Sunday, March 19, 2017 3:57 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. SECOND: I am so very sorry I libelled you by labelling you a Russian Troll. I apologize for this. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=64646&p=2


Quote:

Next to impossible to pin down a number, but 'the peepl in the no' will immediately name Putin if asked hooz the richest. - JO
I thought you said you were all about being intelligent and using your imagination, and yet here you are, relying on proven liars for your info?



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Monday, March 20, 2017 6:55 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:

1) what are you going to do about global warming,



More subsidiez for solar and wind power, especially R&D. Then to bring CO2 levelz back down, develop wayz to take it out uv the atmosfere and turn it into useful products. Same with methane and other greenhouse gassez.

This iz tek we are going to need anyway wen we start teraforming planets.

Quote:

2) what are you going to do about the total (public and private) US debt?


I dont no enuf about it yet, but my jeneral idea that money making money needz to be restricted will be the basis uv all spesific planz.


----------------------------
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Monday, March 20, 2017 7:06 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Quote:

Originally posted by 6STRINGJOKER:
You can keep posting Rachel J0, but know that nobody is actually watching any of the videos.

Got that same video info from anybody else?



Sorry, no. She'z leading on this. You can get the basic info elsewhere, usually (unless its behind a pay wall), but you'd spend much more time than it takes her to repeat everything a dozen timez. Her team iz doing ALOT uv prep and assembly, so its worth your time.

You develop a tolerans for her eventually. The great thing about watching her show online iz that its about 50% shorter without the commercialz!

----------------------------
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Monday, March 20, 2017 7:19 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I thought you said you were all about being intelligent and using your imagination, and yet here you are, relying on proven liars for your info?



Unless you hav a crystal ball or GODz fone number, you are in the same boat az me - you get all your info from soursez that are not 100% onest andor correct.

The best any uv us can do (aside from being an insider on a story) iz to juj stuff on its internal lojik, then its relation to known facts, the motivz uv the subjects and soursez, and track record uv accurasy uv the soursez we hav.

A good stratejy that haz been lost by the entire rite wing iz to dump a sours after a fairly low number (rate) uv failurez. This iz how Fox and its ilk hav bekum so seksesful.

----------------------------
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http://www.7532020.com

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Monday, March 20, 2017 8:25 AM

6STRINGJOKER


Quote:

Originally posted by JO753:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6STRINGJOKER:
You can keep posting Rachel J0, but know that nobody is actually watching any of the videos.

Got that same video info from anybody else?



Sorry, no. She'z leading on this. You can get the basic info elsewhere, usually (unless its behind a pay wall), but you'd spend much more time than it takes her to repeat everything a dozen timez. Her team iz doing ALOT uv prep and assembly, so its worth your time.

You develop a tolerans for her eventually. The great thing about watching her show online iz that its about 50% shorter without the commercialz!



I haven't watched a commercial outside of the Superbowl in 10 years J0.

I just can't watch Rachel. She's in that special category of nails on a chalkboard for me that she shares only with Seth Meyers. I'd love to see them fight each other in some UFC exhibition match and knock those smug looks off each other's faces.

Too bad Celebrity Death Match isn't around anymore. That would be fun.

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Monday, March 20, 2017 11:23 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


You can watch Lawrens O'Donald and otherz, but he'z not doing an in depth prezentation.

Or just wait for the final tally. Or wait for the book! Not a bad idea, but its like missing the big story wen its happening. You get a nise tidy complete story, but its stale by then.

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Monday, March 20, 2017 11:28 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. SECOND: I am so very sorry I libelled you by labelling you a Russian Troll. I apologize for this. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=64646&p=2


Quote:

Next to impossible to pin down a number, but 'the peepl in the no' will immediately name Putin if asked hooz the richest. - JO
But JO, you're relying on "people in the know" ... which are WHO, exactly?

Our spooks? Our politicians? Our mainstream media? ... NONE of whom have a history of telling the truth? And all of whom seem to have in interest in demonizing Russia, Putin, and Trump?

On what evidence do they base this allegation? Bank records? Lifestyle? Confessions of people who have bribed Putin? Anyway, bring some EVIDENCE to the board and you'll be taken a lot more seriously.

