REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Thanks for all the fish

POSTED BY: SIGNYM
UPDATED: Monday, May 12, 2014 16:17
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 4418
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Saturday, May 10, 2014 2:48 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Yanno how the parent says I'm not angry, I'm disappointed?

Well, that's not me. I'm both disappointed AND angry.

I don't expect to be believed. In fact, I would be rather disturbed if you all just took my word for events that I post about.

However, I would hope that you liberals would give me enough credit to at least look things up for yourselves. What I've discovered from your recent behavior, however, is that instead of looking at the evidence as it stands you seem to think that if you can argue with ME you'll somehow make the facts "go away". There is hardly a smidgen of objectivity or intellectual honesty to share amongst yourselves.

I'm not your intellectual errand-boy, to be finding facts and information that you're either too lazy or too propagandized to look up for yourselves. I'm not your political whipping-boy either. If you want to keep an eye on events, you have to put in SOME effort yourselves. Don't expect to stay undisturbed in your comfy-cozy cocoon and still be able to perceive truth, because yanno what? The truth is sometimes hard, and it often runs counter to the narrative that we like to tell ourselves. So bird-dog the truth yourselves, or stay uninformed; it's on you-

not me.

If you think this is a giant FU, you're right. If you think it's undeserved, you're wrong.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 3:02 PM

CHRISISALL


Signy, there's a LOT of fighting these days, and not just here- most every site I frequent has gone all personality attack as opposed to fact/subject debate. I for one truly appreciate what you present & discuss here. You were only wrong on one issue once, and I don't recall what that was, but I'm guessing you HAD to be wrong at least once.
I think the whole fucking world is one big bowl of snot & stress now. And it's seeping into these sites too.
I had to take a vacation from here- sounds like you may need a short one yourself.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 3:33 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


I've PMed back and forth with Signy.

It's not the right wing here that's the problem.

It's the liberals who are as firmly entrenched in their own propaganda as jongsy and rappy are in theirs. After having repeatedly brought to people's attention over the years that the stories they like to believe aren't true, the Ukraine topic was just the last straw.

When shown actual photos that did prove that the narrative they were so heavily invested in was flat out wrong (ie ANYthing anti-Russian) did they investigate? Check out various sources? Sift out facts? No. They said the photos were too obscure to interpret. Shrugged them off. Said she was mentally unbalanced. Called her PN.

I've been saying to her that maybe the difference between the right wing and the liberals was that while the right wing was totally resistant to facts, perhaps liberals could be moved with more exposure.

But I sense that while some people may be moved to admit that perhaps some things that occurred in Odessa they originally believed were misrepresented, the total narrative hasn't changed. At best they might say it's an unfortunate difference of opinion in The Ukraine, rather than a $5B effort on the part of the US to destabilize and overthrow a democratically elected government using Svoboda boots on the ground. Because, despite all the evidence, the US must really just be an innocent force for good just trying to help out democracy.

I'll truly miss Signy. Her departure was one she was considering for a long time, and which I tried to gently discourage her from. But she is fact-driven if nothing else. And the fact is that facts don't count here. Not with the right wing, and not with the liberals either.

Fwiw, her posts are, were, the main reason I come here anymore.



OONJERAH - We are too dumb to live and smart enough to wipe ourselves out.
"You, who live in any kind of comfort or convenience, do not know how these people can survive these things, do you? They will endure because there is no immediate escape from endurance. Some will die, the rest must live."

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 3:55 PM

JONGSSTRAW


Hey Siggy, try not to let the door hit you on the way out!


And remember ...


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Saturday, May 10, 2014 4:15 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


hate to disappoint you Jongssie, but this is not farewell. I will continue to bring facts and links to the board, but I'm sure not going to argue about them, so you'll see a lot less of me.

KIKI nailed it. This isn't about you. Because when you have to descend to posting picture of fat women, I figure you've reached the end of your (very) limited mental and emotional capacities.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 4:24 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Oh cool.

I was thinking I was losing good info and that there was no reason to come here anymore.



OONJERAH - We are too dumb to live and smart enough to wipe ourselves out.
"You, who live in any kind of comfort or convenience, do not know how these people can survive these things, do you? They will endure because there is no immediate escape from endurance. Some will die, the rest must live."

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 5:04 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
I've PMed back and forth with Signy.

It's not the right wing here that's the problem.

It's the liberals who are as firmly entrenched in their own propaganda as jongsy and rappy are in theirs. After having repeatedly brought to people's attention over the years that the stories they like to believe aren't true, the Ukraine topic was just the last straw.



Coming from you two that is to damn funny.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 5:06 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


So, do you dispute the many minutes of video signy posted?



OONJERAH - We are too dumb to live and smart enough to wipe ourselves out.
"You, who live in any kind of comfort or convenience, do not know how these people can survive these things, do you? They will endure because there is no immediate escape from endurance. Some will die, the rest must live."

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 5:11 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
So, do you dispute the many minutes of video signy posted?



That the video's show pro-Ukrainian forcing pro-Russian protesters into the building and throwing Molotov cocktails, no I don't dispute that.

