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REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS
A thread for Democrats Only
Wednesday, June 13, 2018 7:29 AM
1KIKI
Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.
Wednesday, June 13, 2018 7:54 AM
SECOND
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: The American lifespan declined for the second year in a row. Suicide was a big factor, as well as opioids. I don't know if you've considered how difficult it is to change the average lifespan when you have all 350 million individuals contributing their personal years to the final number. With average lifespan dropping, it seems there's far more going on than mere petulant 'resentment'. But the whole article seems to describe this 'resentment' as coming from nothing, and meaning nothing, except the outsized pout of a spoiled brat. That's its problem, and yours, SECOND. The dismissal of the legitimate misery of millions. But if democrats don't address it, or even talk about it, people will vote for the person who does. As they well should.
Wednesday, June 13, 2018 8:18 AM
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: The American lifespan declined for the second year in a row. Suicide was a big factor, as well as opioids.
Quote:Originally posted by SECOND: You are so full of shit, 1kiki.
Wednesday, June 13, 2018 11:27 AM
SIGNYM
I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.
Quote: SECOND .... I'm still vastly confused by your statement, which seems to conflate "liking" with "winning". I'm sure you have an explanation that makes sense, since you seem to have derived lessons from your Vietnam experience which have stood up to decades-worth of experience. So, at least one of us is confused. Help me out here and tell me what you meant. - SIGNY It is the fundamental problem with language. Only telepathy will do what I need in as few words as I'm willing to use. Since Signym is not telepathic, the following probably won't clear up anything, either, but let me just say that a lot of soldiers (not all draftees, obviously, or the war would have been even crazier than it was) who went to Vietnam after 1970 were resentful that they were even there. They took out their resentment on the people who idealists like me were fighting for. They resented the South Vietnamese. That is a crazy way to fight: resenting the people you are there to defend. I, second, can't win all by myself when most of the people around me and most of those back in the USA don't think the war is worth fighting. Nuke all of Vietnam, North and South, declare victory and go home, was the best imaginable strategy for the resentful soldiers. - SECOND
Quote:Now imagine jumping forward in time by 40 years. A majority of Americans today live as if they are crazy with resentment.- SECOND
Thursday, June 14, 2018 2:43 AM
JEWELSTAITEFAN
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: The American lifespan declined for the second year in a row. Suicide was a big factor, as well as opioids. Quote:Originally posted by SECOND: You are so full of shit, 1kiki. Maybe you need to argue with the Census Bureau. https://www.cnn.com/2017/12/21/health/us-life-expectancy-study/index.html Life expectancy in the United States has dropped again following last year's decline, which marked the first downturn in more than two decades. The death rates increased for unintentional injuries, Alzheimer's disease and suicide. Unintentional injuries include accidental drug overdoses, which were the official cause of 63,600 deaths last year. SECOND is a troll because it constantly misrepresents what people post, fails to address their actual positions, and resorts to personal attacks when its brain isn't working (which is most of the time).
Thursday, June 14, 2018 2:55 AM
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: Quote: SECOND .... I'm still vastly confused by your statement, which seems to conflate "liking" with "winning". I'm sure you have an explanation that makes sense, since you seem to have derived lessons from your Vietnam experience which have stood up to decades-worth of experience. So, at least one of us is confused. Help me out here and tell me what you meant. - SIGNY It is the fundamental problem with language. Only telepathy will do what I need in as few words as I'm willing to use. Since Signym is not telepathic, the following probably won't clear up anything, either, but let me just say that a lot of soldiers (not all draftees, obviously, or the war would have been even crazier than it was) who went to Vietnam after 1970 were resentful that they were even there. They took out their resentment on the people who idealists like me were fighting for. They resented the South Vietnamese. That is a crazy way to fight: resenting the people you are there to defend. I, second, can't win all by myself when most of the people around me and most of those back in the USA don't think the war is worth fighting. Nuke all of Vietnam, North and South, declare victory and go home, was the best imaginable strategy for the resentful soldiers. - SECOND I thank you for those words, and would appreciate more. Let's imagine that the military service, from draftee up thru the ranks to the highest generals AND the President, shared your idealism. What would "winning" have looked like, to you, and -perhaps more importantly - HOW would you have achieved that goal/ won the war? Quote:Now imagine jumping forward in time by 40 years. A majority of Americans today live as if they are crazy with resentment.- SECOND Ok, Americans are crazy with resentment. Blacks resent whites, and whites resent blacks; blacks resent latinos and most Asian cultures look down on everyone. Women resent men, and men resent women. Religious resent secularists, and vice versa. Democrats resent Republicans (a resentment you participate in). Old versus young, straight versus everyone else, stay-at-home moms versus professional women; north versus south; coastal versus flyovers ... WHY are we such a resentful culture? Does it have something to do with this ...?