=======

In the meantime, back to your platform!

Your idea of holding domestic vendors responsible for the pollution and exploitation by foreign manufacturers needs further explanation. Yes, I see how that might work logically, but I have a problem understanding how that would work in a practical sense.

For example, you seem to be counting on a somewhat simple link between vendors (here) and manufacturers (there) to be able to assign responsibility and then mandate higher wages or require improved pollution controls or better working conditions (or what-have-you) and then count on market forces to boost pay for workers outside of that industry.

But it seems to me that the only thing that would do is encourage companies to sub-contract even further, to split production into finer and finer layers to where responsibility is impossible to assign. The only companies that subcontracting might not work well for would be those that REQUIRE large technology-based production (you can't make chips and hard drives in your garage) maybe Foxconn (Apple's main producer) or Intel or Agilent. A limited number of industries. Even then, I can imagine them creating a legal fiction: separate companies between one operation and the other even while on the same campus or in the same building.

But the doodads and geegaws ... housewares, milk, sneakers, leather goods, toothpaste, clothes, farmed shrimp etc. ... can be made by small operations which can be sub-sub-sub contracted into invisibility.

And the fact that there would only be a limited number of jobs under our purview might create a rush (in China for example) to fill those positions, but would not spread to other industries because those conditions would not exist for the vast majority of manufacturers.

The problem is, it is in EVERY business-owner's interest to evade and avoid the regulations that you suggest, from Walmart down to the shrimp-farmer on his small paddy. You need a system that is self-sustaining. The level of investigation required to make it work, and be resistant to bribes, incompetence, lack of insight etc. by the investigators would be unsupportable. IMHO. Let me know what you think.

BTW, FWIW my experience with Chinese-made scientific instruments is that their quality control sucks.



-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake

THUGR IS A DEEP-STATE TROLL

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Monday, March 20, 2017 4:15 PM

THGRRI


Quote:

Originally posted by JO753:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I thought you said you were all about being intelligent and using your imagination, and yet here you are, relying on proven liars for your info?



Unless you hav a crystal ball or GODz fone number, you are in the same boat az me - you get all your info from soursez that are not 100% onest andor correct.

The best any uv us can do (aside from being an insider on a story) iz to juj stuff on its internal lojik, then its relation to known facts, the motivz uv the subjects and soursez, and track record uv accurasy uv the soursez we hav.

A good stratejy that haz been lost by the entire rite wing iz to dump a sours after a fairly low number (rate) uv failurez. This iz how Fox and its ilk hav bekum so seksesful.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.7532020.com



Liking your honesty JO 753, you got my vote.

---------------------

SIG says I'm a deep state troll.oh me, oh my.


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Monday, March 20, 2017 9:15 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. SECOND: I am so very sorry I libelled you by labelling you a Russian Troll. I apologize for this. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=64646&p=2


Quote:

When you ignore the importance of consumers in the equation you (and poor, sad! broken Kiki) only show your ignorance.-
Consumers flock to Walmart, despite the fact that it sells cheap Chinese junk and pays such poor wages that it directs its employees towards food stamps.

When you ignore the importance of reality in the equation, you (and poor moronic! THUGR) only show your ignorance.



-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake

THUGR IS A DEEP-STATE TROLL

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Monday, March 20, 2017 9:33 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. SECOND: I am so very sorry I libelled you by labelling you a Russian Troll. I apologize for this. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=64646&p=2


Quote:

Yes! And? Keep thinking... try closing the circle... you can do it. It might help if you think of yourself as Walmart.
Hint: it's not "despite" it's "because."

Which is exactly what I've been saying. See? Right here:
Quote:

The problem is, it is in EVERY business-owner's interest to evade and avoid the regulations that you suggest, from Walmart down to the shrimp-farmer on his small paddy.
So I'm glad you agree! Also, explains why JO's approach is doomed to fail.



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Tuesday, March 21, 2017 3:22 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. SECOND: I am so very sorry I libelled you by labelling you a Russian Troll. I apologize for this. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=64646&p=2


Anyway JO, unless there's something about your plan that I don't understand, this company-by-company regulatory approach - especially across borders- doesn't seem very feasible.



