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REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS
TRUMP - Just because.....................Naw, I just can't say it!
Sunday, December 18, 2016 12:21 PM
SECOND
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: I just refuse to get on that recently-concocted anti-Russian bandwagon, because it sure smells a lot like the anti-Iraq bandwagon, and the anti-Vietnam bandwagon, and every anti-(fill in the blank) bandwagon that the USA elites wanted to go to war with: full of shit. Well, I don't give a crap about "Russia" unless it impacts our interests, and neither should you.
Sunday, December 18, 2016 12:26 PM
SIGNYM
I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.
Quote:Please add this to your signature, Signym: Why is Trump being friendly toward Russia? What is Trump getting out of this? Because the USA is getting nothing. - SECOND
Sunday, December 18, 2016 12:30 PM
Quote:Neocon Panic and Agony There are clear signs that the Neocons running the AngloZionist Empire and its “deep state” are in a state of near panic and their actions indicate they are truly terrified. The home front One the home front, the Neocons have resorted to every possible dirty trick on the book to try to prevent Donald Trump from ever getting into the White House: they have organized riots and demonstrations (some paid by Soros money) encouraged the supporters of Hillary to reject the outcome of the elections (“not my President”) tried to threaten the Electors and make them either cast a vote for Hillary or not vote at all tried to convince Congress to refuse the decision of the Electoral College and they are now trying to get the elections annulled on the suspicion that the (apparently almighty) Russian hackers have compromised the election outcome (apparently even in states were paper ballots were used) and stolen it in favor of Trump. That is truly an amazing development, especially considering how Hillary attacked Trump for not promising to recognize the outcome of the elections. She specifically said that Trump’s lack of guarantees to recognize the outcome would threaten the very basis of the stability of the US political system and now she, and her supporters, are doing everything in their power to do just that, to throw the entire electoral process into a major crisis with no clear path towards resolution. Some say that the Democrats are risking a civil war. Considering that several key Republican Congressmen have said they do support the notion of an investigation into the “Russian hackers” fairy tale, I submit that the Republicans are doing exactly the same thing, that this is not a Democrat vs Republican issue, but a “deep state vs The People of the USA” issue. Most experts agree that none of these tactics are going to work. So this begs the question of whether the Neocons are stupid, whether they think that they can succeed or what their true objective is. My guess is that first and foremost what is taking place now is what always happens when the Neocons run into major trouble: they double down, again. And again. And again. That is one of the key characteristics of their psychological make-up: they cannot accept defeat or, even less so, that they were wrong, so each time reality catches up to their ideological delusions, they automatically double-down. Still, they might rationalize this behavior by a combination of hope that maybe one of these tricks will work, with the strong urge to do as much damage to President-Elect Trump before he actually assumes his office. I would never underestimate the vicious vindictiveness of these people. What is rather encouraging is Trump’s reaction to all this: after apparently long deliberations he decided to nominate Rex Tillerson as his Secretary of Defense. From a Neocon point of view, if General Michael Flynn was bad, then Tillerson was truly an apocalyptic abomination: the man actually had received the order of “Friend of Russia” from the hands of Vladimir Putin himself! Did Trump not realize how provocative this nomination was and how it would be received by the Neocons? Of course he did! That was, on his part, a totally deliberate decision. If so, then this is a very, very good sign. I might be mistaken, but I get the feeling that Trump is willing to accept the Neocon challenge and that he will fight back. For example, his reaction to the CIA accusations about Russian hackers was very telling: he reminded everybody that “these are the same people that said Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction”. I think that it is now a safe bet to say that as soon as Trump take control heads will roll at the CIA. [Sidebar: is it not amazing that the CIA is offering its opinion about some supposed Russian hacking during the elections in the USA? Since when does the CIA have any expertise on what is going on inside the USA? I thought the CIA was only a foreign