REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Santorum Just Can't Stop Lying

POSTED BY: KWICKO
UPDATED: Wednesday, April 4, 2012 14:29
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Tuesday, April 3, 2012 5:46 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

On the stump in Wisconsin on April 2, 2012, the Republican presidential candidate filled in his audience on something he was "just reading … last night."

"I think it’s seven or eight of the California system of universities don’t even teach an American history course. It’s not even available to be taught," he said. "Just to tell you how bad it's gotten in this country, where we're trying to disconnect the American people from the roots of who we are, so they have an understanding of what America should be."




http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2012/apr/03/rick-sa
ntorum/rick-santorum-says-american-history-not-available
-/

Quote:

California has a two-tiered university system, with 23 campuses in the California State University system and 10 University of California campuses.

All 23 CSU campuses offer courses on U.S. History, the Constitution and American ideals, said Erik Fallis, media relations manager for the California State University — indeed, almost every student needs such a class (or two) to graduate.

The story is slightly different at the University of California, which also has an American history and institutions requirement. The graduation requirement can be satisfied with a high school class, except at UC Santa Barbara, which requires a college-level course.

Does that mean the campuses don’t offer American history courses? Not at all.

Of the nine University of California campuses that offer humanities classes — the San Francisco campus focuses exclusively on health sciences — all nine offer American history.

Do those classes get to "the roots of who we are," as Santorum said?

Well, among the offerings at UC Davis is "The American Revolution, 1763-1790." UC Riverside teaches upper-division courses on "Revolutionary America" and "The Early Republic: The United States, 1789-1848." UC Santa Cruz includes a course on the "U.S. Revolution: 1740-1815." UC Berkeley addresses, "The United States from Settlement to Civil War." UCLA has "History of the U.S. and Its Colonial Origins: 19th Century" and "Constitutional History of U.S.: Origins and Development of Constitutionalism in U.S."

Bottom line, of 33 state universities in California, just one, a health sciences campus, doesn’t teach American history — and nearly all graduates have to complete a related course to graduate, whether in high school or college.

What was Santorum talking about?

Santorum’s reading

We contacted Santorum’s campaign to ask for support for his claim but didn’t hear back.

So we tried tracing his reading material ourselves.

Eric Dolan, an editor for progressive news site Raw Story, noted that Santorum appeared to be making a reference to a recent opinion piece in the Wall Street Journal, "How California's Colleges Indoctrinate Students."

The March 30, 2012, column by Hoover Institution fellow Peter Berkowitz argues that higher education is politicized and declining in quality as its curriculum changes.

He notes: "None of the nine general campuses in the UC system requires students to study the history and institutions of the United States. None requires students to study Western civilization, and on seven of the nine UC campuses, including Berkeley, a survey course in Western civilization is not even offered."

Berkowitz is right that most University of California campuses don’t require a college-level course, with the exception of Santa Barbara — though they do require at least a high-school level class.

We didn’t check on class offerings in Western civilization, since that’s not what Santorum said.

Berkowitz also cites a recent report, called "A Crisis of Competence," from the National Association of Scholars, where he’s on the board of directors. It mentions that "the vast majority of our colleges have made a course on the broad themes of U.S. history or government optional."

Then it points out a laudable exception: The California State University system.

"All but three of the more than twenty campuses of the CSU system require American History and Institutions as an essential part of their curricula. But the situation in UC is very different: not a single UC campus has such a requirement. … To be sure, UC requires a year of U.S. history in high school for undergraduate admissions, but University of California level instruction ought to be on a completely different level – why otherwise would students need to go on to a university at all if high school coursework is equivalent?"

Santorum went much further than either Berkowitz or the National Association of Scholars report, declaring that at seven or eight universities in the California system, they "don’t even teach an American history course."

There’s simply no support for that claim.

Our ruling

Rick Santorum said, "I think it’s seven or eight of the California system of universities don’t even teach an American history course. It’s not even available to be taught." While he appeared to be referencing a recent Wall Street Journal opinion piece, he bungled the details — and badly. Far from "not available," American history courses are offered at all but one of 33 state universities in California. We rate his statement False.



Rating it False is being charitable to Frothy.


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Tuesday, April 3, 2012 5:56 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Gee, what a surprise! Ever since the Netherlands thing, I have absolutely no expectation that anything out of Romney's mouth will EVER be the truth. Makes it easier that way.

