Humanity Is in Danger of Becoming Obsolete... by captaincrunch

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

I would prefer a comedy: Upload. It is about dead people living in virtual reality and interacting with live people. On the show, a download from the computer back into a clone hasn't been perfected, yet, but failures are funny when it is attempted.

Upload Reviews at metacritic:
www.metacritic.com/tv/upload

Season 2 will be coming along one of these days:
https://www.inverse.com/entertainment/upload-season-2-release-date-tra
iler-cast-plot-amazon

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 4:15 PM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

There are a lot of things sci-fi discusses that can't happen - like instantaneous travel to other solar systems and humans inhabiting alien worlds.

This is another one of them. With all of our best bought-and-paid-for minds working on it, we can't even get an AI-driven car that doesn't kill its passengers. We can't even get traditional software to pilot a plane that doesn't drive it nose down into the ground.

And AI doesn't even train correctly, so you need a human at the end giving thumbs up or thumbs down - you can't get identical computers with identical OSes and identical software to train the same on identical training sets and come up with the same - or even reasonable - endpoints.

On top of that, AI in no way resembles human thought.

And when it comes to clones, nature's been doing that since life started reproducing. And human clones - called identical twins - are obviously not identical.

In the end, it's entertaining to imagine all sorts of impossible ideas - what if people could fly based on their thoughts alone? What if people could get to- and live on- alien planets? What if we could build a real human like the original, but better? Or encode a real human on a chip?

But considering it as a serious question is just hubris - people thinking they're better at doing something than they can ever be.

BTW, I can't remember the name of the science fiction story, but it talked about encoding a trained pilot - in this case a woman - into a computer, so they could pilot a starship, as the only way to survive the trip to the stars. And one of the things that the story pointed out is that you need the AI equivalent of senses and body chemicals for the electronic-human brain, to keep those electronic equivalents sane. What is the electronic equivalent of serotonin, or dopamine, or oxytocin, or any of the other thousands of brain chemicals floating around in the wet-brain?

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 4:30 PM

I am rapidly approaching the need for a bot clone for myself. Do you think I'll be able to get one soon?

T

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 4:32 PM

I don't know about that...

I think it's just a case of throwing enough money at a problem until it's not a problem anymore.

Our tech just can't replicate or improve upon human thought yet.

That's not to say that our current level of tech wouldn't be able to do so, but many aspects of how the human brain actually works are still a mystery, so trying to code something that complex with so many missing pieces is essentially a game of brute force programming that probably hasn't seen too many software upgrades since the first A.I. that could beat human chess masters was created. A lot more of those gains seen in the decades that came after owe their success to the fact that computers today are just capable of so much more than they were 30 years ago and we wouldn't have seen much impressive improvement in A.I. based off of the software side alone.

Until we actually unlock all of the secrets and along with it any hidden potential that the human brain has on offer, the only thing to do really is just wait... We'll never replicate a human brain perfectly through code if we can't actually map every function of the brain first, but with enough processing power we'll get to "good enough" eventually.

As terrifying a thought as that is...

The first draft of anything is shit. :)

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 4:34 PM

I know I made a thread about it before, but if you have the free time you really should give this a watch if you haven't already...

The first draft of anything is shit. :)

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 4:35 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

There are a lot of things sci-fi discusses that can't happen - like instantaneous travel to other solar systems and humans inhabiting alien worlds.

Much of todays space programs are targeted towards colonizing other planets. Yet kiki in her all her wisdom, not, says it'll never happen. Hmmm, who to believe, kiki or our scientists? Boy that's a tough one.

T

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 4:42 PM

And a real world example of what I'm talking about with the vast amount of technological resources at our disposal today compared to what we used to have to work with 25-30 years ago would be perfectly explained with a game like DOOM from ID Software.

A technological marvel for its time, you could run that game on any 33MHz PC that had only 4MB of RAM, and it was run from a floppy disk that had only 1.44MB of space on it. It was amazing what the coders of that game were able to achieve with such limited specs, and the coding process must have been brutal.

Now we're rocking 6 to 10 core processors that can be overclocked to over 4GHz with around a maximum of 128GB memory on consumer PCs (and a theoretical maximum of Terrabytes) and you can pick up a 10TB external hard drive on Amazon for under $200.

With all of these new hardware upgrades in modern computing, making efficient code isn't a priority anymore, and hasn't been for years.