-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake

THUGR IS A DEEP-STATE TROLL

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Tuesday, March 21, 2017 6:52 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Thanks THGGRI. I got you and G on board now. Momentum iz bilding!

Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:But JO, you're relying on "people in the know" ... which are WHO, exactly?

Our spooks? Our politicians? Our mainstream media? ... NONE of whom have a history of telling the truth? And all of whom seem to have in interest in demonizing Russia, Putin, and Trump?



Dont need to galvanize zinc. Putin iz a demon, thus it iz not demonizing, it iz identifying.

Quote:

On what evidence do they base this allegation?






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Tuesday, March 21, 2017 7:44 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
In the meantime, back to your platform!

...But it seems to me that the only thing that would do is encourage companies to sub-contract even further, to split production into finer and finer layers to where responsibility is impossible to assign.



The influens we can hav on forin companyz iz mostly financial. We haf to make it more profitabl to play by the rulez.

It will alwayz be cheaper to cheat workerz in the short run. It will alwayz be tempting to dump polutants. It will alwayz seem expedient to bribe thoze who are suppoze to be monitoring you.

The goverment haz to make the penaltyz scary enuf to make it not worth the risk. It haz to hav a credible enforsment structure.

The way to do it iz to set up a new ajensy andor bolster existing ajensyz and then actually punish an offender. If the offending company survivez the punishment, for sure they will not offend agen and their competitorz will get the messaj also.

Quote:

...Even then, I can imagine them creating a legal fiction: separate companies between one operation and the other even while on the same campus or in the same building.


How woud that help them? If a midnite dump uv toxic waste iz found and trased to an iFone component factory, it duznt matter how many layerz uv subcontractorz there are - Apple gets a crippling bill. Then if it iz found that the workerz there were virtual slavez, suddenly there are a bunch uv rich peepl in a little Chineze villij. And if its determined that sumbudy at Apple wuz intentionally involved, its slammer time!

Quote:

And the fact that there would only be a limited number of jobs under our purview might create a rush (in China for example) to fill those positions, but would not spread to other industries because those conditions would not exist for the vast majority of manufacturers.


Incorrect. Money spredz wen its given to poor peepl. They buy stuff. They giv gifts to there family & frendz. A man who gets a job at the GM factory at 10x wut he wuz making befor duznt need hiz wife & kidz to work for rise anymore.

Quote:

...You need a system that is self-sustaining. The level of investigation required to make it work, and be resistant to bribes, incompetence, lack of insight etc. by the investigators would be unsupportable.


Like I sed befor, its not possibl to stop all the badness all the time.
But it iz possibl to reduse it. Even tho trade agreements arent popular, they can be uzed to get forin goverments to help weed out offenderz.

Quote:

my experience with Chinese-made scientific instruments is that their quality control sucks.


Therez still lots uv junk kuming out uv China, but they are following the same path az Japan - start out being the cheap alternativ to grab market share, then start thinking about quality. You can get good Chineze stuff, but its not much cheaper than the name brand stuff. Very often it iz the name brand stuff.

I hav several caliperz from China. Sum are OK, but obviously not on the level uv Starret or Brown & Sharp. I hav wun thats 16 yirz old that wuz only 16$ (a gift frum a frend) that still works perfectly - better than my Starrets! It duznt even hav a brand name on it. Gotta giv credit when its due, but to hoo?!


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Tuesday, March 21, 2017 7:58 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Quote:

Originally posted by G:
When you ignore the importance of consumers in the equation you (and poor, sad! broken Kiki) only show your ignorance.



That remindz me uv sumthing my brother sed about the constant Chineze bashing. (job stealing, currensy manipulating, product dumping, going to rek our economy) "They got dollarz that coud be worthless. I got lots uv stuff I can uze."

We'v been getting a free ride on the backs uv forin poor peepl forever. Thats being replased by a free ride on the backs uv tireless machinez.

The problem for us nonrich peeps iz that the rich are taking most uv the wealth being manufactured by the machinez - the money that woud hav gon to pay workerz.



