REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Maybe if she was armed......?

POSTED BY: 6IXSTRINGJACK
UPDATED: Saturday, May 24, 2008 23:44
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 2811
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Friday, May 2, 2008 9:56 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080502/ap_on_re_us/student_death

Frem ought to have something to say about this. This happened very close to home for me.

"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack

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Saturday, May 3, 2008 2:38 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


The dispatcher hung up after receiving no answer and then answered another 911 call that was waiting, he said.

The dispatcher failed to call the number back as required under the department's policy , Norwick said.

Norwick said he was investigating the incident and reviewing whether policies should be changed and employees should be disciplined. But he also said, "I don't think there's anything to apologize for at this time."





It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Saturday, May 3, 2008 4:20 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Said it all before.

You got TWO hands, and if you ain't holding the cellphone in your off hand, and then you ain't safe.
http://www.a-human-right.com/ s_beready.jpg
(Link spaced)

Image courtesy of Oleg Volk, a good friend who owns the site it came from.
http://www.a-human-right.com/

Stay Alive, till help arrives.

If you have a fire extinguisher and smoke detector, and understand why you have them...
Then you SHOULD damn well understand the need for a security system and a firearm, the principle is utterly NO different at the root of it.

Oh, and fuck your trigger locks, put one on a fire extinguisher and ask the local fire marshal if he thinks that's a good idea.

Weapon safety is a MENTAL process, not a physical one.

Also, we're seeing a rather substantial upswing in middle of the night home invaders dressing as or claiming to be police - an incident occured on 4/28/08 in Texas (spotted while looking something else up) but all references to it in both papers have suddenly disappeared.

Do NOT ground arms until you have confirmed with the 911 dispatcher that the people in front of you are actually police officers.

Yes, if they are cops they might try to kill you for not bending the knee - but if they're not, they WILL kill you as soon as you ground arms.

I countered that problem by getting to know my local cops, if they've got a warrant, they can do me the favor of knocking on the door at a decent hour, cause any crash-n-bash action on my place at some unholy hour of the morning is going to meet a hail of lead not seen since the trenches of WWI.*

-Frem
*If you don't 'get' that, find out what a Winchester M97 is.

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Saturday, May 3, 2008 5:26 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Norwick said he was investigating the incident and reviewing whether policies should be changed and employees should be disciplined. But he also said, "I don't think there's anything to apologize for at this time."


That's the sound of someone about to lose his job...

In all honesty, I hope he's only saying what his lawyer told him to say. I'd hate to think anything that crass would have come out of his mouth all on its own in this situation.



Mike

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence[sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions

I can't help the sinking feeling that my country is now being run by people who read "1984" not as a cautionary tale, but rather as an instruction manual. - Michael Mock

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Saturday, May 3, 2008 8:26 AM

STARTROOP


The Winchester is a good choice. My customized Remington 870 is also on the short list. A sentimental favorite is my Rossi double barreled coach gun ;-)

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Saturday, May 3, 2008 10:49 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


This kind of crime - murder by a stranger - really sticks out in people's minds. And b/c of that we tend to think it's a larger risk than it is, and propose solutions that are even risker.

That kind of mental hiccough is very common. For example, people worry far more about air travel, which has a 2 in 1 billion person-mile fatality risk, than about automobile travel which has a 1 in 100 million person-mile fatality risk, about 5x higher. The reason why we do this is because: 1) in an automobile we have a sense of control, however tenuous or imaginary and 2) car travel is a familiar everyday occurrence. So perception of risk in not necessarily connected to factual risk, other factors keep us from accurately perceiving real risk levels.

To get back to murder, and guns, the most recent complete uniform crime statistics that match up with CDC life tables are from 2004.
Of the total 14,121 murders, 6060 are known to the victim, 1827 are strangers, and 6234 are unsolved. (That's a solution rate of only 55%.) Of the solved cases, you are 3.3x more likely to be killed by someone you know - generally an acquaintance - than by a stranger.
So, what's the solution to stranger-murder risk, the one that everyone is focused on ? Carry guns to work ? To bars ? To the grocery store ? Keep guns stashed all around the house ? Have everyone (though one presumes not below a certain age) carry at all times - even in bed ?
In the 2004 CDC tables there were 16,750 gun suicides and 649 accidental gun deaths, in addition to the 9,326 gun murders. But these 26,725 gun deaths, by some rationale, are acceptable because guns might have prevented some of the 1827 murders by strangers.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aviation_safety
http://www.stevekrause.org/steve_krause_blog/2007/01/cmus_trafficsta.h
tml

http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius_04/documents/CIUS_2004_Section2.pdf
http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius_04/offenses_reported/violent_crime/murder.
html#table2_9

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr55/nvsr55_19.pdf


***************************************************************
"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."

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Saturday, May 3, 2008 2:19 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by rue:
Of the total 14,121 murders, 6060 are known to the victim, 1827 are strangers, and 6234 are unsolved. (That's a solution rate of only 55%.) Of the solved cases, you are 3.3x more likely to be killed by someone you know - generally an acquaintance - than by a stranger.... But this, by some rationale, is acceptable because guns might prevent some of the 1827 stranger-murders.