intelligence agency. And since when does the CIA get involved in internal US politics? Yes, of course, savvy observers of the USA have always known that the CIA was a key player in US politics, but now the Agency apparently does not even mind confirming this openly. I don't think that Trump will have the guts and means to do so but, frankly, he would be much better off completely dissolving the CIA. Of course, that could get Trump killed – messing with the Fed and the CIA are two unforgivable crimes in the USA – but then again Trump is already very much at risk anyway, so he might as well strike first]. On the external front On the external front, the big development is the liberation of Aleppo by Syrian forces. In that case again, the Neocons tried to double-down: they made all sorts of totally unsubstantiated claims about executions and atrocities while the BBC, always willing to pick up the correct line, published an article about how much the situation in Aleppo is similar to what took place in Srebrenica. Of course, there is one way in which the events in Aleppo and Srebrenica are similar: in both cases the US-backed Takfiris lost and were defeated by government forces and in both cases the West unleashed a vicious propaganda war to try to turn the military defeat of its proxies into a political victory for itself. In any case, the last-ditch propaganda effort failed and preventing the inevitable and Aleppo was completely liberated. The Empire did score one success: using the fact that most of the foreign forces allied to the Syrians (Hezbollah, Iranian Pasdaran, Russian Spetsnaz, etc.) were concentrated around Aleppo, the US-backed Takfiris succeeded in breaking the will of the Syrians, many of whom apparently fled in panic, and first surrounded and then eventually reoccupied Palmyra. This will be short lived success as I completely agree with my friend Alexander Mercouris who says that Putin will soon liberate Palmyra once again, but until this happens the reoccupation of Palmyra is rather embarrassing for the Syrians, Iranians and Russians. It seems exceedingly unlikely to me that the Daesh movement towards Palmyra was undetected by the various Syrian, Iranian and Russian intelligence agencies (at least once source reports that Russian satellites did detect it) and I therefore conclude that a deliberate decision was made to temporarily sacrifice Palmyra in order to finally liberate Aleppo. Was that the correct call? Definitely yes. Contrary to the western propaganda, Aleppo, not Raqqa, has always been the real “capital” of the US backed terrorists. Raqqa is a relatively small town: 220,000+ inhabitants versus 2,000,000+ for Aleppo, making Aleppo about ten times larger than Raqqa. As for tiny Palmyra, its population is 30,000+. So the choice between scrambling to plug the holes in the Syrian defenses around Palmyra and liberating Aleppo was a no-brainer. Now that Aleppo has been liberated, the city has to be secured and major engineering efforts need to be made in order to prepare it for an always possible Takfiri counter-attack. But it is one thing to re-take a small desert town and quite another one to re-take a major urban center. I personally very much doubt that Daesh & Co. will ever be in control of Aleppo again. Some Neocons appear to be so enraged by this defeat that they are now accusing Trump of “backing Iran” (I wish he did!). The tiny Palmyra was given a double-function by the Neocon propaganda effort: to eclipse the “Russian” (it was not solely “Russian” at all, but never mind that) victory in Aleppo and to obfuscate the “US” (it was not solely “US” at all, but never mind that) defeat in Mosul. A hard task for the tiny desert city for sure and it is no wonder that this desperate attempt also failed: the US lead coalition in Mosul still looks just about as weak as the Russian lead coalition looks strong in Aleppo. Any comparison between these two battles is simply embarrassing for the USA: not only did the US-backed forces fail to liberate Mosul from Daesh & Co. but they have not even full encircled the city or even managed to penetrate beyond its furthest suburbs. There is very little information coming out of Mosul, but after three months of combat the entire operation to liberate Mosul seems to be an abject failure, at least for the time being. I sincerely hope that once Trump takes office he will finally agree to work not only with Russia, but also with Iran, to finally get Daesh out of Mosul. But if Trump delivers on his promise to AIPAC and the rest of the Israel Lobby gang to continue to antagonize and threaten Iran, the US can basically forget any hopes of defeating Daesh in Iraq. Our of despair and spite, the US propaganda vilified Russia for the killing of civilians in Aleppo while strenuously avoiding any mention of civilian victims in Mosul. But then, the same propaganda machine which made fun of the color of the