OTHER SCIENCE FICTION SERIES

Enterprise Cliffhanger

POSTED BY: CREVANREAVER
UPDATED: Monday, May 31, 2004 17:28
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Wednesday, May 26, 2004 3:11 PM

CREVANREAVER


The season finale of Star Trek: Enterprise just aired and it ended in a surprise cliffhanger! It was amazing and it proves how all those people who don't support that show are wrong. Season four is going to be great and I hope the show gets picked up for a fifth season.

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Wednesday, May 26, 2004 3:17 PM

GHOLA


Quote:

Originally posted by CrevanReaver:
It was amazing and it proves how all those people who don't support that show are wrong.


Yes because of course if you liked this episode of Enterprise then obviously anybody who doesn't must be wrong.

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Wednesday, May 26, 2004 3:45 PM

LEGALBEGAL


This was actually a decent episode of ST:E right up to the big reveal of the alien. The Nazi's in SF was cool and a possible future. Then they go with the alien and totally ruined the moment for me and all hopes for season four. And when I thought they where turning things around after the last two or three episodes.

How can this mindless dribble stay on the air when a quality show, FireFly, got canned before its prime.


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Wednesday, May 26, 2004 4:23 PM

DAVCO92


** SPOILER WARNING **
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.
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I thought it was an EXCELLENT episode...until the very end. Total and utter drek IMO. More temporal crap when they need to move in a new direction. Vampirish looking alien Nazi's? I really want to like this show but BLEEEHHHHHH!!!! "Hey! Let's start the new season with the something innovative, fresh, and exciting...another time paradox story!" IMO it would have been MUCH better if they'd just gone for a soft, heartfelt happy ending and started fresh next season. Needless to say, the ending restored my lack of faith in the show, which had recently abated. Here's what they should do with the author that wrote that cliffhanger ending

Burn the land, boil the sea...

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Wednesday, May 26, 2004 6:18 PM

BADGERSHAT


I think it was a cool idea, to have the Nazis in San Fran thing... but on the other hand, one more temporal disturbance thingy is just irritating... and on top of that, I've ALWAYS hated season-ender cliffhangers. It's like when a really great song ends by just fading out... if you can come up with something good, end it for ruttin sake...



--Jefé The Hat

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Wednesday, May 26, 2004 10:26 PM

HUMBLE


Watched most of it. More temporal crapola, doomsday weapon that looks like a Borg sphere, and Nazis at the end! Looks like the writers ate some old stories, threw them up and then made an episode out of the mess!

On an up note, the character development of Tripp, T'Pol, and the Doctor is good. If they're not careful they might become interesting. The unused cast members saw a little action. Think they may be writing Hoshi out. Mayweather might be gone as well. Hope a replacement for Archer is on its way! Please kill off Archer, BTW!

I hope it DOES get better if it stays on for a couple more seasons. Think the lackluster eps of this incarnation are damaging fan base of Drek franchise as well as possibilities for another series. (I'm not a big fan of Star Trek, but after so many years of doing this stuff you'd think the quality of eps would be great.)

Counting the days 'till Serenity comes out on the Big Screen!

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Wednesday, May 26, 2004 10:48 PM

CREVANREAVER


OK, I'll admit they might be overdoing it with all the time travel, but I think you have to give the writers credit for such a surprise. I can't imagine anyone who saw the episode ending with anything like that. And I for one actually like cliffhanger season finales. While sometimes they do piss me off a little, especially when they don't close enough story arcs, I think they give a lot of people a reason to tune into the premier of the next season. Come on, a lot of you may not have like everything in the finale but you know you're really interested in what's going to happen in the fourth season premier.

Of course maybe I'm wrong, please tell me if you don't care to find out what's going on and what you would do to improve the content of Enterprise episodes.

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Thursday, May 27, 2004 4:06 AM

CYBERSNARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Ghola:
Yes because of course if you liked this episode of Enterprise then obviously anybody who doesn't must be wrong.