Quote: And why it that American resentment has suddenly become a point of discussion when we have been splintering and dividing ourselves and resenting each other for decades? And now, I have a sprinkler system to fix.
Thursday, June 14, 2018 7:31 AM
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: The American lifespan declined for the second year in a row. Suicide was a big factor, as well as opioids. Quote:Originally posted by SECOND: You are so full of shit, 1kiki. Maybe you need to argue with the Census Bureau. https://www.cnn.com/2017/12/21/health/us-life-expectancy-study/index.html Life expectancy in the United States has dropped again following last year's decline, which marked the first downturn in more than two decades. The death rates increased for unintentional injuries, Alzheimer's disease and suicide. Unintentional injuries include accidental drug overdoses, which were the official cause of 63,600 deaths last year.
Thursday, June 14, 2018 9:01 AM
Quote:Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN: Interesting graphs. That 2nd one shows how badly Clinton & Obama screwed the honest American Worker. Every American who wants to get screwed even more needs to elect another Democrat for Preezy.
Thursday, June 14, 2018 9:17 AM
Thursday, June 14, 2018 10:39 AM
Quote:Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN: I wonder why we have a reply from "second" and then another from "SECOND" - they seem the same to me.
Thursday, June 14, 2018 10:56 AM
Quote:It is the fundamental problem with language. Only telepathy will do what I need in as few words as I'm willing to use. Since Signym is not telepathic, the following probably won't clear up anything, either, but let me just say that a lot of soldiers (not all draftees, obviously, or the war would have been even crazier than it was) who went to Vietnam after 1970 were resentful that they were even there. They took out their resentment on the people who idealists like me were fighting for. They resented the South Vietnamese. That is a crazy way to fight: resenting the people you are there to defend. I, second, can't win all by myself when most of the people around me and most of those back in the USA don't think the war is worth fighting. Nuke all of Vietnam, North and South, declare victory and go home, was the best imaginable strategy for the resentful soldiers. - SECOND I thank you for those words, and would appreciate more. Let's imagine that the military service, from draftee up thru the ranks to the highest generals AND the President, shared your idealism. What would "winning" have looked like, to you, and -perhaps more importantly - HOW would you have achieved that goal/ won the war? - SIGNY
Thursday, June 14, 2018 11:24 AM
JJ
Thursday, June 14, 2018 1:47 PM
Thursday, June 14, 2018 2:14 PM
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: SECOND, for some reason, your name (and everyone else's) shows up as all caps in the "attribution" line; at least for me. I would still like an explanation of the following. Not meaning to pick a fight, but just very curious how you fit "liking" and "winning" into the same sentence about the same people. I'm hoping that you can provide an example of how you can "like" someone enough to "win" ... surely, you must have thought about what you would have done differently if you were in charge. Quote:It is the fundamental problem with language. Only telepathy will do what I need in as few words as I'm willing to use. Since Signym is not telepathic, the following probably won't clear up anything, either, but let me just say that a lot of soldiers (not all draftees, obviously, or the war would have been even crazier than it was) who went to Vietnam after 1970 were resentful that they were even there. They took out their resentment on the people who idealists like me were fighting for. They resented the South Vietnamese. That is a crazy way to fight: resenting the people you are there to defend. I, second, can't win all by myself when most of the people around me and most of those back in the USA don't think the war is worth fighting. Nuke all of Vietnam, North and South, declare victory and go home, was the best imaginable strategy for the resentful soldiers. - SECOND I thank you for those words, and would appreciate more. Let's imagine that the military service, from draftee up thru the ranks to the highest generals AND the President, shared your idealism. What would "winning" have looked like, to you, and -perhaps more importantly - HOW would you have achieved that goal/ won the war? - SIGNY ----------- Pity would be no more, If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake As long as you insist that everything is the Republicans'/ Democrats' fault, then you fail to grasp the REAL problem with American politics. America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876
Thursday, June 14, 2018 5:00 PM
Quote:I know many soldiers that think the Vietnam War could have been "won". Nothing ever changes their minds.
