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Originally posted by Brenda:

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Originally posted by THGRRI:
Trump Adviser Papadopoulos Pleads Guilty to Making False Statements to the FBI.

George Papadopoulos allegedly claimed his interactions with a Russian government-linked professor had occurred before he became a foreign policy adviser to the Trump campaign. NBC’s Pete Williams reports

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/watch/fmr-trump-adviser-papadopoulos-pleads
-guilty-to-making-false-statements-to-fbi-1084418627854


Tick tock tick tock tick tock

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You know anything about Paul Manafort turning himself over to the Feds this morning. I know I saw on YouTube news clip over the weekend about warrants being gotten. And apparently Manafort is the first.

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He has been indicted, charged with a crime, so he had to turn himself in Brenda. Disappointed I missed you in chat yesterday. Hope to catch you there soon so I can say a proper hello.

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Originally posted by THGRRI:

It already happened SECOND and more than 4 or 5 Republicans said as much. They also stated that if Trump fired Mueller the Senate would put him right back in place as an independent council that Trump can't touch. It makes it easier to convict Trump of obstruction if he does fire Mueller. Lets hope he does.

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Originally posted by JO753:
Az I understand it, Trump can not directly fire Mueller. He woud haf to fire Sessionz and Rosenstien and replase them with croniez who woud do it.

Not eazy to find sumwun who iz loyal and stoopid enuf to risk prizon. Federal pound-me-in-the-ass prizon!

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.7532020.com]

Not to worry Joe. SIG and kiki are being shown to be absolute morons, stupid and corrupted when voicing there opinions about anything. A better word to describe them is; trolls.

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Originally posted by Oonjerah:
Papadopoulos looks young & pretty cute.
He would be popular in prison.


... oooOO}{OOooo ...

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Dear Mr. Hultgren,

I have been reading The Federalist Papers.

One of the big concerns of the founding fathers was the danger of foreign powers influencing people within our government. They go into some detail about how the ancient Greek city-state's attempts at democracy would always fail due to foreign actors taking advantage of internal rivalries.

If Hamilton, Madison, Jay, or any of the founding fathers were around today to witness what is going on with Trump and Putin, they would surely be aghast at the dismal failure of their creation.

They would instantly see that the wrench jamming the gears is party loyalty gaining priority over patriotism.

Even without the treasonous conspiracy, they would be appalled that such a carnival barker clown had managed to gain the Presidency and that he has yet to be impeached in spite of the non-stop goofs, lies and bafoonery.

I am sorry to have to inform you of this, but it is glaringly obvious that you and all the Republicans in the highest offices in the land are not adhering to your oath of office. You are failing to do your duty. The separation of powers cannot work when your loyalty is to your party rather than the nation. You are participating in treason, even if your only crime is inaction.

I understand you are not a major player in Congress, but that is no excuse. Your duty is to your local constituents and the United States of America, not the GOP.

I do not know the intricacies of your political situation or how things 'work' in Washington, but I suggest that if you can't get a coalition of Republican congressmen together to oust Ryan, call for Trump's impeachment, or otherwise end Putin's control over The White House, switch to Democrat or declare yourself an independent with a strong statement as to why.

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Originally posted by 1kiki:
Tsk tsk tsk.

Jo, do you think being gross and crude makes your inane babbling more important?

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Originally posted by JO753:
Got an email from my congressman, Randy Hultgren (R). It wuz a standard GoP blitherblather about 'our energy future' attempting to make it look like they arent working for the fossil fuel industry.

I sent a reply about wuts really going on:

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Dear Mr. Hultgren,

I have been reading The Federalist Papers.

One of the big concerns of the founding fathers was the danger of foreign powers influencing people within our government. They go into some detail about how the ancient Greek city-state's attempts at democracy would always fail due to foreign actors taking advantage of internal rivalries.

If Hamilton, Madison, Jay, or any of the founding fathers were around today to witness what is going on with Trump and Putin, they would surely be aghast at the dismal failure of their creation.

They would instantly see that the wrench jamming the gears is party loyalty gaining priority over patriotism.

Even without the treasonous conspiracy, they would be appalled that such a carnival barker clown had managed to gain the Presidency and that he has yet to be impeached in spite of the non-stop goofs, lies and bafoonery.

I am sorry to have to inform you of this, but it is glaringly obvious that you and all the Republicans in the highest offices in the land are not adhering to your oath of office. You are failing to do your duty. The separation of powers cannot work when your loyalty is to your party rather than the nation. You are participating in treason, even if your only crime is inaction.

I understand you are not a major player in Congress, but that is no excuse. Your duty is to your local constituents and the United States of America, not the GOP.