smoke coming out of the engines of the Russian aircraft carrier Admiral Kuznetsov (suggesting that she was about to break down) had to eat humble pie when it was the US navy’s most expensive and newest destroyer, the USS Zumwalt, which broke down in the Panama canal and had to be immobilzed, while the Kuznetsov continued to do a very good job supporting Russian operations in Syria. Over and over again, the AngloZionist propaganda machine has failed to obfuscate the embarrassing facts on the ground and it now clearly appears that the entire US policy for the Middle-East is in total disarray and that the Neocons are as clueless as they are desperate. The countdown to January 20th It is pretty obvious that the Neocon reign is coming to an end in a climax of incompetence, hysterical finger-pointing, futile attempts at preventing the inevitable and a desperate scramble to conceal the magnitude of the abject failure which Neocon-inspired policies have resulted in. Obama will go down in history as the worst and most incompetent President in US history. As for Hillary, she will be remembered as both the worst US Secretary of State the US and the most inept Presidential candidate ever. In light of the fact that the Neocons always failed at everything they attempted, I am inclined to believe that they will probably also fail at preventing Donald Trump from being sworn in. But until January 20th, 2017 I will be holding my breath in fear of what else these truly demented people could come up with. As for Trump, I still can’t figure him out. On one hand he nominates Rex Tillerson in what appears to be a deliberate message of defiance against the Neocons, while on the other hand he continues to try to appease the Israel Lobby gang by choosing a rabid Zionist of the worst kind, David M. Friedman, as the next US ambassador to Israel. Even worse then that, Donald Trump still does not appear to be willing to recognize the undeniable fact that the US will never defeat Daesh as long as the anti-Iranian stance of the Neocons is not replaced by a real willingness to engage Iran and accept it as a partner and ally. Right now the Trump rhetoric simply makes no sense: he wants to befriend Russia while antagonizing China and he wants to defeat Daesh while threatening Iran again. This is lunacy. Still, I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, but somebody sure needs to educate him on the geopolitical realities out there before he also end up making a total disaster of US foreign policy. And yet, I still have a small hope. My hope is that the latest antics of the Neocons will sufficiently aggravate and even enrage Trump to a point where he will give up on his futile attempts at appeasing them. Only by engaging in a systematic policy of “de-neoconization” of the US political establishment will Trump have any hopes of “making America great again”. If Trump’s plan is to appease the Neocons long enough from him to be sworn in and have his men approved by Congress – fine. Then he still has a chance of saving the USA from a catastrophic collapse, but only as long as he remains determined to ruthlessly crack down on the Neocons once in power. If his hope is to distract the Neocons by appeasing them on secondary or minor issues, then his efforts are doomed and he will go down the very same road as Obama who, at least superficially, initially appeared to be a non-Neocon candidate and who ended up being a total Neocon puppet (in 2008 the Neocons had placed their bets on McCain and they only infiltrated the Obama Administration once McCain was defeated). One way or another, we are headed for a crisis, the only open question whether the USA will come out of this crisis liberated or doomed.
Sunday, December 18, 2016 1:58 PM
Sunday, December 18, 2016 2:51 PM
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: REPOSTED: SECOND, calm down. I can hear your head exploding all the way over here. Paul Krugman, stawmanning his way through an entire article.
Sunday, December 18, 2016 3:29 PM
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: Well, you see SECOND, this is where your inability to even imagine "American interests" is a serious deficit, because I can imagine America getting a LOT of things out of reaching a detente with Russia.
Sunday, December 18, 2016 4:17 PM
Quote:My guess is that first and foremost what is taking place now is what always happens when the Neocons run into major trouble: they double down, again. And again. And again. That is one of the key characteristics of their psychological make-up: they cannot accept defeat or, even less so, that they were wrong, so each time reality catches up to their ideological delusions, they automatically double-down.
Sunday, December 18, 2016 5:18 PM
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: That's you, SECOND.
Sunday, December 18, 2016 6:21 PM
1KIKI
Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.
