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Article on Chud about Serenity and its Fans
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 7:32 AM
Freedom is Important because People are Important
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 7:39 AM
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 7:59 AM
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 8:00 AM
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 8:07 AM
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 8:14 AM
Quote:Originally posted by TheLurker:
I have personally spoken to many fans of the show and sci fi fans in general, who have no desire to see this movie, or ANY movie in a theater. The reason they give is that it's actually cheaper for them to buy it than to take the whole family out to the theater and with movie prices, gas prices, inconsiderate moviegoers, etc., it just isn't worth the hassle to go out, when they can have it at home in a few months.
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 8:15 AM
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 8:20 AM
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 8:21 AM
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 8:41 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Howard:
In fact both Joss and UNIVERSAL are stupid and cowards for not taking a chance and making a truly bilingual English/Chinese SERENITY. The truth is a movie released even today with 50% Mandarin dialogue would have made MORE money not less.
The Chinese and Indian economies are set to take over world trade in years ahead.
A FIREFLY world for sure.
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 8:58 AM
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 9:23 AM
May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 9:40 AM
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 9:42 AM
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Tuesday, October 11, 2005 11:03 AM
Quote:Originally posted by bonzob on Whedonesque:
This makes me angry in many ways. Especially the "it shouldn't be a movie" part. I love when internet critics just ignore a whole boatload of positive reviews to make it sound like their opinion is absolute fact. So according to rottentomatoes, there are 90 critics who would disagree with your assesment. While the box office is not that great, it's also not the end. Joss has always said this will be a word of mouth movie.
Quote:Originally posted by Odysseus on Whedonesque:
I pretty much disagree with everything the guy said. But having read some of his past articles about Firefly/Serenity I have a lot of trouble even taking him seriously. I'm ok with him having a different opinion. I just don't like the snide tone he takes to express it.
The snide attitude comes in when he says the movie shouldn't have been made - kind of backhands his comment about it deserving to do well. How can a movie that "deserves to do well" not deserve to be made? He says it's lazy writing like it's a fact not an opinion. He acts like he is 100 percent certain there will be fan backlash, saying we will blame Universal. The last paragraph he insults us for our "finger pointing" that I have yet to even see.
Quote:Originally posted by Unitas:
Oh, does anyone agree with Devin's last comment? Is hardcore fanning (is this a word?) turning people off of some movies? Personally, I don't really see it. Star Trek just seemed to run out of steam (finally). Star Wars is the biggest film of the year. As for Serenity, I have hard time believing that the fan base was so difficult that it literally kept a sizeable number people out of theatres. That seems a little much.
Quote:Originally posted by eddy on Whedonesque:
Oh and "more than slightly ashamed that they conferred a weird group identity upon themselves." is a total slap in the face to all fandoms IMO. What is wrong with being part of a group? The thing I can take out of all Joss' shows is that its a good thing to be part of a group who have the same goals and interests and that if you work together you can accomplish anything.
Quote:Originally posted by jenolen on Whedonesque:
"The film will, most likely, make some money overseas (although I tend to think not in non-English markets) and will definitely earn a bunch on DVD, but domestic box office is generally what it’s all about."
... means he is either totally out of touch with the realities of the entertainment business, or has, at best, an amateur-level understanding of the economics of moviemaking.
Some proof? How about this quote, from Variety, courtesy the View Askewniverse:
But as DVD revenues become more important to studios -- in 2003, DVD sales totaled $11.9 billion, according to Variety sibling Video Business, nearly 30% bigger than the $9.2 billion in U.S. box office that year -- studios began to look for talent who could move units at Wal-Mart the same way Cruise fills seats at the multiplex... DVD dollars are worth more to the studios than box office dollars, because they keep the lion's share of homevideo revenues.
Hmm. DVD sales... Anybody here know a franchise launched on the basis of fantastic DVD sales? Not to mention...
Foreign B.O. used to be an afterthought in the movie biz, gravy that could pad studio balance sheets. But as it grew, stars emerged, like Sylvester Stallone or Charles Bronson, whose pics -- hits or flops -- seemed to magically double their U.S. grosses when sent abroad.
I'm not worried about the future of the franchise. At a budget of $40 million, this movie will make money for Universal. And, more importantly, it should make enough, when all ancillary revenues are counted, to earn a green-light for future films, provided they stay in the same budgetary ballpark.
Quote:Originally posted by phlebotinin on Whedonesque:
Devin must be *loving* this controversy and the continued links from whedonesque to his editorials. He's getting free and fabulous advertising. And it's not over! The crazy pot keeps getting stirred and we've got another editorial to look forward to. I agree with those who wish this would just die already.
Quote:Originally posted by Allyson on Whedonesque:
No one would have read this if it hadn't been posted here to begin with. Seriously, if I want to sell a lot of books, I'm going to call it, "Browncoats Smell Like Poo." It will fly off the shelves.
He's like a little kid who learned how to get attention by lighting things on fire.
Quote:Originally posted by killinj:
I still find it hard to believe that there are enough of these obnoxious Browncoats to make as big a difference as Devin claims. Yes, I'm sure its put off a lot of people who visit AICN or other sites that have been canvassed alot with news and praise for Serenity. But, the number of people who visit those sites and read those threads are no where near representative of the general SCI-FI population. Honestly, I think the biggest problem with Serenity is that people (outside the Internet junkies) haven't heard of the film and don't know what it's about. No doubt, he has some valid critisms and we've got some loonie fans. I just think more of the article should have focused on the other explanations (and he provide some) for why the box office didn't meet expectations.