I do not know the intricacies of your political situation or how things 'work' in Washington, but I suggest that if you can't get a coalition of Republican congressmen together to oust Ryan, call for Trump's impeachment, or otherwise end Putin's control over The White House, switch to Democrat or declare yourself an independent with a strong statement as to why.

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I'm about 85% sure there will be no respons. Randy just goez along to get along. A career politician, very comfortable in hiz jerrymandered GoP district.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.7532020.com

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Originally posted by captaincrunch:

That pretty well sums it up +1

G, traveling, posting as CaptainCrunch. Replies may be spotty or non existant.

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Originally posted by THGRRI:
Did Trump sanction Flynns discussions with Russia at the very time Putin was hacking us and trying to have an influence on our election? Just this morning Flynn tweeted "scapegoat"

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Yep

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I'll bet you dollars to donuts that if there is anything brought against Trump, it won't have diddly-squat to do with Russia.

This is probably going to turn out like Bill Clinton .... they dug and dug and dug and dug and came up with .... not an affair with "that women" but the fact that he lied to Congress about it. What you'll see is a lot of goalpost-moving ... not "collusion" exactly and not Russia at all but something else ... maybe something in his business affairs.

But yanno, it occurred to me ... why fight the hysteria?

Let's say that you get your wish, and Trump is impeached. Even better, Congress is returned to the Dems.

But the USA will still be de-industrialized, wealth inequality will still increase, there will still be endless wars at random throughout the globe, trade agreements will be signed which hogtie any of our well-intended regulations, our healthcare system will still consist of a giant hemorrhage of government money into private insurers and big pharma, and we'll still be facing an unpayable public and private debt.


I love America, I really do. So then what?

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Originally posted by JO753:
Got an email from my congressman, Randy Hultgren (R). It wuz a standard GoP blitherblather about 'our energy future' attempting to make it look like they arent working for the fossil fuel industry.

I sent a reply about wuts really going on:

Quote:

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Dear Mr. Hultgren,

I have been reading The Federalist Papers.

One of the big concerns of the founding fathers was the danger of foreign powers influencing people within our government. They go into some detail about how the ancient Greek city-state's attempts at democracy would always fail due to foreign actors taking advantage of internal rivalries.

If Hamilton, Madison, Jay, or any of the founding fathers were around today to witness what is going on with Trump and Putin, they would surely be aghast at the dismal failure of their creation.

They would instantly see that the wrench jamming the gears is party loyalty gaining priority over patriotism.

Even without the treasonous conspiracy, they would be appalled that such a carnival barker clown had managed to gain the Presidency and that he has yet to be impeached in spite of the non-stop goofs, lies and bafoonery.

I am sorry to have to inform you of this, but it is glaringly obvious that you and all the Republicans in the highest offices in the land are not adhering to your oath of office. You are failing to do your duty. The separation of powers cannot work when your loyalty is to your party rather than the nation. You are participating in treason, even if your only crime is inaction.

I understand you are not a major player in Congress, but that is no excuse. Your duty is to your local constituents and the United States of America, not the GOP.

I do not know the intricacies of your political situation or how things 'work' in Washington, but I suggest that if you can't get a coalition of Republican congressmen together to oust Ryan, call for Trump's impeachment, or otherwise end Putin's control over The White House, switch to Democrat or declare yourself an independent with a strong statement as to why.

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I'm about 85% sure there will be no respons. Randy just goez along to get along. A career politician, very comfortable in hiz jerrymandered GoP district.

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Secret contributions were the driving force behind the criminal activities in the Watergate scandal. They included million-dollar payoffs, bribery, and regular, organized extortion of companies and individuals, both American and foreign, by operatives for Richard Nixon.

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Originally posted by THGRRI:

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Originally posted by THGRRI:
Did Trump sanction Flynns discussions with Russia at the very time Putin was hacking us and trying to have an influence on our election? Just this morning Flynn tweeted "scapegoat"

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Yep

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
So, I'm going to add something about the role of Special Prosecutor.

In my memory, two Presidents have been investigated by a Special Prosecutor: Nixon, and Clinton, and subsequently been impeached.

I don't remember much about the Nixon impeachment,

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As you all know, I'm no fan of Bill Clinton. I think he's a corrupt sexual predator who - along with Hillary- concocted any number of shady transactions to enrich himself at every level of public office, including (for all I know) running drugs thru Arkanas. HOWEVER. IMHO articles of impeachment should be limited to what a person does AS PRESIDENT. Special Prosecutors and Independent Counsels should not have license to engage in free-ranging unlimited witch hunts. Uncovering of NON-Presidential crimes should be investigated and prosecuted ordinarily, and not be part of articles of impeachment.