You want to draw other conclusions from those video's I might.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 5:18 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


And shooting at them. Can't forget that. Just a smattering of your posts. Rather than check out the FACTS, you chose to defend your preferred propaganda and attack Signy and the sources. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=57980 This: "Kiev Neo-Nazis shoot and club people escaping from burning building...and INSIDE ... raped, shot, doused with flammables and set on fire. Pictures (WARNING) and proof." was true. And you turned out to be wrong.

Whatever. I'm not going to bother with you either.


SIGNYM is starting to go the way of Pirate News.
Funny that both sites you linked to ties to one side of this crisis. RT stands for Russia Today, which has Michel Chossudovsky on as commentator all the time. Chossudavsky runs Centre for Research on Globalisation.

I'm not going to claim the pictures were retouched. They however do not prove what you claim. We know people died in that fire, however how it started and how thos people dies is not proven by those pictures. If it was that clear no one would have have to add arrows and circles and captions to them.

You seem to have taken a side in this and are unable to move from it. Don't you get that you are posting a pro-Russian naritive from pro-Russian websites? Does that seem a litte off to you?

The pictures can tell different stories depending on who is telling them. There was no doubt a fire and those people died. Those pictures tell us that, but they don't tell us a great many of the other things RT and you are claiming they do.





OONJERAH - We are too dumb to live and smart enough to wipe ourselves out.
"You, who live in any kind of comfort or convenience, do not know how these people can survive these things, do you? They will endure because there is no immediate escape from endurance. Some will die, the rest must live."

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 5:19 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Wow, I guess I've missed a lot. None of that pertains to me, must be something from some of the many, many threads I no longer bother to read. I don't bother to read a lot of threads because they're about stuff I already know and about which I have nothing to contribute. I don't spend much time here anymore.

Just wanted to pop in and say hey, ho, those are a lot of nasty, sweeping statements, none of which has anything to do with THIS "liberal", thank you very much. I tend to investigate anything I'm interested enough in that I find here to see what I think of it, so I kind of resent some of what you wrote.

Just sad to read this thread, that's all.


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Saturday, May 10, 2014 5:24 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
hate to disappoint you Jongssie, but this is not farewell. I will continue to bring facts and links to the board, but I'm sure not going to argue about them, so you'll see a lot less of me.



Well just dayum.

" Thanks for all the fish " is suppose to imply that you're LEAVING.

Even I know that !

Saying you're NOT leaving, and simply 'thanks for the fish'... you're doing it all wrong !

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 5:25 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
And shooting at them. Can't forget that. Just a smattering of your posts. Rather than check out the FACTS, you chose to defend your preferred propaganda and attack Signy and the sources. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=57980 And you turned out to be wrong.



Please save me the "I'm not going to bother with you" bullshit. You've said that to Rappy and others many times but you still respond to them.

As for being proven wrong were did that happen? Signym's post was making a lot of claims about what happened in the building and how those people died. Those pictures don't prove those things.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 6:07 PM

JONGSSTRAW


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
hate to disappoint you Jongssie, but this is not farewell. I will continue to bring facts and links to the board, but I'm sure not going to argue about them, so you'll see a lot less of me.



Well just dayum.

" Thanks for all the fish " is suppose to imply that you're LEAVING.

Even I know that !

Saying you're NOT leaving, and simply 'thanks for the fish'... you're doing it all wrong !


Right, but in her original hissy rant she ...

1) Says 'fuck you' to her LIBERAL friends.

2) Tells her LIBERAL friends they're all lazy idiots with no "intellectual honesty".

3) States that she is the ONLY ONE who knows the facts, and she is the ONLY ONE who can be right about everything.


Maybe now some of those same LIBERAL friends will finally see what a delusional egomaniac she is by her own words....

Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Yanno how the parent says I'm not angry, I'm disappointed?

Well, that's not me. I'm both disappointed AND angry.

I don't expect to be believed. In fact, I would be rather disturbed if you all just took my word for events that I post about.

However, I would hope that you liberals would give me enough credit to at least look things up for yourselves. What I've discovered from your recent behavior, however, is that instead of looking at the evidence as it stands you seem to think that if you can argue with ME you'll somehow make the facts "go away". There is hardly a smidgen of objectivity or intellectual honesty to share amongst yourselves.

I'm not your intellectual errand-boy, to be finding facts and information that you're either too lazy or too propagandized to look up for yourselves. I'm not your political whipping-boy either. If you want to keep an eye on events, you have to put in SOME effort yourselves. Don't expect to stay undisturbed in your comfy-cozy cocoon and still be able to perceive truth, because yanno what? The truth is sometimes hard, and it often runs counter to the narrative that we like to tell ourselves. So bird-dog the truth yourselves, or stay uninformed; it's on you-

not me.

If you think this is a giant FU, you're right. If you think it's undeserved, you're wrong.


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Saturday, May 10, 2014 6:27 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:

Right, but in her original hissy rant she ...

1) Says 'fuck you' to her LIBERAL friends.

2) Tells her LIBERAL friends they're all lazy idiots with no "intellectual honesty".

3) States that she is the ONLY ONE who knows the facts, and she is the ONLY ONE who can be right about everything.


Maybe now some of those same LIBERAL friends will finally see what a delusional egomaniac she is by her own words....




The worst part ? I never got to choose a side before she went all ookie-balookie.



Still, fun to watch.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 6:43 PM

JONGSSTRAW


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

The worst part ? I never got to choose side before she went all ookie-balookie.