Couple of invalid assumptions in your "...might prevent some of the 1827 stranger-murders." scenario.

First, that the 6234 unsovlved murders are all acquaintances, not strangers. not very likely.

Second, that the 6060 murders by acquaintances could not have been foiled by victims who were armed and able to defend themselves.

Also, this doesn't count all the possible - but not successful - murders (and other crimes) which were thwarted by armed victims. Estimates of armed prevention of crime overall run about 2.5 million a year.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Saturday, May 3, 2008 5:20 PM

REAVERMAN


Meh, there are idiots in every bunch. Even police dispachers, apparently. Fire the fool and move on.

----------------------------
"O' course, ya couldn't buy an invite with a diamond the size of a testicle, but luckily I got my hands on a couple." -Badger

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Saturday, May 3, 2008 6:02 PM

FREMDFIRMA


I will accept your supposition on only one condition Rue.

Remove every smoke detector and fire extinguisher from your home, and the spare from every vehicle you own.

Since, you know, statistically you're not likely to have a fire, or a flat, and thus do not truly need these items - in fact the extra weight makes your car unsafe and consumes more fuel.

That is the kind of argument you are making here, and it does not fly.

Nor do the CDC's statistics or Brady's until the day when they stop filing shot-dead criminals gunned down in the act as "victims of gun violence".

AND the rather obnoxious presumption that I would NOT shoot someone I knew who became a physical threat to my person is insulting.

Of *course* many of those murders the victim knew the assailant - just how many women every year are gunned down on the courthouse steps every year with a useless fucking piece of paper in their pocket instead of a pistol.

I would utterly, absolutely blow away someone I knew if it came to a point where I believed they were an imminent threat to my life, and I believe that most sensible folk would do the same.

To say that a weapon in hand would not serve in preventing a murder by someone you knew is about as asinine a thing as I have ever heard.

Besides, what care YOU for the law, when it's not in your favor ?

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Saturday, May 3, 2008 6:48 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Or, as my Dad used to say,

"Better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it."

I'd note that "suicide by gun" stats included in your totals tend to focus more on the "gun" than the "suicide" part. If someone's determined to kill themselves, I rather doubt they're going to postpone their plans simply because they don't have a gun.


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Sunday, May 4, 2008 9:18 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Last I checked, the Dane County 911 center was not manned by Police Officers. They set up the systme like Philly, where the dispatchers refused to send help during a murder because none of the 16 citizens who called in could provide a street address for the Church where the murder was occurring. The dispatchers are not Police.
Norwich has been in the job about 10 months. Surely he has been getting praise for reducing staffing at 911, and reducing costs. Becuase, of course, the number one function of a 911 center is to reduce costs.

From 1900 until 1984, the murder rate for Dane County was 1 murder per 21 years, average. This includes all of Madison. In the last 10 months, the UNSOLVED Murders in Madison are 5.

Norwich has been trying the blame the Madison Police Dept for all his excuses iin this case, and why he keeps lying about why and when his staff failed in their duties. He claims the Police told him not to discuss the failures, and the Police strongly disagree with his excuses - they have not told him to not discuss it.

I wouldn't hold out hope that he'll get fired - Madison prides itself on being disfunctional and "tolerant".

When you hit your target, that is the meaning of gun control.

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Monday, May 5, 2008 1:31 AM

PIRATECAT


Dito Geezer, Today with our society being so affluent that criminals are your druggies with nothing to lose. If your poor you can get a job. So when a crime of burglary is comitted we have a murder too. That Redskin player down in Miami last year. Dog would be a good first alert. They do like to lick their beans on your couch though. And a good firearm that you are comfortable shooting with. Here is a nice pic of the Madison Wisconsin Public Safety Communications Director Lard Ass Himself Joe Norwick-


"Battle of Serenity, Mal. Besides Zoe here, how many-" "I'm talkin at you! How many men in your platoon came out of their alive".

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Monday, May 5, 2008 5:49 AM

THATWEIRDGIRL


I've always been told by police and emergency personnel that you call 911 no matter what. Whether you're free to talk or not. The call will be logged and someone will be dispatched to make sure you're okay.

Right?

That's what you do. If you talk you, the intruder might be able to identify your location and hurt you.




---
Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, "Where have I gone wrong?" Then a voice says to me, "This is going to take more than one night."
-- Charlie Brown
www.thatcostumegirl.com
www.thatweirdgirl.com

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Monday, May 5, 2008 5:49 AM

THATWEIRDGIRL


Double post.



