GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

They canceled Firefly! Why?

POSTED BY: LUTZI
UPDATED: Saturday, May 15, 2010 09:44
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VIEWED: 6095
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Tuesday, May 11, 2010 10:20 AM

LUTZI


Hello everybody. I am new here. I just got done watching the entire Firefly series. It was the best thing I have seen on TV. Sadly, I am actually mad that it was canceled, eight years ago! The graphics, writing everything is better than anything that is out there now!


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Tuesday, May 11, 2010 10:30 AM

BYTEMITE


Yeah, it was the dumbest decision ever.

We got some comic books and visual companions out that'll help fill in some more story, even a new book, Still Flying, which comes out this month with a bunch of short stories written by the folks who worked on the episodes. :D

Welcome! You'll notice we have a fine collection of fanworks with the characters up above, and varied discussions here in the middle, and in the deeper water where sharks swim and many fear to tread, there's the Real World Event (and Politics) Discussion Board. They're all fun, though, so feel free to stay a while.

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Tuesday, May 11, 2010 10:38 AM

LUTZI


Thanks for the welcome and the info on the book. I will look forward to that. I know I am probably rehashing this topic for everyone for the millionth time.

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Tuesday, May 11, 2010 10:46 AM

BYTEMITE


No, no. Some of us see it as a sign of hope to have a new person sign up and post their testimony every other day or so. We don't mind, we're just happy to see you.

It's been eight years, and we still haven't gotten tired of talking about it. I guarantee if you stay around a couple days, people will have started to read the new book and there will be crazy theories being thrown around everywhere on the board. It's a good time to join up if you wanted to talk about stuff.

So what are your impressions/predictions so far?

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Tuesday, May 11, 2010 11:03 AM

LUTZI


I have read various posts and wikis that explain the demise of Firefly. Poor roll out from Fox etc. It sounds extremely similar to Family Guy. Even though it has been gone for a while, I don't see why it couldn't be back in some form in the near future. Too bad Serenity didn't gross bigger.

I watched the season on Netflix. I actually watched Serenity first and thought, that was interesting. Where did that come from? Then I went back and watched Firefly. The quality of Firefly was so good it really surprised me. If "Lost" kept going for six years, there is no reason that Firefly couldn't have, or can't.

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Tuesday, May 11, 2010 11:55 AM

ZEEK


It's always great to see new fans being introduced to the series. I hope you talk about it to your friends and family. Firefly is slowly spreading to more and more fans every year.

However, there are serious hurdles to getting the show back at this point. Many of the actors have regular work on other shows. The sets are gone. Many of the writers are working on new projects.

That's not even mentioning the hurdle of trying to convince a network that it's a sound investment. Unfortunately the proven track record is not good for Firefly/Serenity. Ratings were not good for the TV show and Serenity didn't even break even at the box office IIRC.

I just think we're in a very difficult position right now. We'd need something really shocking to get a networks attention IMO. I'm not sure how we could accomplish that at this point.

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Tuesday, May 11, 2010 12:51 PM

SAFFRONSHUBBY


I know exactly the feeling. I just discovered the 'verse last year.

You can look forward to repeated viewings, and the Big Damn Movie, if you haven't seen it yet.

The best thing, IMHO, is to purchase yourself a copy of the series and the BDM. That's what the decision makers pay attention too, the bottom line.

Keep Flyin'!

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Tuesday, May 11, 2010 1:12 PM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Lutzi:
If "Lost" kept going for six years, there is no reason that Firefly couldn't have, or can't.



Well, except that Lost has had really good ratings.

Zeek is right - there are a lot of reasons there is slim chance of the show ever coming back.

Now another movie, while still a long shot, is a bit more plausible. If The Avengers does well, Joss will have a lot more clout in Hollywood, and will be in a better position to bring back our crew.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

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Tuesday, May 11, 2010 1:20 PM

TRAVELER


Hello Lutzi:

Welcome to the verse. It is always great to hear from a fellow Browncoat.

Traveler


http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=28764731
Traveler

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Tuesday, May 11, 2010 1:23 PM

BYTEMITE


Ooh! I like that, Storymark!