When his mouthpiece was asked about that Netherlands bullshit, she kept saying something along the lines of "Mitt is very serious about right to life", or something similar. She never ONCE addressed the reporter asking the questions about the fact that every fucking word out of Romney's mouth on the matter was a bald-faced lie.

Well, smile, he's Mitt...

(and hey, they BUY it...I will never forget the gasps and sounds of shock and disgust as he spun his little Netherlands fantasy, and I wonder how many of the people in that audience still believe it's the truth? I guess whatever works...)



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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 1:36 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



Of course, it's " lying " when a Republican is wrong. It's " misspeaking " when a Democrat does it.

Got it.




Point of fact, Obama lied multiple times the other day, when he made his bizarre comment on the USSC and the ruling on ObamaCare.

He said there's no precedent for the USSC over turning a law of Congress. It actually happens all the time.

He said Obama Care passed with a " strong majority ". No, it didn't. It passed the House by only 7 votes.

And the fact is, it doesn't matter if the laws passed 435 and 100 to zero! If the courts rule a law unconstitutional, then guess what? It is !



" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

"The world is a dangerous place. Not because of the people who are evil; but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein


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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 1:56 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


The Supreme Court has not struck down the central provision of a landmark federal statute since the 30's. So the court doing so now would be against eighty years of precedent.



I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 2:05 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:
The Supreme Court has not struck down the central provision of a landmark federal statute since the 30's. So the court doing so now would be against eighty years of precedent.




That's not what first Obama said. He said strike down a law which was passed with a strong majority.

The court has struck down many laws.

There was no 'strong majority' in O-Care's passing, and it's immaterial on how wide or narrow that the vote even was.

But I guess the lesson here is, if you don't want the USSC to strike down a " central provision in a landmark federal statute" , then don't use every arm twisting , dirty back door deal in the book to ram one through, against the will of the people's wishes in the first place !

* Note to everyone* - Do not believe Anthony. He does not know what he thinks he knows on matters concerning of what I think or believe.


" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

"The world is a dangerous place. Not because of the people who are evil; but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein


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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 2:27 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


If "strong majority" does not matter why bring it up? Of course the law did pass with 60 votes in the Senate.

Yes, the court has overturned federal laws in the last eighty years, but not large pieces of legislation such as this.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 2:41 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:
If "strong majority" does not matter why bring it up? Of course the law did pass with 60 votes in the Senate.



Ask Obama why he brought it up.

And it only passed by 12 votes , out of 435 , in the House.

Quote:



Yes, the court has overturned federal laws in the last eighty years, but not large pieces of legislation such as this.



The size of the law is immaterial. That's not ( or should not ) be a concern for the court. Regardless of Obama's heavy handed intervention and attempt to influence the courts decision, it should still rule on the merits and the RULE OF LAW, not to the myopic appeals of one egocentric President.

* Note to everyone* - Do not believe Anthony. He does not know what he thinks he knows on matters concerning of what I think or believe.


" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

"The world is a dangerous place. Not because of the people who are evil; but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein


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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 5:15 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
The size of the law is immaterial. That's not ( or should not ) be a concern for the court. Regardless of Obama's heavy handed intervention and attempt to influence the courts decision, it should still rule on the merits and the RULE OF LAW, not to the myopic appeals of one egocentric President.



It is not immaterial, and yes the court will judge it on the rule of law. That being said it would still go agaist modern precidence if the court struck it down.

Having trouble understanding words again I see.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 5:45 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


As usual, Rappy has nothing of substance to offer on the subject of the thread.

SOP for the GOP.

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 6:45 AM

STORYMARK


Yep, good ol' Rappy. A Republican is caught in a bald-faced lie - and it's all about Obamacare.

I think Rappy and Frothy get their "facts" from the same source - their asses.

Spoon!

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 6:53 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello Mike,

It may be a lie, but it's a truthy lie. It's filled with Truthiness. I bet almost everyone he spoke this lie to could feel the truthiness of it as they listened to his words. It has a slight peppermint aroma.

Universities hate America. Damn Liberal Intellectual Elite. Of COURSE there's no courses on U.S. History. And even if there are, it doesn't FEEL like there are.

Not to the true believers.