Monday, December 19, 2016 2:28 AM
SHINYGOODGUY
Quote:Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK: Obama doubled our national debt and the only "jobs" that were "recovered" in the last 8 years were part time, minimum-wage jobs now held by people who used to be able to support a family with real jobs, or people who just completely left the workforce like me and are no longer a statistic they track.... Nobody but the truly Privilged White people will revere Obama as a great president. Not even ANY black people. He did NOTHING for Black People or Latin People. He actually deported more illegal Latinos that GWB did. One thing I actually agreed with him on although nowhere near the amount that should have happened. The only "Legacy" he has is Obamacare that is crushing middle income people, and Trump will strip it to bare bones if he doesn't just renig on what he said to appease idiot lefties like you and destroy it altogether. I say this knowing full well that I will no longer have health insurance in my current position. I'm okay with that. It's not right that I have insurance while my Niece's parents pay 6k per year more with twice the deductible to cover my free insurance. I said 10 years ago here that GWB was the worst president we EVER had. Not even considering how little respect any foreign countries have for us now, but just for how much he spent with such little results for the middle class. Not to mention that Race Relations have been set back 50 years under 8 years of Obama. Blacks and Whites have not lived under this much tension since the 60's. Obama was so much worse. He makes GWB look like JFK. Because he is Black, nobody will talk about him at all in school 30 years from now. He will be among the 30+ "invisible" presidents we never discuss in public school. Do Right, Be Right. :)
Monday, December 19, 2016 2:32 AM
Monday, December 19, 2016 2:35 AM
Quote:Of course I don't want Russia to own us.
Monday, December 19, 2016 2:42 AM
Quote:Originally posted by second: Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: Please, think long and hard what our AMERICAN interests are before you start getting all hysterical about "Russia".When you use "our AMERICAN interests", who do think believes you are American? Your obsession, and 1kiki’s, with Russia makes everyone at Fireflyfans, except 1kiki and maybe 6ixStringJack, think you’re Russian. No Americans care about Russia, but they do care that Trump is obsessed with Putin and Putin is sneaking stolen emails to Trump. Is Putin blackmailing Trump? Although he never shuts up, Trump is so secretive about his business that we can only guess. Trump can talk more about himself and say less than any other American politician. I do wish Trump’s accountant would talk about Trump’s tax returns or his foreign business dealings or his conflict of interest between what is best for the Trump family fortune and best for the USA, etc. because Trump is not talking. http://editorialcartoonists.com/cartoon/display.cfm/156590/ http://editorialcartoonists.com/cartoon/display.cfm/156500/
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: Please, think long and hard what our AMERICAN interests are before you start getting all hysterical about "Russia".
Monday, December 19, 2016 2:46 AM
Monday, December 19, 2016 2:50 AM
Quote:Honey, I've been here longer than YOU have.[\quote] Really!? It's come to this - FIRSTIES! Ha! sgg
Monday, December 19, 2016 2:53 AM
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: Quote:Please add this to your signature, Signym: Why is Trump being friendly toward Russia? What is Trump getting out of this? Because the USA is getting nothing. - SECOND Well, you see SECOND, this is where your inability to even imagine "American interests" is a serious deficit, because I can imagine America getting a LOT of things out of reaching a detente with Russia. So you go toddle off and think about it some. Oh by the way, I changed my signature to quote your anti-American statement. ----------- "Pity would be no more, If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake "If you aren't aware, Texans don't have much concern for the well-being of Yankees or Californians, even Yankee factory workers in Indiana "- SECOND
Monday, December 19, 2016 6:26 AM
Monday, December 19, 2016 7:48 AM
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: "If you aren't aware, Texans don't have much concern for the well-being of Yankees or Californians, even Yankee factory workers in Indiana "- SECOND
Monday, December 19, 2016 11:03 AM
Quote:If you're also not aware, factory workers in Indiana did not have much concern for the well-being of blacks in Texas from 1877 to 2016. Indifference runs both from the North toward the South and South to North. Please add that to your signature, Signym.
Monday, December 19, 2016 1:43 PM
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: Quote:If you're also not aware, factory workers in Indiana did not have much concern for the well-being of blacks in Texas from 1877 to 2016. Indifference runs both from the North toward the South and South to North. Please add that to your signature, Signym. Three responses immediately spring to mind, n I don't know which is more apropos: 1) Cites? Links? 2) Silly girl, the answer is "no". 3) If Americans don't care about other states, then you have just made the best argument EV-AR for the Electoral College, because each state will have to look out for itself.