Hope is good, it tastes like candy.

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Tuesday, May 11, 2010 2:54 PM

LUTZI


I wanted to thank everyone for their kind welcome. I am going to go out and buy a DVD copy as soon as possible! I looks forward to seeing everyone on the boards.

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Tuesday, May 11, 2010 2:56 PM

MANGOLO


Aloha Lutzi

We're all in it for the long haul.



http://www.facebook.com/pages/strange-frame/182133437902

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Tuesday, May 11, 2010 3:14 PM

LUTZI


Cool. That is what I like to hear.

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Wednesday, May 12, 2010 3:50 AM

BROWNCOAT1

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.


Quote:

Originally posted by Lutzi:
Hello everybody. I am new here. I just got done watching the entire Firefly series. It was the best thing I have seen on TV. Sadly, I am actually mad that it was canceled, eight years ago! The graphics, writing everything is better than anything that is out there now!





Why did they cancel Firefly? That question comes second only to what is the meaning of life, and sadly, the answer is poor ratings. At least that is the reason Fox execs gave for the worst decision in television history.

Welcome to the board Lutzi, and welcome to the ranks of the browncoats.

__________________________________________
Holding the line since December '02!



Richmond, VA & surrounding area Firefly Fans:

http://www.richmondbrowncoats.org

X.O. / Battalion O.I.C.



http://76thbattalion.homestead.com/index.html

http://76thbattalion.proboards.com


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Wednesday, May 12, 2010 4:12 AM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


There's a lifetime of fanfic still flyin on FFF.net, with fanvids now available complete with CGI and elaborate sets.

Quote:

LUTZI:

They canceled Firefly! Why?



Govt mind control was Joss' fav theme in BTVS, Angel, FF and Dollhouse. Google MKULTRA, Project Monarch and Cathy O'Brien for Real World River Tams.

CIA can't allow sheeple to THINK such thoughts. Joss may be a secret agent, tryin to deprogram the masses...

Quote:

"'They're hurting us. Get me out!' The Government was playing with her brain. They opened up her skull and cut into her brain. The only reason you do that is to lobotomize somebody. They did it over, and over..."
-Dr Simon Tam, Firefly, Arial

"We need a program of psychosurgery for political control of our society. The purpose is physical control of the mind. Everyone who deviates from the given norm can be surgically mutilated. The individual may think that the most important reality is his own existence, but this is only his personal point of view. This lacks historical perspective. Man does not have the right to develop his own mind. This kind of liberal orientation has great appeal. We must electrically control the brain. Some day armies and generals will be controlled by electrical stimulation of the brain."
-Dr. Jose Delgado, Director of Neuropsychiatry, Yale University Medical School prof and CIA mind control scientist, Congressional Record, No 26, vol 118 February 24th, 1974

"Why not improve the brain? Perhaps in the future, we can attach a little version of Google that you plug into your brain. We'll have to develop stylish versions, but then you'll have all the world's knowledge immediately available, which is pretty exciting."
-Sergey Brin, David Vise and Mark Malseed, The Google Story, page 292