---
Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, "Where have I gone wrong?" Then a voice says to me, "This is going to take more than one night."
-- Charlie Brown
www.thatcostumegirl.com
www.thatweirdgirl.com

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Monday, May 5, 2008 3:30 PM

ALLIETHORN7


Meh
I've never been one to see the actual point to having a gun- though I'll be the first to tell ya you got the right to have it. Still... this is negligence on the part of the officer, and no mistake. What happened to where every call needed to be looked into, no matter what? Because, by my way of thinking, there's a fair to middlin' chance that the person is a bit... occupied, as it were.
Meh

-Danny

Late night, Brakes lock,
Hear the tires squeal,
Red light, can't stop, so I spin the wheel,
My world goes Black before I
Feel an Angel lift me up,
And I open Bloodshot eyes,
Into fluorescent White,
Flip the Siren, Hit the Lights,
Close the doors and I am Gone

The Band of the week is... Thrice

Gott weiß ich will kein Engel sein.
http://www.myspace.com/otherrandomdude

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Monday, May 5, 2008 4:08 PM

FREMDFIRMA


TWG - that is how it is supposed to work, but depending on your locality, available resources and how the call is prioritized, you might not get that visit for up to three hours.

I should know, I had a situation where I was being actively fired upon by some punk nitwit with a .22 rifle in Baltimore (21225) and it went just about like this...

The first round came through the 2nd floor window at an angle, missed my head by about four inches, smacked into the wall, richocheted into the ceiling and spun to a stop smack dab between the pages of the book I was reading, whereupon I screamed TAKE COVER and hit the deck, grabbing the phone en route to the floor and dialing 911.

Dispatcher wanted me to pop up and get a visual on the shooter, and I told her that I wasn't gonna do that, cause stickin my head up in the window the bastard was aiming at was a damn fool thing to do, and get someone over here NOW.

We went back and forth for almost twenty minutes before she hung up on me, and it was nearly fourty five before the punk gave up, having lobbed about fifty shots and only sending two through the window.

About ninety minutes after the first shot was fired, the cops finally showed up at the front door, no lights, no siren, and not even a cursory sweep of the area the shooter was firing from, took a report and the spent bullet as evidence, and seemed utterly uninterested in pursuing it - in fact I found the bullet laying by the sidewalk the next day, the officer in question having obviously just pitched it on his way to back to the cruiser.

Since it was a brick building, and at medium-long range for the type of weapon fired, other than the window no real damage was done, but a ninety minute response to someone actively under fire was in my opinion pretty unacceptable.

So while I would count on the response, I would never count on it in time to do any good.

And yes, I was armed but there seemed little point to engage a ground floor shooter popping puny little .22LR's at a brick building second floor, who could not hit me direct while I was on the floor and even a ricochet would barely leave a bruise - and to pop up in the window he was aiming at and attempt to blind fire into the dark in a densely populated area would have been just downright idiotic, not to mention negligent and dangerous.


Couple items of note, you might find useful.

Firstly, if you are in a building that is taking fire, if at all possible take cover in the bathroom, preferably in the tub - safest place to be, as they are usually in the center of the building, and the walls surrounding it are filled with pipe and conduits that may turn or deflect rounds, and a tub, while not proof against direct rifle fire, may offer some protection against spent or partially deflected rounds.

Second, if you have a cell phone with enough power to reach a transmitter at ALL... you CAN STILL CALL 911, even if you have no minutes, even if you're not on a network and never have been, even if you have no service, as long as that cellphone has enough charge to reach the nearest tower, you can STILL do it, that is a mandated feature of all cellphones.

Third, if you are calling from a cell phone, unless you give them a location, it will take extra time, sometimes quite a bit of it, for them to pin down the location accurately - as there's an amount of rigamarole required to do so.

Even if you don't care to pack iron, a basic principle applies, find good cover or concealment, call in the cavalry and prepare to engage if necessary in the meantime, I know a girl who successfully staved off an intruder with a hair dryer simply because she was mentally prepared to defend herself and caught him by surprise from behind the bathroom door - a weapon evens the odds or even puts them in your favor, but there's a LOT to be said for "home field advantage" too.

-F

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Monday, May 5, 2008 6:14 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


As stated above, the clown hanging up the 911 cal was NOT a Police Officer. There was never any Officer involved until the boyfriend found the caller the next day, DEAD.
Handguns are prohibited in Madison. When the Wisconsin State Legislature (in Madison) was about to pass the Right To Carry Law, the City of Madison rushed to hold and Emergency Session of the Common Council to pass Handgun Prohibition so that it would be exempted under the Grandfather Clause of the new law.
Madison cops have plainly stated in the past that they do not exist to Protect and Serve, but to clean up the mess after you are dead.