Still, fun to watch.


You put your right foot in
You put your right foot out
You put your right foot in
And you shake it all about

You do the Ookie-Balookie and you turn yourself around
That's what it's all about.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 7:01 PM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Yanno how the parent says I'm not angry, I'm disappointed?

Well, that's not me. I'm both disappointed AND angry.

I don't expect to be believed. In fact, I would be rather disturbed if you all just took my word for events that I post about.

However, I would hope that you liberals would give me enough credit to at least look things up for yourselves. What I've discovered from your recent behavior, however, is that instead of looking at the evidence as it stands you seem to think that if you can argue with ME you'll somehow make the facts "go away". There is hardly a smidgen of objectivity or intellectual honesty to share amongst yourselves.


You still don't get it, but I'm done trying to explain. I'm rapidly losing interest in you, and unlike you with Rappy, that means I actually will stop the dance.

Really, I have not been as interested in Ukraine as much as in your bizarre behavior. Your personality has undergone quite a shift. And the way you've reacted to this confirms it: big emotion, inability to *grok* anyone not fully convinced by you, and finally taking your ball and going off in a snit. Yes, I understand you're not leaving the site, but you certainly want everyone to know that you're giving up on "discussing." Seems a weird thing to do in RWEDiscussions, hey? Kind'a like what the religiosos did when their beliefs were put to discussion, hey?


Quote:

If you think this is a giant FU, you're right. If you think it's undeserved, you're wrong.


If you think that bothers me, you're assuming that I'm as emotionally invested in this thing as you are. Sorry to disappoint. I found you interesting, entertaining, and informative in your prior personality, but this new one.... bleh.

One more before I move on: you really ought to not take the internet so seriously. We're not the U.N. here. We make no policies. The piddly info shouted over by the piddly few of us who still show up on occasion (and there certainly are less human beings involved in RWED than there are screennames) have very little effect on anything in the RW.



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http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=57532
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Saturday, May 10, 2014 7:06 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
hate to disappoint you Jongssie, but this is not farewell.

The GOOD news!
Quote:

I will continue to bring facts and links to the board, but I'm sure not going to argue about them, so you'll see a lot less of me.
The BAD news.

Just for the record, posting shit like PN comparisons or fat girl pictures pretty much says what needs to be said by the POSTER themselves about THEM.
IE: I can't argue coherently.

Yeah, some Libs can be just as dense as any Con. Stupid is equal opportunity.






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Saturday, May 10, 2014 7:10 PM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
It's not the right wing here that's the problem.

It's the liberals who are as firmly entrenched in their own propaganda as jongsy and rappy are in theirs. After having repeatedly brought to people's attention over the years that the stories they like to believe aren't true, the Ukraine topic was just the last straw.

LOL! That's really funny. And always a good way to improve communication: make broad sweeping statements of blame and blindly throw a label on folks.

Quote:

When shown actual photos that did prove that the narrative they were so heavily invested in was flat out wrong (ie ANYthing anti-Russian) did they investigate? Check out various sources? Sift out facts? No. They said the photos were too obscure to interpret. Shrugged them off. Said she was mentally unbalanced. Called her PN.
Oooooh. "actual" photos! That must be absolute proof that everything Sig says absolutely must be true!!! /sheesh

Now, I didn't call her PN, but everything else you're saying seems aimed at me. I'm operating under that assumption, so correct me if you didn't mean me.

If you did: LOL! again that you think I'm anti-Russian. Like I said, I don't have a side here. I don't know enough about it to claim a side, and I don't believe that anything I find on YOUtube or biased governmental news sites or biased media news sites is going to make me an infallible expert on a war on the other side of the world.

I'm a little disappointed that sig thinks this is possible, but she's been completely one-sided from the get-go. I don't think she's pro-Russian, I think her new personality is gung-ho to hate on every American policy, and she hates the Western media enough to take any side against it.

Hating the media: cool! Me too. Jumping blindly onto any other side: not my cuppa. And yes, blindly. I recall the first thread she started about this that was all into RT because sure, they may be biased but the West is REALLY biased so RT must be telling the truth.

OK, this has been fun. Really. One of the most interesting things about this site is the chance to explore you bizarre figments of the internet virtual reality. Whether you're "real" people or invented personalities, you can be entertaining for short stints here and there.

But now I'm done with this one and the Bruins are on. Go B's!




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Saturday, May 10, 2014 7:14 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by MAL4PREZ:

One more before I move on: you really ought to not take the internet so seriously. We're the U.N. here. We make no policies.


Some times we react a little worse to stuff when we're under stress. I know I do, that why I took a break from here. And I'll take another when I need to. But yeah, this is just a discussion group with a few hardcore anti-whatevers floating about, nothing to lose you pretty floral bonnet over.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 7:36 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


"After having repeatedly brought to people's attention over the years that the stories they like to believe aren't true" // "always a good way to improve communication: make broad sweeping statements of blame and labeling"

signy provided a list, checkmark whichever applies


"Oooooh. "actual" photos! That must be absolute proof that everything Sig says absolutely must be true!!! /sheesh"

Not what I posted.