That comes with a lot of pitfalls.

The first draft of anything is shit. :)

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 4:49 PM

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

With all of our best bought-and-paid-for minds working on it, we can't even get an AI-driven car that doesn't kill its passengers.

Really? JJ Ricks has taken a hundred rides and he's not dead. Here are 4 rides:

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 5:06 PM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

https://carsurance.net/blog/self-driving-car-statistics/

On average, there are 9.1 self-driving car accidents per million miles driven, while the same rate is 4.1 crashes per million miles for regular vehicles.

Maybe you're better off just getting drunk and driving yourself.

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 5:26 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:
Humanity Is in Danger of Becoming Obsolete...

Only if we let it.

I mean, who is driving that particular "human obsolesence" bus, anyway? Certainly not the average human. It's just that automation is so darn .... PROFITABLE.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#WEARAMASK

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 7:30 PM

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

https://carsurance.net/blog/self-driving-car-statistics/

On average, there are 9.1 self-driving car accidents per million miles driven, while the same rate is 4.1 crashes per million miles for regular vehicles.

Maybe you're better off just getting drunk and driving yourself.

The correct comparison is between the accident rate for the best self-driving car company, not the worst or the average company. The best company has turned its cars loose on the streets as taxis. https://waymo.com/

There are fleets of self-driving 18 wheeler trucks in California, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas. https://waymo.com/waymo-via/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 8:21 PM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

Any so-called AI driver needs to be trained to "see" literally **EVERY**thing.

Simple edges. Connecting edges into their 2-D correct shapes separated from background edges. Identifying those shapes correctly as things, no matter their orientation - like a bicycle from a side view, a rear view, a front view, and everything in between. Or a human - maybe on crutches, or a skateboard, or in a wheel chair - from any orientation.

The Tesla that drove the car under the side of a semi (killing its driver) didn't "see" the side of the truck because it couldn't find the edges of the whitish trailer against a whitish sky. https://www.consumerreports.org/car-safety/tesla-driver-in-fatal-march
-crash-was-using-autopilot-ntsb-says/ The Uber car that killed a woman walking her bicycle across the street in Arizona failed to classify her as a pedestrian. https://www.bicycling.com/news/a25616551/uber-self-driving-car-crash-c
yclist/

What the company you posted boasts of is its large training set. What it DOESN'T say is if their vehicles are limited to specific areas and specific routes. Nowhere does it claim you can auto drive from your anywhere GPS to your anywhere GPS. IIRC, last time I checked out that particular company, their cabs were restricted to particular areas and their trucks were restricted to particular routes.

And then there are always holes in what the software knows to expect. I remember when (I was a passenger and) a small flock of Canada geese flying overhead let their bowels loose in a coordinated effort and literally plastered the windshield with shit. Another time, as a driver, I spent a few frantic minutes trying to avoid a significant birdstrike. Yet another time I had to deal with young male drivers aggressively tailgating. And so on.

And then there are the completely unexpected 'objects' that simply don't exist in the AI 'mind', because it hasn't been trained to sense and respond to the unclassified and hence unseen. We would intuitively know a human on a "cycle", whether it's a clown on a 12' tall unicycle, or a human pedaling a stripped out go-cart. And we would avoid it, because ... human. An AI would just barrel forward because it would sense there was 'nothing' in its pathway.

AI has a LONG way to go to replace a human driver on a anywhere to anywhere trip on real roads with real stuff happening.

And they are STILL twice as accident prone as the human driver, with all the drunk, timid, or aggressive assholes or otherwise bad drivers averaged in.

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 11:03 PM

Yep. Great news.

Let's put the truck drivers out of work with AI first.

Second only seems to be a Democrat when it suits him, huh?

The first draft of anything is shit. :)

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 11:05 PM

Oh, and 9 times out of 10 in 2020 when you're being aggressively tailgated it is by a female driver.

The first draft of anything is shit. :)

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Saturday, January 2, 2021 11:08 PM

Speaking of Deep Blue...

This is freakin' hilarious.

The first draft of anything is shit. :)

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 2:16 AM

WISHIMAY

Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Oh, and 9 times out of 10 in 2020 when you're being aggressively tailgated it is by a female driver.

I've covered this a dozen times, you are still

Men are more aggressive drivers across the board, it's why insurance rates are higher for males.