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Monday, May 5, 2008 10:59 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:

Handguns are prohibited in Madison.

Oh gee, which worked SO well in making Washington DC such a safe and secure place to live.

I'd say next of kin oughta be filing suit against the city officials as well as criminal charges up to and including negligence and reckless endangerment.

Legally, the cops and 911 ain't obligated to do a damned thing to protect you, individually, see...
So you really don't have any recourse when they let you swing like that, but certainly one should try to hold accountable the numbnuts who created a free-victim, err.. gun-free zone.

I still cannot believe there are people in this world so totally moronic as to believe such things will magically stop a criminal from packing heat into an area where they KNOW no one is likely to be able to protect themselves from their predation, if anything it incites and encourages them because if they DO run into resistance they can call in an anonymous "person with gun" and let the cops prep the victim FOR them by disarming them - and then act with impunity.

Kinda makes you wonder who's side the police are on sometimes, doesn't it ?

I think it's well past time people faced the facts, outlawing self-defense causes crime and violence, creating victim-setup zones does so even faster, just about every mass shooting has occured in one, and every time some dimwit creates one it almost immediately becomes a cesspool of crime and violence.

What part of cause and effect do these nimrods NOT comprehend ?

I was here, in fact living less than five miles down the road from Flint, MI when we went right-to-carry, ok ?

Up till that point, Flint was a cesspit, but in spite of the usual bogus and completely laughable claims of wild west happenings (you know, like Kennesaw) the fact was that crime dropped LIKE A ROCK, and without chaos and carnage, the prime perps realized that they stood a chance of gettin shot and headed for greener pastures and easier flocks to fleece, is all.

Ain't even about guns really, save that a gun is the most effective form of self defense there is, allowing even a ninety year old lady to stand off some sixteen year old crackhead who's lookin for an easy mark - but really, it's about self defense, because if folks actually defended THEMSELVES, and were allowed to, that would lead to all manner of questions that the powers that be don't want us thinking about...

You know, like why the hell we need these abusive, badge wearing parasite-predators sucking up our tax dollars and pushing us around in spite of the fact that they don't seem to be able to do the job they were created for in the first place.

Questions like that.

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Wednesday, May 7, 2008 6:14 AM

CANTTAKESKY


Quote:

Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
I will accept your supposition on only one condition Rue.

Don't Frem. Even with the condition.

Rue's whole argument is oversimplistic to the point of nonsensical. We have no idea how many stranger and acquaintaince murders were prevented by guns in the first place that are NOT in these statistics, how many of these cited murders were committed by guns, if any of the gun suicides would have been committed anyway by another method, if any of the gun suicides and accidents could have been prevented had guns been legally banned (cause you know, there is such a thing as an illegal gun), etc.

As always, these issues are more complex and ambiguous than eyeballing 2 statistics, saying one is not worth the other.

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Wednesday, May 7, 2008 7:10 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


I don't deal in bogus numbers like some (ahem !) people. Nor do I make assumptions as some (ahem !) people claim.

Where the rubber meets the road, "Results showed that a firearm was used in 68% of homicides and suicides, and having a gun in the home was associated with an increased risk of firearm homicide and firearm suicide in the home regardless of storage practice, type of gun, or number of firearms. Gun owners had a 90% greater risk of dying from a homicide in the home and they were also at greater risk of dying from a firearm homicide than were non-owners. Over ¾ of homicide victims knew their assailant, and almost a third of homicides occurred during a family argument.

Men with a gun in the home were 10 times more likely to commit suicide than were men without and persons with firearms in the home who committed suicide were 31 times more likely to have done so using a gun rather than another method. The researchers conclude that having a firearm at home is associated with a greater risk of a homicide/suicide taking place in the home."

And suicide rates spike immediately after ourchasing a gun and for 6 years thereafter.
http://www.yourhealthbase.com/archives/ihn154sp.htm
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1200/is_24_156/ai_58497394

When it comes to life and death, the only place where real numbers exist, the risks of gun ownership far outweigh the benefits.

***************************************************************
"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."

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Wednesday, May 7, 2008 8:08 AM

FOSTER


An armed society is a polite society.

Proud resident of Kennesaw GA.





I don't recommend breaking into my home because I will end your A$$ and won't look back. It is my life and I will defend it with force because it is my responsibility and no one elses.

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Wednesday, May 7, 2008 9:03 AM

FREMDFIRMA


ACK!

Euuuaggh!

My EYES! YAarrrg!

You went to the AR-15/M-16 platform for home defense ?!!

What on EARTH possessed you to buy a rifle that expels it's waste into it's own chamber thus guaranteeing a jam when you need it most ?

I guess if it works for ya, but past experience with depending on that horror in field conditions has made me not real fond of it.