Quote: My winning strategy for the Vietnam War would have been for Congress to disbelieve every word from Kissinger, Agnew, and Nixon (KAN for short) on Vietnam.
Friday, June 15, 2018 12:10 AM
Quote:Originally posted by SECOND: The headline says it all: "Life Expectancy Drops For Whites, Rises For Blacks and Hispanics" www.usnews.com/news/blogs/data-mine/articles/2016-04-20/life-expectanc y-drops-for-whites-rises-for-blacks-and-hispanics
Friday, June 15, 2018 7:44 AM
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: Quote:Originally posted by SECOND: The headline says it all: "Life Expectancy Drops For Whites, Rises For Blacks and Hispanics" www.usnews.com/news/blogs/data-mine/articles/2016-04-20/life-expectanc y-drops-for-whites-rises-for-blacks-and-hispanics Oddly enough, when I go to your link, the article is from 2016. And the study the article is about (which is linked in the article) uses data from 2013-2014. "Changes in Life Expectancy by Race and Hispanic Origin in the United States, 2013–2014". I think you need to reference the most recent data, rather than out of date information, if you want to look like anything other than a total irrelevancy. And THEN, you go on to makes gross assumptions and illogical conclusions based on the bad data you misleadingly referenced. Very sloppy, lazy, and biased.
Friday, June 15, 2018 8:08 AM
Friday, June 15, 2018 8:10 AM
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: SECOND, at one point you said that we didn't "like" the Vietnamese enough to "win". Now, you say it COULDN'T have been "won" Quote:I know many soldiers that think the Vietnam War could have been "won". Nothing ever changes their minds. You implied at one point that the war could have been conducted differently (i.e stop shooting water buffaloes) and follow it by saying Quote: My winning strategy for the Vietnam War would have been for Congress to disbelieve every word from Kissinger, Agnew, and Nixon (KAN for short) on Vietnam. That's not a "strategy" of any sort. So what does that MEAN? Does it mean that we shouldn't have started military action at all? That we should have depended on more "carrot" (development aid) than "stick" (killing)? What was your GOAL for S Vietnam, if any? A democratically-elected government? A small-business capitalist economy? Simply rooting out N Vietnamese influence? How would you have handled S Vietnamese who were sympathetic to communism? Kill them because they were ideologically suspect? Leave them alone because they were S Vietnamese? How would have treated S Vietnamese who were anti-American, without being pro-communist? Respect them because of their nationalism? The reason why I'm drilling down on this is because YOU claim that "Americans" are the cause of our problems because of their "goals", then make the case that KAN had goals which they didn't even share with the American people, and that they (not average Americans) were mandating our actions in Vietnam. All you seem to do is "react" to what you "hate". But don't you know what you want? Don't you have any idea how to get there? ----------- Pity would be no more, If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake As long as you insist that everything is the Republicans'/ Democrats' fault, then you fail to grasp the REAL problem with American politics. America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876
Friday, June 15, 2018 9:21 AM
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: Yanno SECOND< you spend endless hours bitching and "blaming the victim". But I have a hard time taking ANYthing you say seriously because you lack clarity of thought and purpose. Take your experience in Vietnam, which seems to have been significant. You react badly to events, but can't imagine any alternatives (What were your essential goals? What should have been done differently, in your opinion?) One way to hone your understanding of the world is to create different models, and then beat them against reality. But the only "lesson" that YOU seem to have learned from Vietnam is to BITCH ENDLESSLY ABOUT AMERICANS. Yep, that's you! The endless-bitcher-and-white-victim blamer! (BTW, you're racist; did you know that? It seeps thru everything you post.) The only OTHER lesson that you seem to have learned is that unearned wealth make you a superior being. So, what is it that you have to say, again? Oh, nothing? I thought so. ----------- Pity would be no more, If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake As long as you insist that everything is the Republicans'/ Democrats' fault, then you fail to grasp the REAL problem with American politics. America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876
Friday, June 15, 2018 9:39 AM
Friday, June 15, 2018 10:15 AM