"Mr. Chairman: In my letter to you of July 15, 1977, I reported our recent discovery of seven boxes of documents related to Project MKULTRA, a closely held CIA project conducted from 1953-1964. As you may recall, MKULTRA was an "umbrella project" under which certain sensitive subprojects were funded, involving among other things research on drugs and behavioral modification. During the Rockefeller Commission and Church Committee investigations in 1975, the cryptonym became publicly known when details of the drug-related death of Dr. Frank Olsen were publicized. In 1953 Dr. Olsen, a civilian employee of the Army at Fort Detrick, leaped to his death from a hotel room window in New York City about a week after having unwittingly consumed LSD administered to him as an experiment at a meeting of LSD researchers called by CIA. Most of what was known about the Agency's involvement with behavioral drugs during the investigations in 1975 was contained in a report on Project MKULTRA prepared by the Inspector General's office in 1963. As a result of that report's recommendations, unwitting testing of drugs on U.S. citizens was subsequently discontinued. The MKULTRA-related report was made available to the Church Committee investigators and to the staff of Senator Kennedy's Subcommittee on Health. Until the recent discovery, it was believed that all of the MKULTRA files dealing with behavioral modification had been destroyed in 1973 on the orders of the then retiring Chief of the Office of Technical Service, with the authorization of the DCI, as has been previously reported. Almost all of the people who had had any connection with the aspects of the project which interested Senate investigators in 1975 were no longer with the Agency at that time. Thus, there was little detailed knowledge of the MKULTRA subprojects available to CIA during the Church Committee investigations. The 1963 Inspector General report on MKULTRA made available to both the Church Committee and Senator Kennedy's Subcommittee mentions electro-shock and harassment substances (pp. 4, 16); covert testing on unwitting U.S. citizens (pp. 7, 10-12); the search for new materials through arrangements with specialists in universities, pharmaceutical houses, hospitals, state and federal institutions, and private research organizations (pp. 7, 9); and the fact that the Technical Service Division of CIA had initiated 144 subprojects related to the control of human behavior between 1953-1963 (p. 21)."
-Admiral Stansfield Turner, Director of Central Intelligence, U.S. Senate Hearing on MKULTRA, 1973
www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/history/e1950/mkultra/index.htm

"QKHILLTOP was a cryptonym assigned in 1954 to a project to study Chinese Communist brainwashing techniques and to develop interrogation techniques. Most of the early studies are believed to have been conducted by the Cornell University Medical School Human Ecology Study Programs. The effort was absorbed into the MKULTRA program and the QKHILLTOP cryptonym became obsolete."
-U.S. Senate Hearing on MKULTRA, Appendix C, QKHILLTOP DEFINITION, 1973
www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/history/e1950/mkultra/AppendixC.htm

"The concepts involved in manipulating behavior are found by many people both within and outside the Agency to be distasteful and unethical. Nevertheless, there have been major accomplishments both in research and operational employment. Over the ten-year life of the program many additional avenues to the control of human behavior have been designated under the MKULTRA charter, including radiation, electro-shock, and harassment substances. Some activities raise questions of legality implicit in the original charter. A final phase of the testing places the rights and interests of US citizens in jeopardy. Technical Services Division initiated a program for covert testing of materials on unwitting US citizens in 1955. TSD has pursued a philosophy of minimum documentation in keeping with the high sensitivity of the projects. Some files contained little or no data at all. There are just two individuals in TSD who have full knowledge of the MKULTRA program, and most of that knowledge is unrecorded."
-MEMORANDUM FOR: Director of Central Intelligence
FROM: CIA Inspector General, NB 108-113, 26 July 1963
www.wanttoknow.info/mindcontrol#_ednref13

"If we understand the mechanism and motives of the group mind, is it not possible to control and regiment the masses according to our will without their knowing about it? The recent practice of propaganda has proved that it is possible, at least up to a certain point and within certain limits. The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of. This is a logical result of the way in which our democratic society is organized. Vast numbers of human beings must cooperate in this manner if they are to live together as a smoothly functioning society. In almost every act of our daily lives, whether in the sphere of politics or business, in our social conduct or our ethical thinking, we are dominated by the relatively small number of persons who understand the mental processes and social patterns of the masses. It is they who pull the wires which control the public mind."
-CIA agent Edward Bernays, Propaganda, Engineering of Consent
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Bernays



FF's lack of space aliens sabotaged CIA's Project Bluebeam. William Cooper was gunned down by police state death squads for discussing such thoughts.
http://www.hourofthetime.com/majestyt.htm
http://www.hourofthetime.com/murderdetails.html
http://freedomforall.net/william-cooper-murdered-by-police-too-close-t
o-the-truth
/
http://rationalwiki.com/wiki/Project_Blue_Beam
http://www.educate-yourself.org/cn/projectbluebeam25jul05.shtml



Also FF was based on the Real world hostile merger of USA with Commie China.

Australian Rupert Murdoch, owner of Fox, married Deng Wen Di in 1999, a citizen of Commie China and member of the Communist Party. The Murdochs now live in Bejing China.
http://piratenews.org/fox-news-owned-by-communist-china.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wendi_Deng



Hence FF had to be cancelled before its first episode, with almost zero publicity allowed. Even Joss fans didn't know when it was first released.