Mines an M1897 Winchester Trench Gun with a blueprinted and polycoated slide, and a gunlight so powerful you could quite literally fry an egg with it* hooked to the bayonet attachment point.

Anything that can take six rounds of 12G 2-3/4" single-O buck in 2.5 seconds and keep comin is likely to need a wooden stake to finish off, yanno ?

-F
*Not kidding.
http://www.wickedlasers.com/lasers/Wicked_Lights-74-0.html
Being beamed with that horror is almost as bad as being tased, it's quite shocking and disorienting.

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Wednesday, May 7, 2008 9:14 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Since common sense isn't enough...

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=92742

http://www.politicalgateway.com/main/columns/read.html?col=479

http://www.tsra.com/?p=news&c=view&id=101&cat=1

I refuse to consider evidence from folks who file a perp shot dead while attempting to victimise someone a "victim of gun violence" to bulk their numbers, especially when none of their evidence holds up against even the slightest rational investigation.

-F

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Wednesday, May 7, 2008 9:22 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


Gun proponents flee accurate gun death statistics like vampires flee the light of day.

But seriously Frem - gun OWNERS are much more likely to be gun murder and gun suicide statistics in their homes and in general than non-gun owners. So when you claim 'perps' are counted in the wrong column I have no idea what you're talking about - do you ?

***************************************************************
"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."

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Wednesday, May 7, 2008 9:36 AM

FOSTER


That is not my home defense weapon a mosberg and handgun are for my home defense. That is for having fun wasting money.


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Wednesday, May 7, 2008 11:22 AM

KIRKULES


If anyone had asked me what would make this the perfect web site, hot chicks with guns would have been my first suggestion. Foster could definitely make the annual G. Gordon Liddy calander.

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Wednesday, May 7, 2008 11:36 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


:covers eys: :covers ears: :covers mouth: Yeah, that's an intelligent way to deal with facts.


And speaking of mental tricks that allow you to X out reality ...


Conservatives Happier Than Liberals

Individuals with conservative ideologies are happier than liberal-leaners, and new research pinpoints the reason: Conservatives rationalize social and economic inequalities.

Conservatives also scored highest on measures of rationalization, which gauge a person's tendency to justify, or explain away, inequalities.

The rationalization measure included statements such as: "It is not really that big a problem if some people have more of a chance in life than others," and "This country would be better off if we worried less about how equal people are."





***************************************************************
"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."

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Wednesday, May 7, 2008 2:29 PM

FOSTER


Well thanks for that. Course I had to look up the calendar to check it out. Dunno that I would go naked for it though.

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Wednesday, May 7, 2008 2:52 PM

FOSTER


What is to rationalize the world is not fair. Never has been. Never will be. Trying to constantly limit others to the lowest common denominator will only make it even more unfair.

What built the country? Men trying to be better than other men, take away the rewards and what is to strive for.

If you don't want to own a gun that is fine. Statistics can be used to say and draw what ever conclusions that you want. But what gives you the right to tell me what I can and can't do/own? I am an adult and I believe that I should be allowed to make up my own mind I don't need it made up for me. If you don't come to the same conclusion that is fine by me. I am not going to march myself over to your house and make you own a gun.

I do believe that some people shouldn't own guns. My neighbor for one, who's comment "it is good that I don't have a gun in the house because I never knows when I might snap". His three kids and wife are probably safer with out him owning a gun.

Me I am not going to snap. I know what I would use a weapon in every room of my home (and they are not all guns, some are swords, others lamps). I am prepared, it makes it much more likely that I would survive an encounter.

This wraps up a lot of my feelings on the matter.

http://www.reason.com/news/show/121979.html

To tell you the truth I really don't care what you do or don't do. But I have to say I would not give up my right to self defense just because someone told me to and no number of Statistics is going to convince me that handing in my guns is a good idea.

Gun crime may go down when guns are banned but what happens to all other crime?

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Wednesday, May 7, 2008 6:53 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Thought I'd take this oppurtunity to make your acquaintance Foster. And might I add that the pleasure is all mine.

"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack

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Thursday, May 8, 2008 3:18 AM

FOSTER


How do 6. Nice to meet you too.

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Thursday, May 8, 2008 4:53 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Nice to meet you too, but no smily face even

What scares you about me? The pic, or the rabid way about me that makes me seem so contrarian to anyone who has a differing opinion?

I assure you that I suffer from no afflictions that the right girl couldn't handle, particularly one with a gun to my head....

(P.S. Just playin with ya. Glad to have you on board. I only knew one girl who even talked a little bit like you before and she grew up in Southern Illinois. She had a gun toting mechanic as a dad, which was A-Okay in my book. Not entirely convinced that many girls like you are even around anymore, let alone have such strong convictions like you do. Please forgive the jadedness in me, but although you're quite stunning, particularly with a piece in your hand, I can't help but think that if I could get a pretty girl to wield a pistol and let me post pics of it on the net as I pleased, I'd probably drive a lot more points home with relative ease than how it's done now, in futility..... Here's hoping you're aware of the power you have..... )

Quote:

I don't recommend breaking into my home because I will end your A$$ and won't look back. It is my life and I will defend it with force because it is my responsibility and no one elses.