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: So, your wealth has nothing to do with the gas or oil under your family ranch? Uh huh. ----------- Pity would be no more, If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake As long as you insist that everything is the Republicans'/ Democrats' fault, then you fail to grasp the REAL problem with American politics. America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876
Friday, June 15, 2018 12:44 PM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 6:13 AM
Quote:Originally posted by JJ: Funny how the chants were lock her up, and instead we see them getting locked up. Yep, funny.
Saturday, June 16, 2018 6:17 AM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 7:59 AM
6IXSTRINGJACK
Quote:Originally posted by second: Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: So, your wealth has nothing to do with the gas or oil under your family ranch? Uh huh. ----------- Pity would be no more, If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake As long as you insist that everything is the Republicans'/ Democrats' fault, then you fail to grasp the REAL problem with American politics. America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 I didn't inherit the land; I bought the land. I was following the natural gas well example of JC and Milton, the first two engineers I worked with, but I figured I could do 10 times better than they had done. And buying Microsoft stock before Windows 3.1 arrived didn't hurt either. I was not lucky. I invested in what understood. And the obligatory dig at Republican voters: What would they invest in when they understand nothing, nothing at all? Graduating from the school of engineering at the University of Texas at Austin does have some advantages at recognizing good investments. The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
Saturday, June 16, 2018 8:16 AM
Quote:Originally posted by second: Quote:Originally posted by JJ: Funny how the chants were lock her up, and instead we see them getting locked up. Yep, funny. There is some funny stuff going on inside Trump's head: Few could contend with a straight face or a sound mind that Trump’s actions at the recent G-7 meeting and his summit with North Korean leader Kim Jong-un have advanced U.S. security interests, as that term has been understood by presidents since the end of World War II. Trump or his supporters might respond that he is rejecting the old concepts of national security. But if that’s so, let him spell out what new concepts would tout Kim Jong-un and the authoritarian leaders of Russia, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, and the Philippines as America’s most trustworthy friends, while downgrading the democratic leaders of Britain, France, Germany, and Canada as dishonest swindlers. It is appalling (there is no gentler word) for an American president to blast Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau for simply (and mildly) speaking up in response to Trump’s threat of a trade war—and then, two days later, to laud Kim, the world’s most brutal and insular tyrant, as a man who loves his country and to say it’s an “honor” to be in his presence. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2018/06/after-quebec-and-singapore-its-undeniable-that-trump-is-wrecking-the-world-order.html The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly] Trump says this DOJ report proves there was no collusion with the Russians. One of the charges against his former campaign manager, who by the way was running Trumps campaign for 144 days and not 49 days as Trumps is saying, is conspiracy. In other words, collusion. T
Saturday, June 16, 2018 8:23 AM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 8:26 AM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 8:33 AM
Quote:Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK: lol... whoops. Seems like Trudeau and Wheadon went to the same school of Feminism? Do Right, Be Right. :)
Saturday, June 16, 2018 9:06 AM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 9:09 AM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 9:14 AM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 9:41 AM
Quote:Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK: lol... TIME magazine cover from August 22nd of 2016. Just a few months before they named him "Person of the Year". Dude sells a lot of magazines. Do Right, Be Right. :)
Saturday, June 16, 2018 9:59 AM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 11:11 AM
Quote:I didn't inherit the land; I bought the land. I was following the natural gas well example of JC and Milton, the first two engineers I worked with, but I figured I could do 10 times better than they had done.