Monday, December 19, 2016 7:50 PM
Quote:not once in all recorded history did Indiana factory workers send aid to Texas or anywhere else in the South for the suffering Black workers living in poverty with little hope. If Signym can find an example where Indiana factory workers did send monetary aid, or even free hope, let me know.
Tuesday, December 20, 2016 7:09 AM
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: Quote:not once in all recorded history did Indiana factory workers send aid to Texas or anywhere else in the South for the suffering Black workers living in poverty with little hope. If Signym can find an example where Indiana factory workers did send monetary aid, or even free hope, let me know. Why so restrictive, SECOND? Are you saying that no person from any northern, southern, western or eastern state crossed a state border to participate in the Civil Rights movement at any time? Are you saying that no person ever crossed a state border to help someone else? Are you claiming that no person ever donated to a mission or disaster in another state to help the people there? Because that would be foolish, if that's what you're claiming. (Good luck with convincing Americans to care about other Americans having factory jobs in another state.)
Tuesday, December 20, 2016 7:12 AM
Tuesday, December 20, 2016 2:07 PM
Wednesday, December 21, 2016 7:09 AM
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: SECOND Do you see anything there are state budgets? No? Neither do I. I'm sorry you're too dishonest to have a discussion with.
Wednesday, December 21, 2016 10:24 AM
Wednesday, December 21, 2016 1:35 PM
Quote:Americans want cheap goods more than they want to help American factory workers get a job
Quote:If Americans gave a damn about other Americans, they wouldn’t act as they do. To be more particular, I’d say there is plenty of empirical proof that Americans do not give a damn about American factory workers because Americans don’t check for the country of origin of their purchases
Quote:Good luck with convincing Americans to care about other Americans having factory jobs in another state.
Quote:If you aren't aware, Texans don't have much concern for the well-being of Yankees or Californians ...
Quote:You best look at the ACE Hardware labels for Chinese goods. 1kiki, I thought you and Trump were deeply concerned about factory jobs?
Quote:Does it disturb 1kiki's view of Americans that Texans don't feel that Trump voters in West Virginians are family? And Texans won't willing pay more to create jobs for people they never met in states that are far away?
Quote:1kiki, you could just as easily ask why nobody did anything to protect Blacks after Southern Reconstruction collapsed in 1877. My answer would be that the vast majority of Americans after 1877 did NOT share the values of 2016's Democratic Party toward blacks.
Quote:1kiki, you could just as easily ask why nobody did anything to protect Blacks after Southern Reconstruction collapsed in 1877 until 1964. My answer would be that the vast majority of Americans between 1877 and 1964 did NOT share the values of 2016's Democratic Party toward blacks.
Quote:If you're also not aware, factory workers in Indiana did not have much concern for the well-being of blacks in Texas from 1877 to 2016. Indifference runs both from the North toward the South and South to North.
Quote:The states don't help each other. Occasionally the Feds help states when their neighboring states won't.
Quote:1kiki, you won't find a line item in any state's budget in any year since the USA was founded for helping another state. For example, there is nothing in Texas' budget to help the welfare of unemployed Indiana factory workers.
Quote:I’ve got one more example where American generosity ends at the state line.
Wednesday, December 21, 2016 3:51 PM
Wednesday, December 21, 2016 6:43 PM
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: Tell me, SECOND, which argument are you making? The one where Americans don't care about other Americans? The one where Texans don't care about anyone else? The one where Americans don't care about factory workers specifically? The one about states' budgets? Or what?