"everything else you're saying seems aimed at me"

Not even close. There's a whole list of posters who claim to be liberal, or at least fact-oriented and reasonable - who didn't seem to want to be bothered with checking out the facts, or even discussing what might be factual before they dismissed it all as crazy-russian-biased-abnormal-pn stuff, and of course there are the ones who claim to be fact-based who stayed away in droves and couldn't be bothered at all. I'm sorry if you feel singled out. I didn't have you specifically in mind.


"I think her new personality is gung-ho to hate on every American policy ..."

Well, there's an extended list both domestic and foreign to hate. Indefinite detention? 24/7 spying on the US? Kettling Occupy? Prosecuting whistle-blowers? Drone murders? Backing the Egyptian army? Trying to arrange a UN or at least NATO attack on Syria through bogus chemical attack claims? Do any of these strike a chord?


"Jumping blindly onto any other side ..."

Not what Signy did. But if multiple posts from different sources showing you the narrative you got in the western news with your breakfast was all slanted one way didn't convince you there is a WRONG side here - what would it take?




OONJERAH - We are too dumb to live and smart enough to wipe ourselves out.
"You, who live in any kind of comfort or convenience, do not know how these people can survive these things, do you? They will endure because there is no immediate escape from endurance. Some will die, the rest must live."

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 8:00 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by MAL4PREZ:
I think her new personality is gung-ho to hate on every American policy

My car needs a new nose panel, the one it has is missing a piece on the right side (a true "what was that?" moment), the gas tank needs a new band, the cockpit fan is busted, the handle on the window-roll-up thing keeps fallin' off...
Hey, I LOVE my car, but that don't stop me from realizin' all what dearly needs to be fixed on her.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 8:08 PM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
"After having repeatedly brought to people's attention over the years that the stories they like to believe aren't true" // "always a good way to improve communication: make broad sweeping statements of blame and labeling"

signy provided a list, checkmark whichever applies



You lost me. I meant you blaming "liberals." Which is really funny, but not surprising. Sig has done a whole helluva lot to keep Rappy alive and wriggling on this site: she's always been up to engaging him, giving him ultimatums year after year after year, despite his obvious... um... shortcomings. And yet this one exchange with liberals who didn't bow to her wisdom made her throw in the towel.

Whatever. She should just have fun dancing with Rap. It seems to be what she likes.


Quote:

"Oooooh. "actual" photos! That must be absolute proof that everything Sig says absolutely must be true!!! /sheesh"

Not what I posted.



You posted that she "posted actual photos that did prove that the narrative they were so heavily invested in was flat out wrong (ie ANYTHING anti-Russian)

She posted photos so she is right and everyone is wrong. That's what you said. Your words. Same thing she is saying: that what she posts is all FACT though it comes from YOUtube and RT and every other damned source that I do not take to be fact.

Hey - I know some other posters who believe everything they post to be FACT.


Quote:

"everything else you're saying seems aimed at me"

Not even close. There's a whole list of posters who claim to be liberal, or at least fact-oriented and reasonable - who didn't seem to want to be bothered with checking out the facts, or even discussing what might be factual before they dismissed it all as crazy-russian-biased-abnormal-pn stuff, and of course there are the ones who claim to be fact-based who stayed away in droves and couldn't be bothered at all. I'm sorry if you feel singled out. I didn't have you specifically in mind.



OK, thanks. Still, I don't see that anyone went all out anti-Russia. I think what people objected to (certainly, what I objected to) was this assumption that the horror of the photos was slam-dunk proof of all kinds of other stuff. You are still saying that. "Actual photos... prove.. anti-Russia... is flat out wrong."


Quote:

"I think her new personality is gung-ho to hate on every American policy ..."

Well, there's an extended list both domestic and foreign to hate. Indefinite detention? 24/7 spying on the US? Kettling Occupy? Prosecuting whistle-blowers? Drone murders? Backing the Egyptian army? Trying to arrange a UN or at least NATO attack on Syria through bogus chemical attack claims? Do any of these strike a chord?



yeah. Sure. Bad stuff. No argument. I hate it too.

The USA being wrong doesn't make someone else right. Not a zero sum game here.

Quote:

"Jumping blindly onto any other side ..."

Not what Signy did. But if multiple posts from different sources showing you the narrative you got in the western news with your breakfast was all slanted one way didn't convince you there is a WRONG side here - what would it take?


You don't know me at all if you think I have western news with my breakfast. But thank you for showing me that you operate on such blind assumptions. Reminds me that any criticism you aim my way is completely meaningless, as you have no idea who I am. You're just fighting some figment of your own internet virtual reality. Have fun with that!

Bruins up 1-0 after 1 period. Gotta make dinner before period 2 starts, with B's on the power play...



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Saturday, May 10, 2014 8:14 PM

MAL4PREZ


Power play GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOAL!!!!!!!

B's up 2-0. :)



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Saturday, May 10, 2014 8:15 PM

MAL4PREZ


Power play GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOAL!!!!!!!

B's up 3-0. :) :) :)



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Saturday, May 10, 2014 8:20 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


OK - I was trying to be a little literary with "with your breakfast" - it wasn't meant to be literal. It implied the morning newspaper people used to read as they ate breakfast in a bygone era - which hardly anyone gets anymore, am radio-alarm, evening tv news ... the www for all you younger folk - the general stream of commonly available media people access to feel informed.

Where did I say she was right about everything and everyone else was wrong (about everything)?