...color me smitten...


"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack

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Thursday, May 8, 2008 5:15 AM

FREMDFIRMA


There's this pesky credibility issue when it comes to those figures since almost without fail they're handed off by...

A - people with a vested interest in banning guns, proven to have often distorted them or simply made them up.

B - people with a vested interest in KEEPING their means of defense, who are not adverse to a little figure shading of their own.

C - governments and related agencies, which have their own reasons for wanting a disarmed and compliant populace.

When you have so many sources that are to be honest, fulla shit - AND you have a substantial amount of those advocating banning guns while themselves carrying*, or having hired protection that does, it stikes me as ulterior motive and useless as an argument.

Especially from someone who's adoration of the State borders on rightwingnusts adoration of the Shrub, causing a further credibility issue.

And then I wind up always asking the vital question of "WHY" - cause the "for your own safety" excuse doesn't hold one goddamn ounce of water, and I come away really not liking any of the answers because I know enough history to see where that eventually goes.

All I see is a deceitful and malicious attempt to violate and strip me of my Constitutionally Protected Right to self defense by folks who are absolutely and without a doubt lying about their motives, and then pondering the fact that this Right is Constitutionally Protected for a damn good reason, have no real option but to file them under aiding and abetting.

I've said it all before here, many times, and am not going to bother with a Statist fanatic over this issue than I would a Rightwing fanatic over those Iraqi WMDs, cause no amount of real-world evidence is gonna shake the belief of "True Believers" like that.

You're just pissed that our guns kinda get in the way of the concept of the State running our lives from cradle to grave the way YOU would like em run.

And ain't that just too damn bad.

-F
*- Our local organiser of anti-gun marches was busted a while back for carrying a piece with no CCW and a filed off serial number, which says all manner of things about those people to me.

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Thursday, May 8, 2008 5:27 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Hello, Foster.

*smacks Jack*
Down boy, down!

I think he's just in a bit of shock at a woman who's not had her personhood eviscerated by our male-dominated society is all, be merciful.
(A rolled up newspaper instead of a 2x4...)

Yeah, verily, although a fairly dirty and effective fighter, I learned as early as middle school that it's just a damn bad idea to trust anyone else's "protection" but your own, and that engaging physically is gonna do damage to YOU no matter what.

Being 5'6" and maybe 135lbs soakin wet with boots on, and semi-disabled from a near fatal accident, I don't screw around with halfass measures when it comes to self defense, there just ain't no point to it now, and even less when I lived at ground zero of southeast Baltimores worst ghetto.

Although the caliber of my personal is laughable to most 'serious' gunbunnies *eyeroll*, it's been a friend to me for long years and has saved my arse times countless - nothing makes someone supportive of carrying a piece like it saving their life repeatedly.

Besides which, laughable that an original colt mustang might be, long use and familiarity allows some amazing accuracy with any decent quality of ammo, although getting replacement parts anymore is touchy - if I have to, I might go to a Bersa, but this is an old, OLD friend of mine, yanno.

-F

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Thursday, May 8, 2008 5:39 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Hehe....

Was I out of line Frem? 7 of my 10 personalities gave it the go-ahead, so maybe 3 out of ten were right this time around.....



Here's thinking a girl like Foster wouldn't be afraid of little 'ol we...


heh... I'm 5' 7" and pushin' 200lbs now, so if you ever need a bodyguard and you're around Milwaukee look me up Frem. And it's not all fat, dammit. I got shoulder blades like a ox, whatever that means....

"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack

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Thursday, May 8, 2008 7:10 AM

FOSTER


Me intimidated? Not bloody likely.

I have been told that I can be intimidating. Once have had a bevy of girls that I went to a concert with fawning all over me after I scared the sh*t out of some guys with only a look. Can I also just point out how weird and uncomfortable it is to be fawned over by a bunch of other girls when your straight. That wigged me out more than staring the guys down. A lot of situations can be avoided with the right look, attitude and stance. Though you really need to be able to back up your threat of violence if challenged.

I don't consider a gun a weapon, it is a tool. The mind that holds the gun, that is a different story. The mind is the weapon and it will direct the use of the tool. You may be able to take away guns but I do not believe that we are equipped to take away minds yet.

I would like to point out that I am not new to the site. I am mostly to be seen on the chat though. It has been a few years since I was really active on the message boards.

Thank you 6 for the silver tongued complements. It is always a boost to a girls self esteem to know that someone finds her attractive.