Wednesday, December 21, 2016 7:47 PM
Quote:Americans donated generously after Hurricanes Katrina and Rita. 9% of online users – or 13 million people – donated online for Katrina and Rita relief; The number of online donors is up 53% overall since January 2005 http://www.pewinternet.org/2005/11/24/13-million-americans-made-donations-online-after-hurricanes-katrina-and-rita/
Wednesday, December 21, 2016 11:35 PM
Thursday, December 22, 2016 2:24 AM
Thursday, December 22, 2016 3:31 AM
Quote:Obama doubled our national debt and the only "jobs" that were "recovered" in the last 8 years were part time[\quote] Hmmm, let's see...the country handed over to him in 2008 in near financial collapse +Since President Barack Obama first took office: +Homicides have dropped 13 percent, but gun sales have surged. +The economy has added more than 9 million jobs, and the jobless rate has dropped to below the historical median. +The number of long-term unemployed Americans has dropped by 614,000 under Obama, but it is still 761,000 higher than at the start of the Great Recession. +Corporate profits are up 166 percent; real weekly wages are up 3.4 percent. +There are 15 million fewer people who lack health insurance. +Wind and solar power have nearly tripled, and now account for more than 5 percent of U.S. electricity. +The federal debt has more than doubled — rising 116 percent — and big annual deficits have continued. https://www.factcheck.org/2016/01/obamas-numbers-january-2016-update/ by By Brooks Jackson Posted on January 12, 2016 Apparently, facts comes around like Santa Claus. The name of the game for some "folk" is LIE YOUR ASS OFF; thems is the rules according to sick-O leadership. Hail Trump! SGG
Thursday, December 22, 2016 3:57 AM
Thursday, December 22, 2016 4:10 AM
Quote:For 8 fucking years Obama has been scalded with unrelenting heat from the boobs in the peanut gallery. Especially from his Dick-head-ness.
Quote:Why can't we do both.
Thursday, December 22, 2016 4:46 AM
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: Quote:For 8 fucking years Obama has been scalded with unrelenting heat from the boobs in the peanut gallery. Especially from his Dick-head-ness. I'm not saying I disagree - or agree. I just have no idea what you mean. afaik the worst thing the repubs did wasn't name-calling, it was being the party of 'no'. So who is Dick-head-ness? Quote:Why can't we do both. You seem to have WAAYyy more energy than I do. I'll stick with one.
Thursday, December 22, 2016 6:41 AM
JO753
rezident owtsidr
Quote:Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY: MacArthur and FDR are turning over in their graves.
Thursday, December 22, 2016 7:24 AM
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: "Tell me, SECOND, which argument are you making? The one where Americans don't care about other Americans?" Is this true? These are all true without argument. I hope you realize your beliefs - or should I say propaganda - is irrelevant compared to the facts of the real world. Quote:Americans donated generously after Hurricanes Katrina and Rita. 9% of online users – or 13 million people – donated online for Katrina and Rita relief; The number of online donors is up 53% overall since January 2005 http://www.pewinternet.org/2005/11/24/13-million-americans-made-donations-online-after-hurricanes-katrina-and-rita/ As another example, many people crossed state lines and race lines to participate in the Civil Rights movement. I could also mention the many union organizers who crossed state lines to help others unionize for better pay and working conditions. So this statement - Americans don't care about other Americans -is, by the evidence of historical facts, proven wrong. That makes YOUR assertion - that all statements are true - equally wrong. In any case, since you freely claim things that are obviously untrue, and that are also easily demonstrated to be untrue, I'm not going to bother continuing. Btw, I hope you realize that out of all your posts, I scroll past your regurgitation of other people's opinions, and when it comes to your personal posts, I only go up to the first lie. Which means I probably scroll past 95% of them at a minimum. It's too bad you're too dishonest for adult, rational discussion. I'm just curious why, in this particular discussion, a presumably sane person such as yourself would hew to a line of thought so patently divergent from reality and so easily shown to be untrue.
Thursday, December 22, 2016 7:44 AM
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: While Trump has yet to be sworn in and become president, can we just stipulate that there are many things that could be negatives and move on from there? Because, honestly, I can't imagine what good endlessly wallowing in anti-Trump obsession is going to do. The question is, what to do next. ... And, in general, it might be worth while to support Sanders, Warren, and Duckworth as the major contenders (to date) against the Trump agenda.