I have a feeling you are just extra special sensitive to women wanting you to hurry up, but when men tailgate you they must just have somewhere more important to be, right??

Women are aaaafter you 6ix.

They're behiiind youuuuuu.

They want you out of the way because you are uselessss OOooohhhhhh

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 2:24 AM

WISHIMAY

Quote:
Originally posted by THG:
I am rapidly approaching the need for a bot clone for myself. Do you think I'll be able to get one soon?

Only if you got beaucoup bucks, or you just happen to be related to a Gates, or a Musk, ect..

Good news is, as long as this board is here, you are too.

Unfortunately, so are the idiots.

Maybe hope there is a cyber hell??

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 7:58 AM

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

Any so-called AI driver needs to be trained to "see" literally **EVERY**thing.
. . .
AI has a LONG way to go to replace a human driver on a anywhere to anywhere trip on real roads with real stuff happening.

What percent of humans can drive a car anywhere? What percent can drive an 18 wheeler anywhere? Not that many can do it.

If a self-driving vehicle can do a job with some severe limitations -- can't drive an 18 wheeler on icy roads or in heavy storms -- it will still be a useful machine that will make some humans obsolete (the ones identifying their reason for existing is driving for a living).

Obviously, there aren't many self-driving machines out there to do that manual work but the machines do exist and will get better faster than you expect. Once upon a time, there were billions of jobs in farming and mining that could be mechanized, at least in theory. After a couple hundred years of engineers working to make part of the jobs obsolete, some of those people who were farmers and miners eventually became obsolete farmers and miners.
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=zq9V

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=zqa1

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=zqaO

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 8:25 AM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

"What percent of humans can drive a car anywhere?"

People do it every day GPS to GPS. If they didn't they'd probably be driving up and down their driveway for their entire lives.

Personally, I've driven cross country west to east, and on a second trip north to south and back again. And both were drives I've never taken before. And I'm not that special.

Maybe you can't drive new places given a car and a map or a GPS, but most people can manage to drive anywhere they need or want to go.

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 8:58 AM

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

"What percent of humans can drive a car anywhere?"

People do it every day GPS to GPS. If they didn't they'd probably be driving up and down their driveway for their entire lives.

Personally, I've driven cross country west to east, and on a second trip north to south and back again. And both were drives I've never taken before. And I'm not that special.

Maybe you can't drive new places given a car and a map or a GPS, but most people can manage to drive anywhere they need or want to go.

Once upon a time, half of all Americans spent all their working days growing the food for the other half. They could do it again, but they haven't, so far, and that put millions of farmers out of work, making them obsolete. The same could happen to driving for a living, making some, not all, professional drivers obsolete. If you want, keep driving your car and keep farming vegetables in your garden and even mining, if it gives your life meaning, but please do NOT expect driving, farming and coal-mining (for one politically supercharged occupation) to be increasing sources of jobs and meaningful living because engineers are doing their very best work, year after year for centuries, at mechanizing those jobs.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 9:57 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

https://carsurance.net/blog/self-driving-car-statistics/

On average, there are 9.1 self-driving car accidents per million miles driven, while the same rate is 4.1 crashes per million miles for regular vehicles.

Aww, FIFI! Why did you leave out this detail from your quote?

"At the moment, self-driving cars have a higher rate of accidents compared to human-driven cars, but the injuries are less serious. On average, there are 9.1 self-driving car accidents per million miles driven, while the same rate is 4.1 crashes per million miles for regular vehicles."

I thought you were a science person? That better science demands full review of all details, that its essential to our full understanding? What happened? I'm disappointed. It's like you fudged the data to meet a predetermined outcome. I think they call that, "Crap Science."

I feel like this omission by you is evidence that you just can't be trusted...

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 10:38 AM

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

Quote:
Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

https://carsurance.net/blog/self-driving-car-statistics/

On average, there are 9.1 self-driving car accidents per million miles driven, while the same rate is 4.1 crashes per million miles for regular vehicles.

Aww, FIFI! Why did you leave out this detail from your quote?

"At the moment, self-driving cars have a higher rate of accidents compared to human-driven cars, but the injuries are less serious. On average, there are 9.1 self-driving car accidents per million miles driven, while the same rate is 4.1 crashes per million miles for regular vehicles."

I thought you were a science person? That better science demands full review of all details, that its essential to our full understanding? What happened? I'm disappointed. It's like you fudged the data to meet a predetermined outcome. I think they call that, "Crap Science."