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Thursday, May 8, 2008 7:45 AM

OUT2THEBLACK


Whoa Howdy , Foster !

Folk of the female persuasion with beautiful minds like yours always turn me on...

Between that and the fact that you are a stone fox , you just hammered my lust-button with that gloved fist of yours !

Gorramn , I'm another who is proud to make your acquaintance hereabouts , and I'm hopeful that there are many more Browncoat women like yourself , though I'm also a realist who knows better than to entertain such hopes...

Turns out , I'm also one of those folk with the intimidatin' manner , when it comes to self-defense , or the defense of those I run with...
Harmless as a lamb in a meadow , 'til threatened ; then a roaring , ravenous lion when duty calls...

My proverbial hat is off to you in tribute...

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Thursday, May 8, 2008 11:31 AM

FOSTER


Howdy yourself O2TB. Thank you for the complement. They act as a shot of the adrenalin to a girls self esteem.

Can’t say how many women share my point of view. Don’t know that many myself. But I hope you find one of your own.

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Thursday, May 8, 2008 12:17 PM

OUT2THEBLACK


Quote:

Originally posted by Foster:
Can’t say how many women share my point of view. Don’t know that many myself. But I hope you find one of your own.



Thank you kindly , missy...

While we're on this subject , for those as may not know , someone from down your way who was attending UNC-Chapel Hill was murdered earlier this year...She was the student body President , and by all accounts , a gifted student intending to brcome an M.D.

Perhaps not accidentally , the media reports of her demise seem to be rapidly disappearing ,
so before she's forgotten by the public at large , I wish to remind sympathetic folk about how this young woman could have saved herself , had she been armed...
<. http://www.11alive.com/news/article_news.aspx?storyid=113075>

< http://liestoppers.blogspot.com/2008/03/eve-marie-carson.html>

For purposes of infamy , the lowdown about the two young serial thugs who robbed us of Eve's life and work :
< http://www.11alive.com/news/article_news.aspx?storyid=112734&provider=
top
>

<< http://www.11alive.com/news/article_news.aspx?storyid=115271>

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Thursday, May 8, 2008 5:10 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


See Frem...

I toldja she was cool.

And ya know I'd be lying if I didn't say that the more she keeps talking the more I like it.
---


Never seen you around before Foster, but you were probably posting before I came around, probably around mid-2006. I was pretty late to the whole Firefly party. Posted mostly in the picture threads and stuff at first, but I kinda let myself get sucked in the RWED here and spend most of my time at FFF arguing with everybody. I generally keep out of the main rooms now cause a lot of those folk can be pretty delacate, and I don't wanna hurt no one's feelings... either that, or I just like the drama and I just can't find much to squabble about in the main threads. We're a bunch of mean ol' bastards (and bastardettes) in here sometimes, but the cool thing is, no matter how long we go away, we can come right back at anytime and there's always a familiar face in here ready to trade some verbal blows with ya.

So.... I guess I might as well not try to hide my nature around you. Mayhap you really think me a jerk, mayhap you don't. I'm probably wrong about just as much as anybody else in here and I can dig in pretty hard at times and get a little abrasive. Knowing my history, doesn't that just make the silver tounged compliments all that much sweeter? Don't know much about you, but you sure seem a beauty, inside and out...

Nice to know if what happend in WI ever was happening to you, you'd know how to handle yourself and live to see another day.

Hope to see ya in here more often, but if you're going to stand close to me make sure to duck and cover to avoid the shrapnel.

Take it easy,
~6sJ

"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack

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Thursday, May 8, 2008 7:23 PM

FREMDFIRMA


You know, a buddy of mine refers to firearms ownership as "The Gift of Life" because you can kill an armed man, but you cannot make him un-free.

Our country was FOUNDED on that principle, and those founders expounded at length about it, believed it very passionately since it had just broken british dominion over them, and codified it into the supreme law of the land to ever protect it - that's all historical fact and in their own words, much of which I have previously posted here.

And in the end, via common culture brought us together with our british relations as friends and equals, rather than slave and master, and make no bones about it, it was weaponry and the will to use it that made that distinction.

It's also why no country has ever even CONTEMPLATED invading us, contrary to rightwingnut paranoid fantasies, it's because they'd get chopped to bits by the whole fekkin horde of us before reaching the nearest walmart.

Of course, THESE days that's just a perception, most of the meek, obediant, compliant masses would just bend the knee and lick the new jackboot as fast as they old, cause they're trained and conditioned to do so, all the while parroting how evil weapons and self-defense are.

But those few with any sense left are still hangin in there by our fingernails on sheer rabidity, and I mean to at the very least keep it that way, if not push back against the neo-tory collaborators who'd see us disarmed for easier "processing".