OONJERAH - We are too dumb to live and smart enough to wipe ourselves out.
"You, who live in any kind of comfort or convenience, do not know how these people can survive these things, do you? They will endure because there is no immediate escape from endurance. Some will die, the rest must live."

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 8:54 PM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:

Originally posted by MAL4PREZ:
I think her new personality is gung-ho to hate on every American policy

My car needs a new nose panel, the one it has is missing a piece on the right side (a true "what was that?" moment), the gas tank needs a new band, the cockpit fan is busted, the handle on the window-roll-up thing keeps fallin' off...
Hey, I LOVE my car, but that don't stop me from realizin' all what dearly needs to be fixed on her.



Chris, you really are one of the more priceless posters here.


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Saturday, May 10, 2014 8:56 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Okay, after reading all this, I can't resist popping in to ask a question. I'm not about to read what I've kind of guessed is the thread that started Sig going off the rails, but since Sig started this thread, and did so as a way to say FU to people here, I'm not going to start a new thread to ask my question, I'll do it here.

My question is this: When the map stuff came up, about Rap being in Georgia, etc., I played with the FFF "Browncoat Map" for a bit. Found it fascinating; most people were exactly where I'd made note they said they were. The one that had me saying "huh", and I asked about it at the time, was Sig and Kiki. I never got an answer, from them or anyone else.

If you go to the "Browncoats Map" on FFF, and look in the Los Angeles area, you see this:



If you click on that "12", you get a close-up view. Putting the cursor over each flag brings up a name. Here are the two which fascinated me:





Now, in the past Kiki has written that she lives in "San Dimas", which is North of the L.A. area, and Sig wrote she lived "near Long Beach". Neither of those places is near what is shown on the map. And there's TWELVE supposed "Browncoats" in that one "block" on the map. The other names are

VEEJER
YT
TONYP
IANR
MOJAVE
CAPTAINHAMMER
ANOTHERCOATOFBROWN
DRAGONWINE
PLATONIST

So I've found myself wondering; do we have a whole bunch of sockpuppets at work here, or what? Certainly, as I wrote at the time, where I'm flagged on that map is close to where I live, but about three miles East, so it's not absolutely accurate for me (others might check and see how close it is for them). Everyone I looked up at the time was at least in the same CITY as they'd previously written they were.

But twelve Browncoats in one block, and Sig and Kiki being flagged right next to one another and quite a ways away from where they claim they live? While Long Beach isn't that far from where they're flagged in L.A. (and NewOldBrowcoat is right there in Long Beach, as he's always said, by the way), San Dimas is quite a ways North of the L.A. area…

All this is, of course, totally unimportant. But Sig going off the rails in this thread, as it certainly seems she has, and Kiki being so intent on defending her, made me think back to all this. So, having nothing better to do for a few minutes, never having forgotten my curiosity about finding this before, and given the content of this thread, I just thought I'd toss it out there in case anyone else is interested.

Oh, and I didn't miss Kiki's "and of course there are the ones who claim to be fact-based who stayed away in droves and couldn't be bothered at all". Dunno if that's aimed at me or not, but I found it interesting when I compared it to--I may be wrong, but I BELIEVE Signy--railing on me for "refusing" to answer a question from her at least twice, which questions happened to be in threads I'd never even read. To both I say, just once, that the day I feel COMPELLED to read and respond to any specific thread on FFF is the day I truly DO throw in the towel! I read what looks interesting to me, and don't even respond to most of that…anyone who takes this place that seriously, well, has serious problems.

…and I'm off to more interesting, worthwhile pursuits… Enjoy.


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Saturday, May 10, 2014 8:57 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


Hmmmm, I seem to have missed a lot.

Prolly a good thing

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 8:59 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Okay, after reading all this, I can't resist popping in to ask a question. I'm not about to read what I've kind of guessed is the thread that started Sig going off the rails, but since Sig started this thread, and did so as a way to say FU to people here, I'm not going to start a new thread to ask my question, I'll do it here.

My question is this: When the map stuff came up, about Rap being in Georgia, etc., I played with the FFF "Browncoat Map" for a bit. Found it fascinating; most people were exactly where I'd made note they said they were. The one that had me saying "huh", and I asked about it at the time, was Sig and Kiki. I never got an answer, from them or anyone else.

If you go to the "Browncoats Map" on FFF, and look in the Los Angeles area, you see this:



If you click on that "12", you get a close-up view. Putting the cursor over each flag brings up a name. Here are the two which fascinated me:





Now, in the past Kiki has written that she lives in "San Dimas", which is North of the L.A. area, and Sig wrote she lived "near Long Beach". Neither of those places is near what is shown on the map. And there's TWELVE supposed "Browncoats" in that one "block" on the map. The other names are

VEEJER
YT
TONYP
IANR
MOJAVE
CAPTAINHAMMER
ANOTHERCOATOFBROWN
DRAGONWINE
PLATONIST

So I've found myself wondering; do we have a whole bunch of sockpuppets at work here, or what? Certainly, as I wrote at the time, where I'm flagged on that map is close to where I live, but about three miles East, so it's not absolutely accurate for me (others might check and see how close it is for them). Everyone I looked up at the time was at least in the same CITY as they'd previously written they were.