"As far as Chinese goes, I resented it."
-Adam Tudyk, The Making of Firefly
(censored by Youtube)

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Wednesday, May 12, 2010 11:15 AM

ANTEC85


I'm sure my story would be typical here judging from what the other fans have said. Back in 2005 or so when they released Serenity, I had never even heard of the Firefly series that preceded it. The lackluster advertising scarcely even grabbed my attention when the concluding feature film Serenity was playing in theaters. Fast forward 5 years and I have Netflix. I was looking for a decent sci fi to watch when I requested the Serenity DVD. After watching the movie, I thought, WOW, that was awesome...I haven't seen a good movie like that in a long time. Then I discovered the whole Firefly series that came before the movie, and I was all the more awe struck. This series and its feature film is truly an original piece of work, and I haven't watched anything that was nearly as good or entertaining in years. I just don't understand why this didn't catch on. The sci-fi/western theme is totally new to me, but they made it work exceptionally well. When I think of the number of lame-brain TV shows that are out there now, with huge audiences and big budgets, it is mind blowing to me that a great series like Firefly didn't make it. The point I'm making here is that I would have been an instant fan...if I had even known that it existed back when it originally aired on Fox. Since I discovered it, I've been telling all my friends about it, and I gave Firefly and Serenity stellar reviews on the Netflix user ratings. So I just thought I'd add my 2 cents worth just in case someone from Fox, Universal, or whoever may be reading this message board, BRING BACK FIREFLY! Or even MAKE SERENITY 2!!!

It's always the thought that counts!

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Wednesday, May 12, 2010 1:15 PM

TEETHGRINDER


I never get tired of hearing stories like these. This is xactly the way I felt when I saw SERENITY (video release)and then FIREFLY.
Welcome to this shiny side of the verse. Lots of good folks here.
Look on the bright side.... It's been years since SERENITY was released in the theaters and she's still reaching out and touching people's lives.... Still soaring... still flying.

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Wednesday, May 12, 2010 1:22 PM

TEETHGRINDER


Double post.

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Wednesday, May 12, 2010 1:37 PM

CHINDI


Welcome Lutzi

All Browncoats are welcome here... Who knows what the future holds Whedonwise.. but at least here you are amongst friends...

Keep flying...


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Wednesday, May 12, 2010 6:43 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Fiction writers are censored by a short leash in a mind field (sic), just like "news" reporters.

They cannot speak of such terrors in public, of course. Joss keeps on tryin tho. Bless.

Quote:

A TOAST TO THE "INDEPENDENT PRESS"

"There is no such thing, at this date of the world's history, in America, as an independent press. You know it and I know it. There is not one of you who dares to write your honest opinions, and if you did, you know beforehand that it would never appear in print. I am paid weekly for keeping my honest opinion out of the paper I am connected with. Others of you are paid similar salaries for similar things, and any of you who would be so foolish as to write honest opinions would be out on the streets looking for another job. If I allowed my honest opinions to appear in one issue of my paper, before twenty_four hours my occupation would be gone. The business of the journalists is to destroy the truth, to lie outright, to pervert, to vilify, to fawn at the feet of mammon, and to sell his country and his race for his daily bread. You know it and I know it, and what folly is this toasting an independent press? We are the tools and vassals of rich men behind the scenes. We are the jumping jacks, they pull the strings and we dance. Our talents, our possibilities and our lives are all the property of other men. We are intellectual prostitutes."
-John Swinton, Labor's Untold Story, by Richard O. Boyer and Herbert M. Morais, published by United Electrical, Radio & Machine Workers of America, NY

"Secrecy is the beginning of tyranny. The hardest part of gaining any new idea is sweeping out the false idea occupying that niche. Most people can't think, most of the remainder won't think, the small fraction who do think mostly can't do it very well. The extremely tiny fraction who think regularly, accurately, creatively, and without self-delusion- in the long run these are the only people who count. The human race divides politically into those who want people to be controlled and those who have no such desire. A monarch's neck should always have a noose around it - it keeps him upright."
—Robert A. Heinlein