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Wednesday, March 22, 2017 2:53 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Even if you cant stand Rachel Maddow you NEED to watch this wun:
(and soon, kuz they tend to only let theze stay up for a day or 2)
(Edited out the ded link)
Herez a direct link to MSNBC Maddow show clips:
http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow/watch/russian-paid-manafort-million
s-to-help-putin-influence-us-ap-904401987993?cid=eml_mra_20170323


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Wednesday, March 22, 2017 4:35 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


MSNBC also puts out a text version uv sum RM storyz.

This wun iz about Paul Manafort: http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/trumps-former-campaign-chair-w
orked-benefit-putins-government?cid=eml_mra_20170322


Aside frum providing another box uv nailz to drive into Trumps coffin, it givez you sum idea uv the money being poured into this campane.

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Wednesday, March 22, 2017 5:18 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Had an idea for a comic today, but I dont hav time to make it.

It woud be a side view uv a chess game in progress, showing the table its being played on, the playerz and 'otherz prezent'.

On the left, a doddering old Uncle Sam, hiz American Flag suit looking very shabby. He will look confuzed, and not paying much attention to the game.

On the rite, Vladimir Putin, looking not merely confident, but like he'z wondering how this can be so eazy. (getting this 'look' iz probably beyond my skill level)

In the back ground, sitting on the table are Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnel. It woud be their hedz on baby bodyz wearing diaperz. They are scribbling on paper with crayonz making a mess. Not only are they not paying any attention to the game, they dont even know how to play.

Further down the table will be more babyz playing. Maybe I coud work in sum ants on the ground at the sidez. Theyd be the Democrats, unable to reach the table.

Donald Trump will be the king on Uncle Sam'z side and all the other piesez will be hiz cabinet picks. The odd thing iz, they are the same color az the piesez on Putin'z side uv the board.

An examination uv the game will reveal that its nearly over.

Maybe I woud hav made it 2 panelz. In the 2nd, Putin woud be saying "Checkmate" and the babyz woud be crying "Not fair!" "Chess? Wuts that?" "I thot we were playing checkerz!" and other such lameness. The point iz that by the time any action iz taken to stop Trump, the game may be over, comrad!

Anybody want to do sum drawing? Youre free to take this idea and run with it!

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Thursday, March 23, 2017 7:47 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


You only need to watch 23 minits uv this kuz the rest iz just replaying the same thing from the beginning.
(edited out the ded youtube link)

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Thursday, March 23, 2017 8:05 AM

6STRINGJOKER


Good idea J0. My only suggestion is when you're using the whole "everyone is Putin's color" on the chess board, you really should find a way to work race into the joke too. Probably something about how there are no black people or Muslims in Moscow. Seems a shame to waste such an obvious opportunity...

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Thursday, March 23, 2017 1:11 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Great idea! Putin coud be drinking a Black Russian!

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Thursday, March 23, 2017 3:39 PM

DREAMTROVE


Quote:

Originally posted by 6STRINGJOKER:
Good idea J0. My only suggestion is when you're using the whole "everyone is Putin's color" on the chess board, you really should find a way to work race into the joke too. Probably something about how there are no black people or Muslims in Moscow. Seems a shame to waste such an obvious opportunity...


6,

There are a lot of muslims in moscow, about 20% of the population. It's been that way since the tsar. A large portion of the of southern russia was conquered by the ottomans in the middle ages, and then taken back by the tsar, who then took a large slice of central asia as well, giving russia 1/2 of europe's muslim population. The only blacks would be american fellow traveler defectors.

Jo, I so can't stand rachael maddow that i have trouble watching, but the video doesn't come up anyway. text link?

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Thursday, March 23, 2017 4:59 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Sorry about that, Dreamtrove.

I hav found that you can read the crawl at the bottom wen she'z repeating to help make it less excruciating.

They put the Youtubez up for a day or 2, then delete them. So, I wont waste the spase here anymore. Insted herez a link to MSNBC starting with the Manafort part uv the story:
http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow/watch/russian-paid-manafort-million
s-to-help-putin-influence-us-ap-904401987993?cid=eml_mra_20170323


They FINALLY got their act together on showing video! (took them yirz, goramit!) you can just let it go to the next clip wich appearz to be in sequens with the next segment uv the show.