But twelve Browncoats in one block, and Sig and Kiki being flagged right next to one another and quite a ways away from where they claim they live? While Long Beach isn't that far from where they're flagged in L.A. (and NewOldBrowcoat is right there in Long Beach, as he's always said, by the way), San Dimas is quite a ways North of the L.A. area…

All this is, of course, totally unimportant. But Sig going off the rails in this thread, as it certainly seems she has, and Kiki being so intent on defending her, made me think back to all this. So, having nothing better to do for a few minutes, never having forgotten my curiosity about finding this before, and given the content of this thread, I just thought I'd toss it out there in case anyone else is interested.

Oh, and I didn't miss Kiki's "and of course there are the ones who claim to be fact-based who stayed away in droves and couldn't be bothered at all". Dunno if that's aimed at me or not, but I found it interesting when I compared it to--I may be wrong, but I BELIEVE Signy--railing on me for "refusing" to answer a question from her at least twice, which questions happened to be in threads I'd never even read. To both I say, just once, that the day I feel COMPELLED to read and respond to any specific thread on FFF is the day I truly DO throw in the towel! I read what looks interesting to me, and don't even respond to most of that…anyone who takes this place that seriously, well, has serious problems.

…and I'm off to more interesting, worthwhile pursuits… Enjoy.




the maps are not accurate. I've checked out where I am supposed to live and, although in the same city, is nowhere close. I dont know how they determine the exact location, but maybe its something to do with the IP? I'm guessing here.


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Saturday, May 10, 2014 9:05 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Niki

FWIW If you think I'm a sock-puppet then of course you'll mistrust whatever I post. And if you don't then I don't need to answer your accusation. That IS an accusation - right?

But for the record - I'm not anyone's sock-puppet, nor do I have any. I live in San Dimas. And I have no idea where that place is that's pictured, or who those posters are.

Believe what you will.



OONJERAH - We are too dumb to live and smart enough to wipe ourselves out.
"You, who live in any kind of comfort or convenience, do not know how these people can survive these things, do you? They will endure because there is no immediate escape from endurance. Some will die, the rest must live."

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 9:09 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


I'm also listed as living in a tree with 3 other posters that I know nothing about.

I don't think ikiki is signy's sockpuppet. I mean why would they bother?

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 9:09 PM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
OK - I was trying to be a little literary with "with your breakfast" - it wasn't meant to be literal. It implied the morning newspaper people used to read as they ate breakfast in a bygone era - which hardly anyone gets anymore, am radio-alarm, evening tv news ... the www for all you younger folk - the general stream of commonly available media people access to to feel informed.


Yeah, duh. Your implied meaning is that I am led by the nose by the Western media. Your implied meaning -- and also your explicitly state meaning in this thread -- is that the only reason I doubt Sig's conclusions is that I am a blind sheepy slave to Western media.

Combined with Sig's input on this issue, this is what I'm hearing from you folks: if I want to prove I'm not a slave to the Western media, I should be a slave to RT, etc.

Cool. All right then.

ETA: Just how young do you think I am? "You younger folk..." Really. Not so much.


Quote:

Where did I say she was right about everything and everyone else was wrong (about everything)?


OK, by "everything" I mean everything in the Ukraine story.

Again. Third time. You said: "When shown actual photos that did prove that the narrative they were so heavily invested in was flat out wrong (ie ANYthing anti-Russian) did they investigate?"

Fourth time: "the narrative they [those anti-Russian RWED "liberals"] were so heavily invested in was PROVE(D) FLAT OUT WRONG"

The photos showed a few things, not "everything." "Everything" refers to what you call "the narrative," the one that you say Sig is right about and the "liberals" are wrong about, though I still haven't seen where anyone posted any kind of anti-Russian narrative. Just a refusal to bow to sig.

You know, which is why she loves to dance with Rap. He makes her so very right so very always. I guess she's gotten used to that.

3-1 starting the 3rd...



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Saturday, May 10, 2014 9:14 PM

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT


Gorrammit, Sig, I'm gonna miss your presence. Your stuff is ALWAYS worth reading. I may not agree on some issues or concerns, but you're always thought provoking.

As to the Ukraine thing, I've stayed out of that one mostly. I'm still an old school anti-Russia guy: I see Putin as being as aggressive and imperialist as Hitler, only using a sneakier technique, and the Ukrainian insurgent government as supporting freer free choice, as between the EU and Russia. And I remember the old Cold War days, when anybody who could, wanted to get out of the USSR. While pragmatically, I don't see much the USA can do, without starting WW 3. And I'm not suggesting that there have not been abuses and atrocities on both sides.

So I don't know, and I've tried to stay out: it's too far away, and of too little effect on the USA. I'd like to see the folks a lot closer over there step up and do some heavy lifting.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 9:25 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


The narrative:

the pro-Russians started shooting
the pro-Kiev moved in and forced them into a building
the pro-Russians threw Molotov cocktails and set the building on fire
the pro-Russians died in the fire or when jumping to escape the flames

Now, there are pictures I didn't explicitly discuss - I know my eyes are bad and my visual processing is faulty, but I assume that if I'm having difficulty trying to figure out a photo, then everyone else is too. But there are photos that OBVIOUSLY don't fit the narrative. The men with blood pools under their heads. The woman bent backwards over a desk with no trace of fire. The woman who was raped. The many videos add convincing evidence - the narrative provided by western news was false.