I know I'm gonna get flamed for pointing out that this is the same "logic" that a lot of Enterprise-bashing uses.

FWIW, I liked the ending. The cliffhanger is an age-old narrative tradition for good reason. If they'd given a happily ever after, there'd be very little to encourage even long-time viewers to tune in next season.

And it wasn't out of nowhere. I though something odd was going on when there were no Earth or Vulcan ships to help fight the Xindiball (like a Hamsterball, but for Xindi). I figured that, if the NX-02 had been completed ahead of schedule, it might've led a flotilla to try to support Archer, but what about the smaller in-system ships?

Besides, knowing what happened (we're in the past) doesn't give us how it happened (something wrong with the Xindi vortex, Daniels trying to help and screwing things up further, one of the other Temporal Cold War factions trying to use Enterprise like a chess piece, some temporal effect from the Xindiball going pop).

Besides, juxtaposing the cliffhanger twist on what should've been a resolution was a downright Whedonesque move. Remember, like, every episode of Buffy and Angel? Heck, when I saw it, I just froze for a few seconds before saying "huh."

Now, to make it more Whedonesque, they just have to make the alien a good guy. . .

BTW, I don't think the Nazis that found Archer were in San Fran; it was night out when the commander/general/whatever came in to investigate Archer, but it was daylight in Frisco. It also looked like the aftermath of a battle --something that, even with WWII-era tech, would've been visible as Trip and Travis were flying over the city (columns of smoke, etc).

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Thursday, May 27, 2004 4:12 AM

GHOLA


Quote:

Originally posted by Cybersnark:
Quote:

Originally posted by Ghola:
Yes because of course if you liked this episode of Enterprise then obviously anybody who doesn't must be wrong.

I know I'm gonna get flamed for pointing out that this is the same "logic" that a lot of Enterprise-bashing uses.


Oh I realize that and I wasn't meaning to bash Enterprise I just didn't like the comment that this episode proved that Enterprise was great when that's purely subjective to individual viewers.

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Thursday, May 27, 2004 4:22 AM

BADGERSHAT


I read a report that the plan for Enterprise is, they're bringing it back for one more season, and the writers have more or less been told to a) make the plot arcs less involved (two or three episodes long at most, a la OS and TNG), and b) write the fourth season's finale as a series finale, and a franchise hiatus.

I doubt they'd kill off Archer, and in light of the 4th being its last, I can't see them writing off any OTHER characters, either (Hoshi needed to go two years ago, she's completely not believable with all her languistic ability, and Mayweather has, in my opinion, come across less a major character than a token minority, which is sad, because they really could've done something decent with him).

The Used Parts Network doesn't have a whole lot of intelligence, either, because I ALSO read they're moving the gorram show to Friday nights... obviously, NO ONE learns...



--Jefé The Hat

***************************
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Thursday, May 27, 2004 6:59 AM

CAPTAINCDC


Quote:

The Used Parts Network doesn't have a whole lot of intelligence, either, because I ALSO read they're moving the gorram show to Friday nights... obviously, NO ONE learns...




Dawn Ostroff of UPN actually tried to defend Enterprise being put on Friday nights by saying that X-Files was on friday nights and it did just fine. I could not believe what I was reading!

As for the finale last night, I liked it. I like that it had a cliffhanger. And even though nazis and aliens together is OUT there, I am interested to see what they do with this arc. Also, I like the cast. I don't think they should get rid of anyone. And, I don't think that next year is for sure the last year for the series. It has an up hill climb and putting it on friday nights makes it even harder, but if the ratings are there they will bring it back. What else does UPN have anyway? Nothing!


May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.

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Thursday, May 27, 2004 8:59 AM

GUNRUNNER


Is it just me or was that Nazi Alien (let me be the 1st to coin the phrase “Nazien”) a Reaman from the last Star Trek movie? Cuz if it is that means the Romulan Star Empire will be in Season 4 and I just love the Romulans.