Saturday, June 16, 2018 12:51 PM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 12:57 PM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 12:59 PM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 1:39 PM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 4:45 PM
Quote:Originally posted by JJ: Trump says this DOJ report proves there was no collusion with the Russians. One of the charges against his former campaign manager, who by the way was running Trumps campaign for 144 days and not 49 days as Trumps is saying, is conspiracy. In other words, collusion.
Saturday, June 16, 2018 5:16 PM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 9:42 PM
Saturday, June 16, 2018 10:36 PM
Sunday, June 17, 2018 7:06 AM
Sunday, June 17, 2018 7:16 AM
CAPTAINCRUNCH
... stay crunchy...
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: But Manafort is not charged with colluding with Russia to throw the election. In fact, none of the charges relate to Russia, or the election, either separately or together ... at all. https://www.justice.gov/sco U.S. v. Paul J. Manafort, Jr. and Konstantin Kilimnik (1:17-cr-201, District of Columbia) A federal grand jury in the District of Columbia returned a third superseding indictment on June 8, 2018, against Paul J. Manafort, Jr., of Alexandria, Va., and Konstantin Kilimnik, of Moscow, Russia. Manafort is charged with conspiracy against the United States, conspiracy to launder money, unregistered agent of a foreign principal, false and misleading FARA statements, and false statements. Manafort and Kilimnik are charged with conspiracy to obstruct justice and obstruction of justice. U.S. v. Paul J. Manafort, Jr., and Richard W. Gates III (1:18-cr-83, Eastern District of Virginia) Paul J. Manafort, Jr., of Alexandria, Va., and Richard W. Gates III, of Richmond, Va., were indicted by a federal grand jury on Feb. 22, 2018, in the Eastern District of Virginia. The indictment contains 32 counts: 16 counts related to false individual income tax returns, seven counts of failure to file reports of foreign bank and financial accounts, five counts of bank fraud conspiracy, and four counts of bank fraud. On March 1, 2018, the court granted a motion to dismiss without prejudice the charges against Richard Gates, following his guilty plea in a related case in the District of Columbia (1:17-cr-201).
Monday, June 18, 2018 1:04 AM
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: "What a president says usually matters a great deal. But what Trump says usually bears no relation to the truth (or to what his own policies end up being) and is not worth repeating." Jeeze. I said that MONTHS ago on my way to making fun of all of you for hyperventilating into a coma at every tweet. SECOND is a troll because it constantly misrepresents what people post, fails to address their actual positions, and resorts to personal attacks when its brain isn't working (which is most of the time).
Monday, June 18, 2018 8:41 AM
Tuesday, June 19, 2018 6:00 AM
Tuesday, June 19, 2018 6:12 AM
Quote:Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK: What's disgusting to me is the terms with which the vocal Left today talk about the President, every single day. Especially since most of the examples they use of why he is all these things is pure hypocrisy when the lens is turned the other way. I was no big fan of Obama for sure, but rather than post about what a piece of shit he was, obsessively, I took a long vacation from political discourse. It's summer time, knuckleheads. At least go work on your tan if you're too lazy to do anything actually productive. Do Right, Be Right. :)
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