I feel like this omission by you is evidence that you just can't be trusted...

Maybe 1kiki was trying to spread the idea, without actually saying it plainly, that self-driving autos cannot make human drivers obsolete because average humans are better drivers than average self-driving autos. I'm pretty sure that average humans are capable of doing only a little better, even given decades to improve. On the other hand, 100,000 better-than-average engineers are capable of improving one self-driving auto to an as yet unknown level of accident free driving. Once that single auto is created, then it can be duplicated on an assembly line that takes a day to build a car from start to finish. It is impossible to duplicate the best human drivers in a day. That is how human drivers become obsolete -- when average humans learn slowly while self-driving machines learn in a day more than the average human can know in a long lifetime about driving safely.

Tesla is trying to solve the problem of the self-driving car. With enough time, talent and money, Tesla or some other company might succeed. I don't know if enough engineering talent is working on the problem but at this time the money is there until Tesla stock price crashes: Tesla’s market value sits at nearly $670 billion. That amounts to $1.3 million per car sold last year, and is about seven times the combined market values of Ford and General Motors.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/cleared-hurdle-still-leaves-tesla-stock-i
n-ludicrous-mode-11609622182

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 11:44 AM

What you guys are failing to consider here is that any deaths are too many deaths when it comes to rolling out AI.

Unlike Kiki, I don't think that it will take very long before AI drivers are better than human beings in 99.9% of any possible situation you can throw at them because even if we don't know how the human brain works yet, we will make even more technological advancements in hardware that will just allow more inefficient means of programming to brute force their way to success.

But just being better at driving than humans isn't going to be enough. Especially when 3.5 million people who earn enough to reasonably support a family by driving trucks are going to be put on the unemployment lines when it rolls out in full force.

There's test drives in small scale being made. Wisconsin's expressways around Madison are being expanded to allow AI vehicles a lane for themselves.

But what happens if there is a death on that lane due to AI?

People die every day of fatal auto accidents, but that's been the truth since we all started driving and it doesn't make front page news. In most cases it was due to human error.

But what about when it wasn't human error?

Do you remember Firestone Tires and the Ford Pinto?

Chances are that even if you never owned them or knew somebody who owned them, you still know what was wrong with them in 2021.

The first draft of anything is shit. :)

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 12:30 PM

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
What you guys are failing to consider here is that any deaths are too many deaths when it comes to rolling out AI.

But what about when it wasn't human error?

Do you remember Firestone Tires and the Ford Pinto?

Chances are that even if you never owned them or knew somebody who owned them, you still know what was wrong with them in 2021.

Self-Driving Vehicles will make human drivers obsolete, but NOT human judges, lawyers and juries:

Self-Driving Car Manufacturers May Be Safe From Lawsuits Even If Their Cars Cause Accidents
https://thesuffolkpersonalinjurylawyer.com/self-driving-car-defects-ma
nufacturer-may-never-face-lawsuit/

Who Can Be Held Liable When Self-Driving Cars Crash?
www.classaction.com/self-driving-cars/lawsuit/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 12:49 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by WISHIMAY:
Quote:
Originally posted by THG:
I am rapidly approaching the need for a bot clone for myself. Do you think I'll be able to get one soon?

Only if you got beaucoup bucks, or you just happen to be related to a Gates, or a Musk, ect..

Good news is, as long as this board is here, you are too.
Unfortunately, so are the idiots.

Maybe hope there is a cyber hell??

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 12:54 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by WISHIMAY:
Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Oh, and 9 times out of 10 in 2020 when you're being aggressively tailgated it is by a female driver.

I've covered this a dozen times, you are still

Men are more aggressive drivers across the board, it's why insurance rates are higher for males.

I have a feeling you are just extra special sensitive to women wanting you to hurry up, but when men tailgate you they must just have somewhere more important to be, right??

Women are aaaafter you 6ix. They're behiiind youuuuuu.
They want you out of the way because you are uselessss OOooohhhhhh

Data gathered by the American Automobile Association Foundation for Traffic Safety found that 79% of American drivers demonstrate aggressive behaviors when behind the wheel. Speeding tops the list of aggressive behaviors, with men being the biggest culprit.

AAA survey finds road rage a national problem; shows men are more aggressive behind the wheel than women.