That was my opinion then, and it's my opinion now. It applies equally to Bill, Bush, Obama, Trump, and any other President.

My criticism of Bill AS PRESIDENT has to do with what he did AS PRESIDENT, and that includes

repealing Glass Steagall
promoting and signing the DMCA
promoting and signing NAFTA and CAFTA and creating a special trade partnership with China
promoting and signing the Commodities Futures Trading Modernization Act
"Ending Welfare as We Know It", AND, as I was recently reminded
Deregulating the media which allowed six companies ownership of 90% of the market

The "punishment" for these horrible policies shouldn't be impeachment, but simply being voted out of office .... which is why I refused to vote for Bill the second time around.

Again, should apply to all Presidents, and is an example of what I call even-handed application of ethics and rules.

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So, I'm going to add something about the role of Special Prosecutor.

In my memory, two Presidents have been investigated by a Special Prosecutor: Nixon, and Clinton, and subsequently been impeached.
I don't remember much about the Nixon impeachment, - SIGNY

Mostly because it never happened, other than in your dreams and fantasies. Don't fight the facts, let the truth set your mind free from the yoke of delusional Libtardism- JSF

The second investigation - of Bill Clinton- began with the DOJ appointment of Robert Fiske as Special Prosecutor. His remit was Whitewater in relation to the suicide of Vince Foster. When he failed to find ... SIGNY

The Rose Law Firm Billing Records which Hilliary kept illegally sequestered in her White House closet, nor enough of the mountain of evidence for certain proof of - JSF

...wrongdoing, the Republican Congress appointed an Independent Counsel - Ken Starr- to endlessly crawl up Clinton's anus until he found or created something with which to hang Bill.

The resulting articles of impeachment were ... SIGNY

weak tea amid Bill and Hilliary's escape from justice due their long list of criminal perpetrations.... JSF

... As you all know, I'm no fan of Bill Clinton. I think he's a corrupt sexual predator who - along with Hillary- concocted any number of shady transactions to enrich himself at every level of public office, including (for all I know) running drugs thru Arkanas. HOWEVER. IMHO articles of impeachment should be limited to what a person does AS PRESIDENT. Special Prosecutors and Independent Counsels should not have license to engage in free-ranging unlimited witch hunts. Uncovering of NON-Presidential crimes should be investigated and prosecuted ordinarily, and not be part of articles of impeachment.

That was my opinion then, and it's my opinion now. It applies equally to Bill, Bush, Obama, Trump, and any other President.

My criticism of Bill AS PRESIDENT has to do with what he did AS PRESIDENT, and that includes

repealing Glass Steagall
promoting and signing the DMCA
promoting and signing NAFTA and CAFTA and creating a special trade partnership with China
promoting and signing the Commodities Futures Trading Modernization Act
"Ending Welfare as We Know It", AND, as I was recently reminded
Deregulating the media which allowed six companies ownership of 90% of the market

The "punishment" for these horrible policies shouldn't be impeachment, but simply being voted out of office .... which is why I refused to vote for Bill the second time around.

Again, should apply to all Presidents, and is an example of what I call even-handed application of ethics and rules.- SIGNY

Your memory has failed epically. 2 Presidents have been Impeached. Both Democrats. Neither named Nixon. Nixon was not one of the 3 Impeachments. No matter how many times you dredge out this delusion from your fantasies and pretend it is a fact, does not make it so.- JSF

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I'll bet you dollars to donuts that if there is anything brought against Trump, it won't have diddly-squat to do with Russia.

This is probably going to turn out like Bill Clinton .... they dug and dug and dug and dug and came up with .... not an affair with "that women" but the fact that he lied to Congress about it. What you'll see is a lot of goalpost-moving ... not "collusion" exactly and not Russia at all but something else ... maybe something in his business affairs.

But yanno, it occurred to me ... why fight the hysteria?

Let's say that you get your wish, and Trump is impeached. Even better, Congress is returned to the Dems.

But the USA will still be de-industrialized, wealth inequality will still increase, there will still be endless wars at random throughout the globe, trade agreements will be signed which hogtie any of our well-intended regulations, our healthcare system will still consist of a giant hemorrhage of government money into private insurers and big pharma, and we'll still be facing an unpayable public and private debt.


I love America, I really do. So then what? ...

Apparently nobody is able to answer the question.