----------------------------
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Saturday, March 25, 2017 6:27 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


More Maddow madness.

http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow/watch/a-dire-period-of-scandal-for-
trump-in-turmoil-906180163647?cid=eml_mra_20170325


More JO investment advice: Any handcuff company. The FBI will be stocking up for the big Trump administration roundup. Its not going to be a mere perp wok, its going to be a perp parade!

----------------------------
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Monday, March 27, 2017 4:59 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


The enemy: https://www.reddit.com/r/The_Donald/

This iz wut you get wen you pump liez and propaganda into the public for decadez. Kidz growing up in a world where facts and lojik are a matter uv opinion.

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Monday, March 27, 2017 5:34 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Therez a serious danjer here.

Wen The Donald fantasy bubble gets popped, how are theze rabid idiots going to react? The last big fantasy bubble pop wuz real estate/Wall Street. Rekt the world economy. Left us teetering on the ej uv the biggest depression in American history.

With sumwhere between 1/3 & 1/2 the country living in the Trump alternate reality there are going to be riots, roving bandz uv armed vandalz, assassinationz, etc. everywhere.

It wont matter how complete and damming the case agenst him iz or how well prezented. Even if Fox newz and all the other GoP propaganda outlets tell the truth for a chanje, theze wakkoz will be on fire.

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Monday, March 27, 2017 9:24 AM

6STRINGJOKER


In my less than 40 years on this planet it's only been Democrats that burn shit down en masse in this country. When Republicans have something to bitch about usually it's one lone nutter with a gun in a belfry.

If what you predict actually happens, you're probably looking at a 2nd civil war.

I won't hold my breath on your crystal ball though. If I had any money in the stock market and followed your financial advice I would have lost out on a ton of money and the 10% fee.

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Monday, March 27, 2017 12:00 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them. SECOND: I am so very sorry I libelled you by labelling you a Russian Troll. I apologize for this. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=64646&p=2


Quote:

Therez a serious danjer here.

Wen The Donald fantasy bubble gets popped, how are theze rabid idiots going to react?

JO, the only "rabid idiots" I see around here are you and the rest of the "rabid idiot" liberals. I could go on and on with examples about how rabid YOU are ... including this very pejorative statement about the rest of your fellow Americans, but all you need to do is check back with what you, SECOND, G, KPO, and especially SHINYSTUPIDGUY (who just wants to see "traitors" swinging at the end of a rope) have posted to see a REAL fantasy bubble.

Quote:

The last big fantasy bubble pop wuz real estate/Wall Street. Rekt the world economy. Left us teetering on the ej uv the biggest depression in American history.
Another financial crisis is baked in the cake, and it was caused by the Central Banks racking up too much debt and printing too much money trying to save an imploding system with more of the same strategy that caused it to implode in the first place (more debt sunk into more speculation).

Quote:

With sumwhere between 1/3 & 1/2 the country living in the Trump liberal alternate reality there are going to be riots, roving bandz uv armed vandalz, assassinationz, etc. everywhere.
More rabid idiocy. So far, most of the violence has been cause by ... ahem ... liberals.

Quote:

It wont matter how complete and damming pathetic and pointless the case agenst him iz or how well poorly prezented. Even if Fox newz and all the other GoP CNN and NYT and Rachel Madcow propaganda outlets tell the truth for a chanje, theze [liberal] wakkoz will be on fire stay propagandized
Fixed it for you.

See? Shoe is on the other foot, and you can't REASONABLY claim that what I posted is wrong. Can you agree that there is idiocy on the liberal side as well? Or are you exclusively claiming the intellectual/ moral high ground?



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"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake

THUGR IS A DEEP-STATE TROLL

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Monday, March 27, 2017 12:11 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Do either uv you ever bother to look at the stuff linked to?

About the stock market - I see its been going down a little lately. Coud that be a sine that its about to crash?

They charj 10% wen you sell?!

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DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

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