First, as you know wishie, Jack=ass is just trolling. What he posts is 99% incorrect and not based on researched evidence.

Second, he is gay and hates women. No doubt wish, he is gay and hates women.

T

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 1:02 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by THG:
Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

There are a lot of things sci-fi discusses that can't happen - like instantaneous travel to other solar systems and humans inhabiting alien worlds.

Much of todays space programs are targeted towards colonizing other planets. Yet kiki in her all her wisdom, not, says it'll never happen. Hmmm, who to believe, kiki or our scientists? Boy that's a tough one.

T

Stephen Hawking warned that humans must colonize another planet or face extinction. In his upcoming documentary "Stephen Hawking: Expedition New Earth", the physicist says Earth is becoming "increasingly precarious" because of threats from epidemics and asteroids.

T

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 1:58 PM

I tried the world's first no-kill, lab-grown chicken burger

“This burger takes something between two to three days to grow,” says Tomer Halevy as he chops red onions, iceberg lettuce and avocado. He proceeds to batter what appears to be a strip of raw chicken before dipping it in breadcrumbs.

Halevy uses the word “grow” because chickens do not need to be slaughtered en masse to produce this type of meat. Cells taken from “source” chickens are cultured in a laboratory, creating potentially endless supplies of muscle and fat tissue. Some cells were removed from eggs, meaning the meat is from birds that were never even born.

https://www.theguardian.com/food/2020/dec/04/no-kill-lab-grown-chicken
-burger-restaurant-israel

This will apply to all meats. This has so many sides to it. No more pandemics from animals. Meat grown in space, on other planets we Tara form. No more whole sale slaughter of animals. It helps with global warming. The benefits go on and on.

T

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 2:03 PM

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

Quote:
Originally posted by THG:

This has so many sides to it. No more pandemics from animals. Meat grow in space, on other planets we Tara form. No more whole sale slaughter of animals. The benefits go on and on.

T

It will make more human chicken ranchers in Danger of Becoming Obsolete...

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 5:53 PM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

Quote:
Once upon a time, half of all Americans spent all their working days growing the food for the other half.

But moving out of that paradigm can only happen when people harness geologic energy - fossil fuels.

Once upon a time the only way to augment human power was with live animals (in Europe and the US horses and bulls and sometimes donkeys or mules to pull plows and carts), or wind (windmills, sailing ships), or water (water wheels).

The animal power source needed to be fed, watered, protected, and cared for whether they were actively working that hour, day, or month; or not. So a good portion of available energy went to simply maintaining the animals used for muscle.

That's compared to a mechanical plow or harvester, for example, which is a big capital investment, but which can sit idle for long periods of time without needing anything at all. Increased agricultural production per person came about through the use of fossil-fuel-powered machines.

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 6:02 PM

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Quote:
Once upon a time, half of all Americans spent all their working days growing the food for the other half.
But moving out of that paradigm can only happen when people harness geologic energy - fossil fuels.

Once upon a time the only way to augment human power was with live animals (in Europe and the US horses and bulls and sometimes donkeys to pull plows and carts), or wind (windmills, sailing ships), or water (water wheels).

The animal power source needed to be fed, watered, protected, and cared for whether they were actively working that hour, day, or month; or not. So a good portion of available energy went to simply maintaining the animals used for muscle.

That's compared to a mechanical plow or harvester, for example, which is a big capital investment, but which can sit idle for long periods of time without needing anything at all. Increased agricultural production per person came about through the use of fossil-fuel-powered machines.

What is your point about fossil fuels? That humanity would NOT be in danger by mechanization of becoming obsolete if fossil fuels were not burnt? Therefore humans will never be obsolete if we reduce CO2 emissions? Save the planet's climate and, at the very same time, save ourselves from obsolescence? I'm sure engineers can make humans obsolete using only machines powered by solar, wind and hydroelectric with absolutely no fossil fuel.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 6:14 PM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

Quote:
Aww, FIFI! Why did you leave out this detail from your quote?

"At the moment, self-driving cars have a higher rate of accidents compared to human-driven cars, but the injuries are less serious. On average, there are 9.1 self-driving car accidents per million miles driven, while the same rate is 4.1 crashes per million miles for regular vehicles."

Aww MUSHY, back to name-calling because you got nothing else?

And you're welcome! for me being so thoughtful to provide a link.

So, why did you leave out THIS quote? (same source)

Quote:
Teens are 10 times more likely to be in a fatal car accident than adults.