BTW - if we both have the time and interest, maybe we could go back to that thread (probably where this belongs) and look at the responses.




OONJERAH - We are too dumb to live and smart enough to wipe ourselves out.
"You, who live in any kind of comfort or convenience, do not know how these people can survive these things, do you? They will endure because there is no immediate escape from endurance. Some will die, the rest must live."

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 9:40 PM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
My question is this: When the map stuff came up, about Rap being in Georgia, etc., I played with the FFF "Browncoat Map" for a bit. Found it fascinating; most people were exactly where I'd made note they said they were. The one that had me saying "huh", and I asked about it at the time, was Sig and Kiki. I never got an answer, from them or anyone else.


I've never looked into the map. Interesting. Does it show everyone, even if they didn't put their location in?

I was not thinking SIG = KIKI, though that's an intriguing idea. I have other theories that are even more entertaining. ;)

Will I ever know? Nah. But it's fun to play with. A meaningless little mystery to investigate. Because no matter how clever people are, patterns establish themselves over the years...

Kiki - perhaps, re returning to the Ukraine thread. Thing is, I really am more interested in what this issue reveals about RWED posters than I am in the issue itself. I don't mean to say that what's happening in Ukraine isn't damned important, much more so than this silly meaningless (in the long run) website.

But I have no control over Ukraine, and nor should I. I'm an American. That doesn't mean I have any right to pass judgement over another country's struggles and tell them what to do. I'm not smarter or nobler or wiser than any of the people who are out on those streets right now. I don't know their condition or history or personal hopes or struggles. I have no right to decide who to blame.

Boston 4-1, 5 mins to go.

ETA: 4-2 with 2:30. Damn.

/tangent F***ing Subban. I should hate him for how much damage he's done against the B's, but damn isn't it cool to see a black guy killing it in the NHL? Ugh. Whole other issue. I admit - I'm not color blind. I love seeing a black guy breaking the NHL barriers. (And Iginla and Carter...) Only thing that could beat it is an openly gay guy. Wouldn't that be something as far as crushing barriers?


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Saturday, May 10, 2014 9:43 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


MAL4, you make such a big fucking deal about RT.

WHY?

I make a point of posting from almost ANY OTHER site than RT (zerohedge most notably) and yet... there you are, being all bothered by ... what?

So, are you anti-Russian? Youbetcha! You're one of those people who THINKS they're being reasonable, but you have big blinders on, just as big as rappy's only differently shaped.

You're right, we're not the UN here, but you are a citizen- right? You vote? You make you opinion known in other ways to your Congresspeople and President? Do you really think it doesn't matter, that you are somehow absolved of evil if you go along with yet another evil plan by the USA? After Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, and Syria, have you learned nothing about the real policies of the USA, or have any concern for the millions of lives that we've ruined and the hundreds of thousands of people that we killed? Or would this, just, yanno, ruin your enjoyment of a baseball game?

I used to think you were a halfway decent person.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 9:49 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
The narrative:

the pro-Russians started shooting
the pro-Kiev moved in and forced them into a building
the pro-Russians threw Molotov cocktails and set the building on fire
the pro-Russians died in the fire or when jumping to escape the flames

Now, there are pictures I didn't explicitly discuss - I know my eyes are bad and my visual processing is faulty, but I assume that if I'm having difficulty trying to figure out a photo, then everyone else is too. But there are photos that OBVIOUSLY don't fit the narrative. The men with blood pools under their heads. The woman bent backwards over a desk with no trace of fire. The woman who was raped. The many videos add convincing evidence - the narrative provided by western news was false.

BTW - if we both have the time and interest, maybe we could go back to that thread (probably where this belongs) and look at the responses.



People shot is not some big revolution, there was shooting going on from both sides. The women bent over the desk is not burned, but could have very well died of smoke inhalation. The one picture of a women burn and her legs spread does not mean she was rapped.

I have also not hurt the narrative you are saying is the western one. I heard there was a clash between the two sides, the pro-Russian one was forced back into the building and in the chaos a the fire started. Yes, the Ukrainian government is painting a picture that blames the pro-Russian side for everything. That is what all governments do. The media however has not simply parroted that.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 9:52 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
MAL4, you make such a big fucking deal about RT.

WHY?

I make a point of posting from almost ANY OTHER site than RT (zerohedge most notably) and yet... there you are, being all bothered by ... what?

So, are you anti-Russian? Youbetcha! You're one of those people who THINKS they're being reasonable, but you have big blinders on, just as big as rappy's only differently shaped.

You're right, we're not the UN here, but you are a citizen- right? You vote? You make you opinion known in other ways to your Congresspeople and President? Do you really think it doesn't matter, that you are somehow absolved of evil if you go along with yet another evil plan by the USA? After Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, and Syria, have you learned nothing about the real policies of the USA, or have any concern for the millions of lives that we've ruined and the hundreds of thousands of people that we killed? Or would this, just, yanno, ruin your enjoyment of a baseball game?

I used to think you were a halfway decent person.



Any reasonable person is going to question a Russian new outlet when you have a conflict that is pro/anti-Russian.

What evil plan do you think the US has for Ukraine?

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 9:58 PM

CHRISISALL


It's a spell. An anger spell by an anger demon...

Seriously, I've had better times at the dentist. Or enduring Rappy's nonsense.