Quote:Originally posted by dizzy on Whedonesque:
The fact that he reads up on all the Firefly/Sernity sites to gauge the fan reaction to his articles speaks volumes to me.
Quote:Originally posted by Zoic_Fan on Whedonesque:
Firefly fans have been in denial from the moment Firefly was premiered on a Friday night in 2002 and we are still in denial now and will continue to be in denial all through its DVD release and we will probably be in denial when the third movie comes out and again when the Sci-Fi channel produces a spin-off series and all that time we will have to put up with people like this telling us that we should give up, because there is no way that this series will continue in any way shape or form.
Never underestimate the Browncoats.
Quote:Originally posted by IMMORTAL on Whedonesque:
I don't agree with the use of fans as a marketing tool. It's not like Universal had all this money earmarked for marketing and decided to pull it and use the fans instead. Whatever the fans did in terms of marketing would not have been there otherwise.
I think any prospects for a sequel whether it be theatrical or direct to DVD is premature. I think a strong argument can be made for either. This seems to be an odd month and I feel the percentages are there if the dollars aren't. It took 1500 more screens for W&G to get a $16 million dollar weekend. Percentage wise Serenity has gotten it's share of the total dollars spent. I'm pretty sure the story will continue even if it's in novelization or comic book form.
"The Browncoats are mostly self-identified, and the Browncoats I’m talking about here are the sort of rabid fans who call it “our” movie, as if they made it)..." Joss has said on numerous occasions that it was the fan's movie. "The fans made it possible" has been the company line.
Quote:Originally posted by KBP on Whedonesque:
A 22 paragraph article that reads exactly the same as the last thing he wrote?
And we're the obsessive ones?
Quote:Originally posted by EdDantes on Whedonesque:
I was somehow actually still expecting him to come up with SOMEthing new to say. But not so much. 'I told you so', 'Browncoats are nerds!', etc. And still the claims that it's not for publicity. That actually made me smile a little. He should go into politics. It takes a certain chutzpah to actually say such things and believe you sound credible anymore.
A particularly funny line I thought was about how people 'shouldn't' see a movie several times, apparently for no other reason than that he thinks they shouldn't. Oddly enough I think most of us still tend to make those decisions for ourselves. I don't recall Universal twisting my arm.
Quote:Originally posted by technovamp on Whedonesque:
I think some of Devin's article is interesting and raises valid questions. The main point he misses is that there is a fight going on about getting quality shows onto TV and film and Joss is very much a focal point in that fight. We don't have many good ways of getting involved in that, apart from buying lots of DVD's. There may be issues about fan involvement with Universal marketing but I think they are secondary to the fact that they have done something good and do deserve support from anybody who cares about that.
I can answer one of his questions. I've been in various fandoms since the 70's and the Browncoats aren't rabid at all by comparison.
Unfortunately it isn't just about a sequel to 'Serenity'. It's about how good the movies and TV are going to be. I'll be sad if we don't get a sequel. I'll get over it if we get more good stuff from Joss and others (and if the cast get lots of good work) but I don't think I'll get over it if I there is nothing good in its place. Supporting 'Serenity' is about more than being a fan of just one movie.
Quote:Originally posted by EdDantes on Whedonesque:
I'm sorry but no fan was taken advantage of. No one was tricked, or lied to or forced to do anything. Any Browncoat, from mellow and polite to overzelous and fanatical, that tried to help the movie in any way, did so out of free will. No one ever calls it 'taken advantage of' when people volunteer to help in the campaign of their political candidate of choice do they?
“Devin's point never seemed to be that the fandom existed or was hyped on the radio -- rather his point was that the fandom was creepy and disturbing and overzealous. He said it wasn't the marketing but the fan evangelism that was the problem.”
Yes and as many others pointed out during the many times Devin repeated that same point: that argument doesn't stand.
The only people that could've turned this into a hit are the mainstream audiences. The mainstream audiences barely know about Serenity. What they know often doesn't help. (No name actors, the words 'failed TV show' popping up, they think it's about a girl named 'Serenity, some think it's got aliens, some think it's a chick flic, etc.)
What the mainstream audience does not really know of however, is 'Browncoats'. And even if they did, if they were initially attracted to the movie, they'd still go. The mainstream audiences are completely aware about the fanatical Star Wars fans for example. They see them on the news, dressed up in the streets, sleeping on the sidewalk for weeks or even months before the movie opens. People laugh at them, find them creepy and nerdy and can't believe they are so weird! And then they still go to see the new Star Wars movie.
Serenity just didn't reach enough people in spite of everyone's best efforts. (Well apart from the piss-poor second week advertising).
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 11:09 AM
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Tuesday, October 11, 2005 6:35 PM
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 7:19 PM
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 7:23 PM
I'm going to kill them all. That oughtta distract 'em
Tuesday, October 11, 2005 9:35 PM
Wednesday, October 12, 2005 1:52 AM
Quote:Originally posted by StakeTheLurk:
This is the third in a series of articles in which he basically repeats the same ideas.
Wednesday, October 12, 2005 3:10 AM
Wednesday, October 12, 2005 6:07 AM
Wednesday, October 12, 2005 6:09 AM
Wednesday, October 12, 2005 11:04 AM
Thursday, October 13, 2005 10:52 AM
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