Thursday, December 22, 2016 7:45 AM
Quote:Campaigning to win the Electoral College is much more difficult & sophisticated than the popular vote. Hillary focused on the wrong states! I would have done even better in the election, if that is possible, if the winner was based on popular vote - but would campaign differently
Quote: While no one moved from Trump to Clinton, 0.9 percent of our respondents moved from Clinton to Trump....Trump also outpaced Clinton among people who were previously undecided or third-party backers, with 3.1 percent of respondents moving from those categories to Trump while just 2.3 percent did the same for Clinton. Clinton also saw 3.1 percent of her October supporters defecting to third-party candidates or becoming undecided. Trump lost just 1.7 percent.
Thursday, December 22, 2016 9:45 AM
Quote:Originally posted by G: I realize that communications professor Melissa Zimdars is full of great intentions, but she's just posted a list of what not to do for future misinformation/fake news sites. "If you want to be taken seriously, don't do these:"
Quote:Liberals should have defended her with gusto from the start. There was never anything here and no evidence that Clinton did anything seriously wrong. And yet we didn't. Many liberals just steered clear of the whole thing. Others—including me sometimes—felt like every defense had to contain a series of caveats acknowledging that, yes, the private server was a bad idea, harumph harumph. And some others didn't even go that far. The result was that in the public eye, both liberals and conservatives were more or less agreeing that there was a lot of smoke here. So smoke there was. And now Donald Trump is a month away from being president.
Friday, December 23, 2016 3:14 AM
Friday, December 23, 2016 3:40 AM
Quote:Originally posted by second: Quote:Originally posted by G: I realize that communications professor Melissa Zimdars is full of great intentions, but she's just posted a list of what not to do for future misinformation/fake news sites. "If you want to be taken seriously, don't do these:" That list would be https://docs.google.com/document/d/10eA5-mCZLSS4MQY5QGb5ewC3VAL6pLkT53V_81ZyitM/preview Let's create some fake news to enrage Republicans: "I hear a rumor that Bernie scratched the initials DJT on bullets for his assault rifle." Critical thinkers would already know that did not happen, but Republican would not care. The GOP rage would know no limits, if they hear this fake news. http://feelthebern.org/bernie-sanders-on-gun-policy/ Republicans don't care about fake or true. They can't stop believing fake facts, even if a Professor recommends they stop. Even Democrats don't care enough to do anything beyond complain very softly and in a calm tone of voice about fake facts. The classic article explains in "Timid Liberals Blew the Election by Flinching at Hillary Clinton's Email Server" www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2016/12/timid-liberals-flinching-hillary-clintons-email-server From start to finish, on every TV channel, there was misleading, call it fake, news about Hillary's email. After summarizing what was true and what was misleading, the article ends here: Quote:Liberals should have defended her with gusto from the start. There was never anything here and no evidence that Clinton did anything seriously wrong. And yet we didn't. Many liberals just steered clear of the whole thing. Others—including me sometimes—felt like every defense had to contain a series of caveats acknowledging that, yes, the private server was a bad idea, harumph harumph. And some others didn't even go that far. The result was that in the public eye, both liberals and conservatives were more or less agreeing that there was a lot of smoke here. So smoke there was. And now Donald Trump is a month away from being president.
Friday, December 23, 2016 11:40 PM
Quote:Originally posted by second: 1kiki, I am dishonest you say?
Quote:Originally posted by second: Your example was not honest.
Quote:Originally posted by second: Would 13 million also vote in state and local elections? Yes, they would. That only leaves 310 million other Americans who did not contribute aid, even as little as 25 cents, to victims for whatever selfish or political reasons.
Friday, December 23, 2016 11:48 PM
Saturday, December 24, 2016 1:53 AM
Saturday, December 24, 2016 10:10 PM
Sunday, December 25, 2016 10:04 AM
Quote:Originally posted by 1kiki: The dissection begins. OBVIOUSLY, CLINTON DID SOMETHING WRONG. OBVIOUSLY, TRUMP DID SOMETHING RIGHT. To deny that is to deny reality.
Sunday, December 25, 2016 10:26 AM
Quote: letter to historians of the future — the 2016 election really was dominated by a controversy over emails-SECONDHAND
Sunday, December 25, 2016 12:28 PM
Quote:Originally posted by SIGNYM: ----------- "Pity would be no more, If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake "If you aren't aware, Signym is a lying sack of shit."- SECOND
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