"You don't have to burn books to destroy a culture. Just get people to stop reading them. The television, that insidious beast, that Medusa which freezes a billion people to stone every night, staring fixedly, that Siren which called and sang and promised so much and gave, after all, so little. I don't try to describe the future. I try to prevent it."
-Ray Bradbury

Abbie Bernstein: Do you believe a government can be shamed into or out of what it's doing by the actions of individuals?
Joss Whedon: The idea was to say that people can make a difference, they can show the wrongs that are being done. They can speak out against them and make people aware of them. They can even create giant scandals. Sometimes they can topple governments. The point is that the truth is always more important than the power structure, and whether you make a dent or not, the fact that you succeeded in trying is a victory.
-Serenity - The Official Visual Companion, page 35



Dollhouse, 'The Target' (The Most Dangerous Game, Or Why Darth Cheney's Daughter Got A Sex Change)
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=2&t=37013

JonBenet Ramsey: CIA's Electroshocked Mind-Control Sex Slave
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=18&t=23507


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Friday, May 14, 2010 7:36 AM

JAMERON4EVA


Quote:

Originally posted by Lutzi:
Hello everybody. I am new here. I just got done watching the entire Firefly series. It was the best thing I have seen on TV. Sadly, I am actually mad that it was canceled, eight years ago! The graphics, writing everything is better than anything that is out there now!



Don't forget, these were the people who cancelled Dark Angel, and TSCC. Mind you TSCC had Summer Glau, and DA had Jessica Alba. The twp best actresses in the Biz. SCrew Angelina Jolie-Pitt.

"Mom, he has her chip. He has her."
John Connor,"Born To Run", TSCC EP 2x22

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Friday, May 14, 2010 9:37 AM

ZEEK


Quote:

Originally posted by jameron4eva:
Quote:

Originally posted by Lutzi:
Hello everybody. I am new here. I just got done watching the entire Firefly series. It was the best thing I have seen on TV. Sadly, I am actually mad that it was canceled, eight years ago! The graphics, writing everything is better than anything that is out there now!



Don't forget, these were the people who cancelled Dark Angel, and TSCC. Mind you TSCC had Summer Glau, and DA had Jessica Alba. The twp best actresses in the Biz. SCrew Angelina Jolie-Pitt.

"Mom, he has her chip. He has her."
John Connor,"Born To Run", TSCC EP 2x22


2 right out of 3 ain't so bad. Maybe we're too hard on them.

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Friday, May 14, 2010 7:09 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


Welcome aboard.

You just asked the million dollar question (literally). You and a couple hundred thousand folk are wondering what were they thinking. And what's really amazing to me is that Hulu (a venture launched by Fox and Universal) has it listed - get this - as a TV Classic. Go figure, what brainiacs!

I have a theory (among the hundreds floating about). Fox is owned by one Rupert Murdoch, an ultra-conservative, who's beliefs leaned toward the Alliance way of thinking (I'm just saying). This show is centered around the little guy, or, as Mal would say, "just honest folk."

Murdoch and company, in their infinite "wisdom," see this as a huge problem (see above comment re: Alliance thinking). For these "folk" authority figures are to be feared and obeyed, not made out to be the "bad guys." It's what you might call a basic conflict of interest. From the outset "Firefly" was treated like a bastard child, this despite the fact that Fox greenlit the show (mostly based upon Joss's rep from Buffy and Angel).

Fox wanted to make money of course, but they wanted to make it the old fashioned way, by controlling the "signal." Just look at Fox's leanings in their news programs. Attack, attack, attack. Anyways, here we are because - You can't stop the signal.

Once again, Welcome.


SGG

Tawabawho?

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Saturday, May 15, 2010 9:44 AM

LOOKING4RAMA


I'm new here too. Same story - saw Serenity, then got the series. Best thing I've seen on TV since the original Star Trek (yes, I'm that old). I've watched all but the last 2 episodes. I'm putting off watching them because I don't want it to end...

It is really a testament to the vision and talent of Joss, the writers, and the cast that the show is still earning new fans 8 years after it ended.

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