We could easily cut down the human-driver fatality rate 90% by simply not letting teens drive, because they've got too much going on in their peer-status-focused brains to pay attention to driving.

As for this claim

Quote:
I'm pretty sure that average humans are capable of doing only a little better

There is VAST room for improving human-driving statistics, and cut average fatality rates by 90% immediately, by simply not letting teens drive ... if we wanted.

Self-driving cars - not so much.

And that's what happens when you fail to simply check to see if your suppositions are true.

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 6:19 PM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

Quote:
Once upon a time, half of all Americans spent all their working days growing the food for the other half.

Quote:
What is your point about fossil fuels?

What is your point about farming?
Can you show me a self-fueling, self-driving, self-storing, self-repairing plow? Or harvester?
PEOPLE are able to be more productive in general because machinery powered by fossil fuels gives them far more 'muscle' than other sources that enhance the energy humans have access to, in order to do work.

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 6:31 PM

WISHIMAY

Quote:
Originally posted by THG:

First, as you know wishie, Jack=ass is just trolling. What he posts is 99% incorrect and not based on researched evidence.

You are giving him 1%?? How generous of you!

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 6:37 PM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

I've not yet seen a complete nutritional analysis for vat-grown "chicken" for things like deficient or excess minerals (potassium, iron, zinc; sodium etc), vitamins (B vitamins but especially B12, vitamin A and pro-vitamin A etc), essential fats (choline, linoleic, linolenic, DHA etc) - and so on.

Until there's an analysis that shows that it provides the nutrition chicken provides, and avoids the things chicken avoids, I'd be reluctant to call it "food" capable of sustaining human life, in the way actual chicken is a food capable of sustaining human life.

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 6:54 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by THG:
First, as you know wishie, Jack=ass is just trolling. What he posts is 99% incorrect and not based on researched evidence.

Go fuck yourself Ted. It's not my fault that you never learned how to read. Blame your learning disorder or your parents.

The first draft of anything is shit. :)

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 8:43 PM

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

Quote:
Once upon a time, half of all Americans spent all their working days growing the food for the other half.

Quote:
What is your point about fossil fuels?
What is your point about farming?
Can you show me a self-fueling, self-driving, self-storing, self-repairing plow? Or harvester?
PEOPLE are able to be more productive in general because machinery powered by fossil fuels gives them far more 'muscle' than other sources that enhance the energy humans have access to, in order to do work.

How many farmers can design and build an engine for their tractors? None, despite billions of farmers having thousands of years to do that work. It was a few engineers that did the work the billions couldn't or wouldn't do. How many farmers can drill for oil and refine diesel fuel? None, again. Engineers do it. It won't be fossil fuels making drivers obsolete. It will be engineers' ingenuity that makes drivers obsolete. If you don't like that future, have your government delay engineers because only then will that future not happen during your life.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 8:59 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by second:
Quote:
Originally posted by THG:

This has so many sides to it. No more pandemics from animals. Meat grow in space, on other planets we Tara form. No more whole sale slaughter of animals. The benefits go on and on.

T

It will make more human chicken ranchers in Danger of Becoming Obsolete...

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

And cattle ranches, no more veal where cattle are tortured, kept in dog size kennels. No more pig and Turkey farms. That's a great thing not a bad thing second. Fish, it's going to be much easier and cheaper to feed the world.

T

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 10:12 PM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

Quote:
It will be engineers' ingenuity that makes drivers obsolete.

Unh hunh.

I HAVE AN IDEA!

Let's take all the farmers off the farms and watch the food just roll right out of the fields and pastures!

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Sunday, January 3, 2021 10:20 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by THG:
Quote:
Originally posted by second:
Quote:
Originally posted by THG:

This has so many sides to it. No more pandemics from animals. Meat grow in space, on other planets we Tara form. No more whole sale slaughter of animals. The benefits go on and on.

T

It will make more human chicken ranchers in Danger of Becoming Obsolete...

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

And cattle ranches, no more veal where cattle are tortured, kept in dog size kennels. No more pig and Turkey farms. That's a great thing not a bad thing second. Fish, it's going to be much easier and cheaper to feed the world.

T

Apparently it hasn't heard about salmon farming, or how we're running out of fish in the oceans.