--Anthony



_______________________________________________

Note to self: Mr. Raptor believes that women who want to control their reproductive processes are sluts.

Reference thread: http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=18&t=51196

Never forget what this man is. You keep forgiving him his trespasses and speak to him as though he is a reasonable human being. You keep forgetting the things he's advocated. If you respond to this man again, you are being foolish.

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 6:55 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by AnthonyT:
Hello Mike,

It may be a lie, but it's a truthy lie. It's filled with Truthiness. I bet almost everyone he spoke this lie to could feel the truthiness of it as they listened to his words. It has a slight peppermint aroma.

Universities hate America. Damn Liberal Intellectual Elite. Of COURSE there's no courses on U.S. History. And even if there are, it doesn't FEEL like there are.

Not to the true believers.

--Anthony



_______________________________________________



Sadly, you are 100% correct.

Spoon!

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 7:02 AM

KPO

"Love is natural and real. But not for you my love. Not tonight my love..."


"Do you know you have more nerve endings in your gut than you have in your head? You can look it up. Now, I know some of you are going to say, "I did look it up, and that's not true." That's 'cause you looked it up in a book. Next time, look it up in your gut. I did. My gut tells me that's how our nervous system works."



It's not personal. It's just war.

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 7:41 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:

Originally posted by AnthonyT:
It has a slight peppermint aroma.


You need your sinuses checked, cause I'm detecting a rather bovine whiff comin offa that, myself.

-F

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 7:53 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


So funny. First
Quote:

He said there's no precedent for the USSC over turning a law of Congress.
Apparently there is precedent, if you go back to 1930. Then
Quote:

He said Obama Care passed with a " strong majority "
Then ONE POST later, he claims
Quote:

That's not what first Obama said. He said strike down a law which was passed with a strong majority.
Which is it?

The "strong majority" thing IS pertinent...given 51 should pass a law, Republicans have stonewalled about ANYTHING less than 60, just GETTING to 60 represents a strong majority. As to back-door deals, etc., that kind of idiocy goes on in both parties and we all damned well know it. If Republicans still remembered the word "compromise", perhaps Congress could get SOMETHING done, instead of taking home paychecks for doing nothing but stymieing everything.

Anthony, yer cute. And you get the prize for the first giggle of the morning. "Truthiness"...hee, hee, hee! KPO nailed it.

Politicians spin, shade and lie. But the speech Santorum made on euthenasia in the Netherlands canNOT be defended or called misspeaking or anything else. Every single word out of his mouth was a flat-out, bald-faced lie. His lie about history being taught in California universities is an equally flat-out lie.

One can point to any number of claims, spins, lies, etc., made by any and every politician, but to come back on Obama's exaggerations and spins in respose to Santorum's GIGANTIC lie about the Netherlands is incredibly weak. Even his spokesperson's only response to being asked about the lies was absurd:
Quote:

Unable to defend those lies, she just kept repeating that Santorum is a “strong pro-life person” and that he believes those lies “in his heart.” http://freethoughtblogs.com/dispatches/2012/03/15/santorum-tells-lies-
in-his-heart/
a lie "in your heart" means it's not a lie?!?! Give me a BREAK!! Oh, and it wasn't just one...he made numerous claims about it, each of which was a flat-out lie.
Just two months ago:
Quote:

“Well, the president supported partial-birth abortion, and partial-birth abortion is a procedure used almost exclusively to kill children late in pregnancy when they've been found out to be disabled.” While he was promoting the Partial-Birth Abortion Ban Act in the U.S. Senate, Santorum said exactly the opposite. He said partial-birth abortion was used almost exclusively to kill children who weren’t disabled. And he said anyone who implied otherwise was a liar. (In 1996) Santorum converted this into a national statistic, telling his colleagues that partial-birth abortion “is performed in this country thousands of times and in many, many cases, as I quoted yesterday from the doctors in the Bergen County Record, in most cases on healthy babies, healthy pregnancies, and healthy women who had no problem with their pregnancy but was purely elective.” http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/human_nature/2012/02/
rick_santorum_s_partial_birth_abortion_lie_did_obama_target_the_disabled_.html
or the other is a lie, no matter how you cut it.
Quote:

Senator Santorum on Meet The Press 2/26/12 claims he never voted for a bailout of the steel industry. Rather he asserts that what he voted for was to enforce tariffs on China. The problem is Mr. Santorum just flat out lied. The word “tariff” does not even appear in the bill - not once. This legislation provided for up to $1 billion in loan guarantees to steel companies. It is by definition a government bailout of the steel industry. Therefore Senator Santorum flat out lied to the American people in his appearance on Meet The Press. http://www.justin.fm/2012/02/senator-santorum-flat-out-lies-about.html
#!/2012/02/senator-santorum-flat-out-lies-about.html
]



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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 8:43 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by AnthonyT:
Hello Mike,

It may be a lie, but it's a truthy lie. It's filled with Truthiness. I bet almost everyone he spoke this lie to could feel the truthiness of it as they listened to his words. It has a slight peppermint aroma.

Universities hate America. Damn Liberal Intellectual Elite. Of COURSE there's no courses on U.S. History. And even if there are, it doesn't FEEL like there are.

Not to the true believers.

--Anthony



_______________________________________________

Note to self: Mr. Raptor believes that women who want to control their reproductive processes are sluts.

Reference thread: http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=18&t=51196

Never forget what this man is. You keep forgiving him his trespasses and speak to him as though he is a reasonable human being. You keep forgetting the things he's advocated. If you respond to this man again, you are being foolish.




That's another one of those things that cracks me up about Santorum and the GOP: these are people who keep trying to tell you that universities are evil, and anyone who thinks their kids should go to college is a "snob". But these are also guys who already have their college degrees, and who DESPERATELY want their own children to get a college education - preferably at one of those "Ivory League"* schools.

Meanwhile, they'll keep on telling you how evil those schools are, and how you shouldn't even think about sending your kids there.

*(Yes, I just made that up; they like to snidely refer to "ivory towers" and ivy-league schools, so let's combine 'em into one slur!)

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 1:19 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

And it only passed by 12 votes , out of 435 , in the House.




Quote:

Posted by Rappy:

He said Obama Care passed with a " strong majority ". No, it didn't. It passed the House by only 7 votes.



You're lying in at least one instance here. Was it 7, or was it 12? Can't be both.

If Obama's lying, then you're lying.

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 2:13 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Yep, good ol' Rappy. A Republican is caught in a bald-faced lie - and it's all about Obamacare.



You and Kwickie are petty, and wrong. Per usual.

Quote:

the House by only 7 votes.


You're lying in at least one instance here. Was it 7, or was it 12? Can't be both.

If Obama's lying, then you're lying.



It was only 7 votes. I got 212 votes by the GOP and Dems who voted against it confused w/ just 12 votes. It was an honest mistake. Obama, he's lying.



* Note to everyone* - Do not believe Anthony. He does not know what he thinks he knows on matters concerning of what I think or believe.


" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

"The world is a dangerous place. Not because of the people who are evil; but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 2:18 PM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Yep, good ol' Rappy. A Republican is caught in a bald-faced lie - and it's all about Obamacare.



You and Kwickie are petty, and wrong. Per usual.



* Note to everyone* - Do not believe Anthony. He does not know what he thinks he knows on matters concerning of what I think or believe.


" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

"The world is a dangerous place. Not because of the people who are evil; but because of the people who don't do anything about it." - Albert Einstein




Well, if YOU say so, it must be true. In RappyLand if nowhere else.

God, you're a riot. Do you even read your own posts? You went to Obamacare RIGHT-A-FUCKING WAY.

You didn't even address the topic of this thread - you, the douchenozzle who whines about people ignoring the topic if they say something about anything else in a thread.

Priceless.

*Note to everyone*: Anthony is spot-on. Pay no heed to Rappy's pleas for pity.

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 2:28 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

It was only 7 votes. I got 212 votes by the GOP and Dems who voted against it confused w/ just 12 votes. It was an honest mistake.




So are you apologizing? That would be a first for you.

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Wednesday, April 4, 2012 2:29 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:

Well, if YOU say so, it must be true. In RappyLand if nowhere else.

God, you're a riot. Do you even read your own posts? You went to Obamacare RIGHT-A-FUCKING WAY.

You didn't even address the topic of this thread - you, the douchenozzle who whines about people ignoring the topic if they say something about anything else in a thread.

Priceless.

*Note to everyone*: Anthony is spot-on. Pay no heed to Rappy's pleas for pity.




Exactly.

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