Which'd happen over my mortal remains, and the NRA can kiss my ass, always begging money while *helping* the fucking Gov find gentler and sneakier ways of using the Constitution for toilet paper - while I might not be fond of Zionistas, I do get along with the JFPO, they know damn well from historical experience just where the cycle of permit-registration-confiscation ends, and like me take it kinda personal when someone tries the same crap now.

I file it in the same category as my cycle helmet, first aid kit, fire extinguisher, spare time, and smoke alarm....

The idea is NOT to need it, but if it should happen to come to pass, you DO need it, right now, in hand - not in the holster of some agent of the State who might get around to you some time in the next hour or so.

It's a thing, an object, has no will or motivation of it's own, no ability to act on it's own, so the unreasoning fear of a mere thing always drives me to wonder what scares them more... the weapon itself ?

Or the fact that as long as I possess it, they cannot force their will upon me ?

Cause I firmly believe it is the latter.

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Friday, May 9, 2008 5:01 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

You know, a buddy of mine refers to firearms ownership as "The Gift of Life" because you can kill an armed man, but you cannot make him un-free.



I haven't heard a statement like that put into modern terms much better Frem-man....

.... because even to attempt to try to make a man unfree, would be doubleplus ungood.

.... and a man who tried that on me, may get a plus to doubleplus ungood feeling down beneath...

when I kick him in the junk doubleplus hard.

I'll tell ya Frem..... I doubleplus unlove Big Bro who if he had his way right now would see us all doubleplus unfree....

"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack

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Friday, May 9, 2008 11:15 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Ah yes, but ponder this, grasshopper.

Governments and beauracracies are big stupid flailing things, nearly blind and only seeing active resistance as a threat.

And thus are simple enough to penetrate and manipulate to your own ends, all the while ostensibly and apparently serving their own.

This bit of wisdom served to you with a side order of potatoes O Brien.

-F

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Sunday, May 11, 2008 11:39 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by Foster:
Well thanks for that. Course I had to look up the calendar to check it out. Dunno that I would go naked for it though.



It's naked now?? used to be lingerie or sometimes bikinis. Guns of model's choice.

Gotta admit, I was thinking exactly the same thing from your posted pics - she should be in G. Gordon's calendar.
Do I correctly understand you are actually from Kennesaw? Or live there now? Have not previously met somebody from there, always thought of it as a bit of mythological place. Being stuck around Madison for so many years made me think that much rationality doesn't exist in humans, and maybe my fellow Marines were figments of my imagination.
Thinking about it now, not sure if it was mostly because of the gun phobia, or being the Gay and Lesbian Capital of the World.

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Monday, May 12, 2008 5:51 AM

FOSTER


Well the ad shots on the site were of naked women holding guns over strategic areas. Thanks for the complement though.

Yes, I am actually from Kennesaw. I own a home there, so, not so much a mythological place. Have to say I love it! My town has a lot of libertarian in its soul. Course it does have its idiots too but they don't seem to be very outspoken.

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Wednesday, May 14, 2008 10:06 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


I'd model my rifle and my gun on the cover if they asked me to.

Don't think they have a girl/gay friendly calendar, least none that I'm aware of.

Knowing what you know cause you saw the site Foster (I can't look now because it's NSFW), do you think they'd make me hide my gun strategically with my rifle? Admittedly, I wouldn't have to be all that strategic about it cause the job could probalby be done with a Derringer* on a cold day.

Anybody know if Extendz works? Enzyte?



*Don't laugh. Ask Lincoln if size matters.

"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack

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Wednesday, May 14, 2008 10:56 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


tmi.

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Wednesday, May 14, 2008 11:19 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


C'mon. No sense of humor.....?

Even Lincoln's ghost got a chuckle out of that one.

"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack

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Thursday, May 15, 2008 4:17 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Three hours, multiple calls, no response but platitudes and eventually profanity.
http://www.breitbart.tv/?p=95163

She had to call the mayors office to get a car on site.

That is typical in my experience of 911 dispatch service in certain areas, 21225 being a rather memorable and personal example.

And remember, folks, they're under no obligation whatsoever to protect or defend you as an individual, and cannot be held responsible for what happens to you.

I find myself wondering if this lady would be interested in a Bersa Thunder, nice little piece, goes for about $275-$300 retail, but surprising quality for a small, inexpensive weapon.

Would work a hell of a lot better than holding up a restraining order and expecting it to block the knife, now wouldn't it ?

And maybe, just maybe, when psycho boyfriend comes back for more, cause we ALL know he's gonna do that since there's no real risk to him...

It might be HIM dead on the floor instead of her.

I don't have a problem with that, and I fail to see why others do.

-F

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Thursday, May 15, 2008 7:46 AM

FOSTER


Dunno if they would have the market for it. How many women you know want a calendar of a naked man with a gun (well, a man who is not Daniel Craig )

You could always ask if you need to bring you magnum

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