The first draft of anything is shit. :)

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Monday, January 4, 2021 7:09 AM

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

The creation of these chicken nuggets could have worldwide impacts

“the food system is responsible for 20-30% of global greenhouse gas emissions, most of which originate in meat and dairy livestock.”

https://www.cnn.com/videos/world/2021/01/03/impacts-of-cultured-meat-f
areed-gps-vpx.cnn

Besides fewer greenhouse gas emissions, fewer cattle ranchers. Humanity Is in Danger of Becoming Obsolete...

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Monday, January 4, 2021 10:12 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Aww MUSHY, back to name-calling because you got nothing else?

Naww, I got you leaving out important info that contradicts your premise = crap science.

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:
And you're welcome! for me being so thoughtful to provide a link.

Thanks!

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:
So, why did you leave out THIS quote? (same source)
Quote:
Teens are 10 times more likely to be in a fatal car accident than adults.
We could easily cut down the human-driver fatality rate 90% by simply not letting teens drive, because they've got too much going on in their peer-status-focused brains to pay attention to driving.

So why did you? Hey! Wait a second! You're not trying to deflect from being caught red handed leaving out important information that doesn't support your thesis, are you?!?

You did do us a favor though. By trying to fudge and omit information to prove your point, you ended up proving we need more AI in Science research. Less lying.

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Monday, January 4, 2021 4:26 PM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

My premise?

"we can't even get an AI-driven car that doesn't kill its passengers"

That AI drivers kill people? STILL TRUE!

"On average, there are 9.1 self-driving car accidents per million miles driven, while the same rate is 4.1 crashes per million miles for regular vehicles."

That the average AI driver has more accidents than the average human driver? STILL TRUE!

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Tuesday, January 5, 2021 10:12 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

My premise?

"we can't even get an AI-driven car that doesn't kill its passengers"

That AI drivers kill people? STILL TRUE!

"On average, there are 9.1 self-driving car accidents per million miles driven, while the same rate is 4.1 crashes per million miles for regular vehicles."

That the average AI driver has more accidents than the average human driver? STILL TRUE!

You do this "Who me? I'm just a dumb blonde - oops!" business every time you're caught out making sh*t up. Don't kid yourself - it doesn't work.

Your premise was that self driving was more dangerous than human, "9.1 accidents to 4.1 crashes" but the injuries from self driving are less than human. Could be backing into a shopping cart by AI, versus a 5 car pile up with 6 dead from humans. You left that out to bolster your flimsy premise. Kiki Prefers Crap Science.

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Tuesday, January 5, 2021 10:57 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

My premise?

"we can't even get an AI-driven car that doesn't kill its passengers"

That AI drivers kill people? STILL TRUE!

"On average, there are 9.1 self-driving car accidents per million miles driven, while the same rate is 4.1 crashes per million miles for regular vehicles."

That the average AI driver has more accidents than the average human driver? STILL TRUE!

You do this "Who me? I'm just a dumb blonde - oops!" business every time you're caught out making sh*t up. Don't kid yourself - it doesn't work.

Your premise was that self driving was more dangerous than human, "9.1 accidents to 4.1 crashes" but the injuries from self driving are less than human. Could be backing into a shopping cart by AI, versus a 5 car pile up with 6 dead from humans. You left that out to bolster your flimsy premise. Kiki Prefers Crap Science.

Sounds to me like the same crap science that TPTB use to justify street cams which cause more accidents than they stop, all while lining their own pockets with unearned revenue.

The first draft of anything is shit. :)

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Tuesday, January 5, 2021 11:49 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

Quote:
It will be engineers' ingenuity that makes drivers obsolete.
Unh hunh.

I HAVE AN IDEA!

Let's take all the farmers off the farms and watch the food just roll right out of the fields and pastures!

I have a better idea. Realize that these too will be well thought-out food farms. It’s just that we’ll be able to use more land for other purposes. Perhaps as farms designed to harness the energy of the Sun. Stop thinking like a Russian and instead like someone who accepts science.

These advancements can be discussed by us, but only discussed. The smartest of the smart, are now as always, designing the future.

T

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Tuesday, January 5, 2021 1:04 PM

Like the salmon farms, huh?

The first draft of anything is shit. :)

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Tuesday, January 5, 2021 3:33 PM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

Quote:
Your premise was that self driving was more dangerous than human

FIND THAT QUOTE!!

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Tuesday, January 5, 2021 3:39 PM