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78% Of US Workers Are Living 'Paycheck-To-Paycheck' & 71% Of Them Are In Debt

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Ex-British spy [was] paid $168,000 for Trump dossier, U.S. firm discloses

A Washington research firm paid a former British spy’s company $168,000 for work on a dossier outlining Russian financial and personal links to Donald Trump’s 2016 election campaign, the U.S. firm said in a statement on Wednesday...

Fusion GPS’ statement said it had told Congress about how $168,000 was paid last year to Orbis Business Intelligence, Steele’s company.

The money paid to Orbis was taken from $1.02 million it received in fees and expenses from the Perkins Coie law firm, the statement said. The law firm represented the Democratic National Committee and Hillary Clinton’s presidential campaign ...

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

But yanno, it occurred to me ... why fight the hysteria?

Let's say that you get your wish, and Trump is impeached. Even better, Congress is returned to the Dems.

But the USA will still be de-industrialized, wealth inequality will still increase, there will still be endless wars at random throughout the globe, trade agreements will be signed which hogtie any of our well-intended regulations, our healthcare system will still consist of a giant hemorrhage of government money into private insurers and big pharma, and we'll still be facing an unpayable public and private debt.

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Picked from your list a simple example where the two parties take opposite sides: "wealth inequality will still increase". Today's headline was With wrinkles ironed out, Republicans unveil tax plan Under that was Bill writer Brady heralds measure, while Democrats denounce it as giveaway to rich= SECOND

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

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Picked from your list a simple example where the two parties take opposite sides: "wealth inequality will still increase". Today's headline was With wrinkles ironed out, Republicans unveil tax plan Under that was Bill writer Brady heralds measure, while Democrats denounce it as giveaway to rich= SECOND

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And yet, despite the Dems pious mouthings, wealth inequality increased under Obama at the SAME RATE as it increased under Bush ... and under Clinton.

Do you know what YOUR problem is, hon? You do what you constantly accuse ME of doing with Trump: you believe what the Dems tell you!

I mean, you're CONSTANTLY posting things like ... "Did you really believe Trump would accomplish anything?" (not really) and " ... if you believed anything (anything at all) Trump said before or after election, you are stupid"/

Let me turn that around on you.

SECOND, if you believed anything (anything at all) Trump Obama/ Hillary/ Bill said before or after election, you are stupid.

CLEARLY, you believe a lot of things that the Dems SAY that they're for, but somehow never manage to accomplish, and despite their repeated failures and lies, you still manage to keep on believing, and promoting.

Now THAT'S stupid!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

Ex-British spy [was] paid $168,000 for Trump dossier, U.S. firm discloses

In other words, the DNC and Hillary Clinton, thru their common law firm, paid Russians[s] for "dirt" on Trump.

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Ex-British spy [was] paid $168,000 for Trump dossier, U.S. firm discloses
In other words, the DNC and Hillary Clinton, thru their common law firm, paid Russians[s] for "dirt" on Trump.- SIGNY

Steele, the ex-British spy iz British, not Russian.

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Originally posted by 1kiki:
"The only thing that can really dent rampant and long-lasting economic inequality is violence."

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Great, give it a go in Russia and let us know how it works out.

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Originally posted by 1kiki:
I was quoting SECOND, so it must be SECOND who's going to Russia. Do try to keep up.

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If you're going to quote someone here it's very easy. The program does it for you. What you did in no way suggests you were quoting SECOND. See how I just quoted you? You've really got to be an ass to fuck that up. Like I said, it's very easy. Do try and get it right.

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Originally posted by second:
Signym, the problem is that problems cannot be solved by only a few people in high positions coming together in goodwill and trust to devise a solution. My real world experience is that nothing happens easily. I have an instance on solving the inequality problem:

In his new book, The Great Leveler: Violence and the History of Inequality from the Stone Age to the Twenty-First Century, the Austrian historian Walter Scheidel puts forth a depressing and thought-provoking thesis: The only thing that can really dent rampant and long-lasting economic inequality is violence.

Violence in the book is broadly defined: It can refer to war, or to political upheaval, or to natural disasters. But the conclusion — that one ill can only be solved via some form of suffering — is an unsettling one, especially in an America rife with inequality.

Walter Scheidel: It was essentially looking at history in the very long run and trying to identify the driving forces behind significant reductions in inequality. Everywhere I looked, over hundreds of thousands of years, I found that every single time you observe such a compression, such a reduction, it was always linked to some very massive, violent shock that usually cost millions of lives, and I haven’t really been able to find any significant counterexamples.

www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/interrogation/2017/11/is_viol
ence_the_only_way_to_end_inequality.html

My conviction is that the Democrats cannot solve the inequality problem without busting open many Republicans' heads, but that's just me, not the Democratic Party's position.
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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