Can I suggest cooling down a bit, or is this the wrong crowd?

-Washisall

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 10:15 PM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
It's a spell. An anger spell by an anger demon...

Seriously, I've had better times at the dentist. Or enduring Rappy's nonsense.

Can I suggest cooling down a bit, or is this the wrong crowd?

-Washisall



Really? I find this all very interesting. Perhaps it's the Niska in me: hold a human over the fire and you see what's really in there...

I hope it's obvi that I'd never actually burn a person. But the heat of an internet argument can reveal a lot. It's like a little bitty virtual volcano. :)

Still, sorry for making you unhappy Chris. You are the Willow or Kaylee of RWED: the pure soul. Ummm... except when you said something unacceptable to Rap...

So there. We all have our moments.

B's win! Game 6 in Montreal, Monday.


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Saturday, May 10, 2014 10:17 PM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
You're right, we're not the UN here, but you are a citizen- right? You vote? You make you opinion known in other ways to your Congresspeople and President?


And this has the effect of... what?

Quote:

Or would this, just, yanno, ruin your enjoyment of a baseball game?

I used to think you were a halfway decent person.



And you just lost all my respect, not knowing baseball from hockey... /snark

Seriously, enjoy that high horse you're on. Now I def do know why you love Rap so much. You do love being superior. Which is exactly what's wrong with America.

You have fun telling those stupid inferior Ukrainians and Russians what they ought to be doing.

I am SO right about you LOL!



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Saturday, May 10, 2014 10:28 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by MAL4PREZ:
Still, sorry for making you unhappy Chris. You are the Willow or Kaylee of RWED: the pure soul. Ummm... except when you said something unacceptable to Rap...


Rap makes me Mal fighting the war again. Sometimes. Or Dark Willow.
Haven't visited there much recently. Thankfully.
Just hate seein' family fight here is all.
We're the crew, from near a decade back in some cases.

End of fuzzy-wuzzy speech.





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Saturday, May 10, 2014 10:41 PM

JONGSSTRAW



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Saturday, May 10, 2014 10:53 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Kiki:
Quote:

FWIW If you think I'm a sock-puppet then of course you'll mistrust whatever I post. And if you don't then I don't need to answer your accusation. That IS an accusation - right?

No, it was a question…something that didn't add up to me. I never thought you were a sock puppet before, but some stuff just didn't make sense.

But obviously the map is NOT correct; as Magons says: "the maps are not accurate. I've checked out where I am supposed to live and, although in the same city, is nowhere close. I dont know how they determine the exact location, but maybe its something to do with the IP? I'm guessing here." and "I'm also listed as living in a tree with 3 other posters that I know nothing about." I too am guessing IP address has something to do with it, maybe, but I can accept that the map is at least somewhat off, which pretty much puts that whole question to bed.

Magons: as to "I don't think ikiki is signy's sockpuppet. I mean why would they bother?". I have never understood sock puppetry or why anyone would bother.

So, forget the question, and go back to sniping at one another. Like Chris, I'm sad to see it so I don't think I'll return to this thread. (Sadly, Chris, I don't think suggesting cooling down will have any effect...) :-(


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Saturday, May 10, 2014 10:57 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Sadly, Chris, I don't think suggesting cooling down will have any effect...

Depressed now.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 11:30 PM

KPO

Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.


Quote:

Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
I'm also listed as living in a tree with 3 other posters that I know nothing about.

I don't think ikiki is signy's sockpuppet. I mean why would they bother?


I couldn't find you Magons. Or myself for that matter.

But I don't think the map is supposed to be super accurate - that would be very creepy, if it gave your actual house. It just gives your vicinity - hence why people are on top of each other.

And I do find it curious that Signy and Kiki are in each other's vicinity, according to the map. There's is a relationship I've wondered about.

I was disappointed that I didn't find RiverLove next to Jongsstraw. There goes one of my pet theories :-(

It's not personal. It's just war.

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 11:35 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:

Depressed now.



Dude. Did you NOT see the ABBA video ?

It's posted... right up there!


Quote:

Rap makes me Mal fighting the war again. Sometimes. Or Dark Willow.


But we all love crayon-breaky Willow !


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Saturday, May 10, 2014 11:46 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Niki

I have an IP based at a university ...

ETA: but just checked the map and the cluster is not even close ...



OONJERAH - We are too dumb to live and smart enough to wipe ourselves out.
"You, who live in any kind of comfort or convenience, do not know how these people can survive these things, do you? They will endure because there is no immediate escape from endurance. Some will die, the rest must live."

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Saturday, May 10, 2014 11:48 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


"And I do find it curious that Signy and Kiki are in each other's vicinity ..." Really? There's a kiki on the map? where is that?

Oh - part of that cluster. Well, assuming it's all university-related, that makes sense. There's probably more university people who like firefly compared to others. But the location?? Not even remotely close. I mean welllllll over 10 miles off.

So, it does seem to be IP address related. Interesting. But the discrepancy with geography is an interesting quirk that would be fruitful to puzzle out.



OONJERAH - We are too dumb to live and smart enough to wipe ourselves out.
"You, who live in any kind of comfort or convenience, do not know how these people can survive these things, do you? They will endure because there is no immediate escape from endurance. Some will die, the rest must live."

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