Speaking of Romulans I always thought the guy who was giving orders to the Sulaban looked Romulan…

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Thursday, May 27, 2004 10:23 AM

CAPTAINCDC


Quote:

Originally posted by GunRunner:
Is it just me or was that Nazi Alien (let me be the 1st to coin the phrase “Nazien”) a Reaman from the last Star Trek movie? Cuz if it is that means the Romulan Star Empire will be in Season 4 and I just love the Romulans.

Speaking of Romulans I always thought the guy who was giving orders to the Sulaban looked Romulan.




Interesting. I'm not sure if it is accurate, but it is an interesting possibility.

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.

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Thursday, May 27, 2004 10:58 AM

MO1962


I was thinking the same thing. Given that it was established in the last Trek movie that the Reamans were enslaved by the Romulans, perhaps the Reamans were enlisted in the Temperal Cold War. If memory serves, the Federation was created following the war between Earth and the Romulans, which would be 7 years into Archer's future. One sure fire way to prevent that would be to pollute the time line to the point where warp drive was never invented or change human society to the point where when warp is finally created, the people of Earth wouldn't be interested in seeking out and exploring new worlds...blah, blah, blah.

Then again, we may have just witnessed the creation of the Mirror Mirror universe...

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Thursday, May 27, 2004 11:14 AM

GUNRUNNER


Well in the Earth Romulan War (2156 to 2160) the Romulans got their butts kicked so I think sometime in the future they alter the past to cause Earth not to go in to space, so they will not be forced in to isolation behind the Neutral Zone.

Now I think that Reaman Nazian was sent by the Romulans Star Empire (Since Romulans never show themselves, maybe because they didn't want the Vulcans to know about them) to aid the Nazis in WWII causing it to be prolonged to the 2100's, unless NX-01 went back in time.

Now it was strange that there was no Starfleet ships (Columbia NX-02 or the ships from the last season finale that fought the Bird Of Prey), but there was a space station in orbit. So when was the timeline altered?

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Thursday, May 27, 2004 11:25 AM

HOBBES


I believe we are all overlooking the most important fact...

SPACE NAZIS!!!!

Yeah. Hmmm. Just needed to get that out of my system.

San Fran is probably still owned by the good guys as I'm pretty sure that those planes firing on the shuttle were P-51 Mustangs an American late-war high performance british engined bomber escort fighter (whew) and that the German's probably would not have been using them.
I'd need pictures to be sure of course.

Quote:

there were no Earth or Vulcan ships to help fight the Xindiball (like a Hamsterball, but for Xindi). I figured that, if the NX-02 had been completed ahead of schedule, it might've led a flotilla to try to support Archer, but what about the smaller in-system ships?



Yeah, where were all those Vulcan capital ships, not to mention the NX-02 plus whatever ships make up Starfleet because they can't just have one ship.

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Thursday, May 27, 2004 2:02 PM

GUNRUNNER


Atleast 3 other Star Trek episodes have had Nazis in them (one TOS and two VOY).

I was thinking the same thing about San Fran Hobbes, since there is no evedince of where Archer is except that he is in a Nazi field hospital tent, he may not even be in the same time zone as the Shuttle Pod.

Yes those were P-51s firing at the Shuttle Pod.

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Friday, May 28, 2004 4:26 PM

SEAFORT


I'm keep trying but this show doesn't work for me. Entertaining at times, and some of the characters seem to be getting more interesting, but I watch it and I just don't care. It just seems to lack passion to me.

And I like cliffhangers but this one just felt dumbass. And maybe they'll bring it around and make something interesting out of this but honestly my hopes aren't very high.

Oh well, just my opinion.



"The cosmic baker took us out of the oven a little too early, and that's the reason we're as crazy as we are..."

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Friday, May 28, 2004 8:55 PM

WHEDONESQUE


Quote:

Originally posted by HUMBLE:
... Looks like the writers ate some old stories, threw them up and then made an episode out of the mess!

Wow, what a visual.

BTW, you forgot the emotimabobthingie (fI stole that term from... I think it was Zoid).


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Friday, May 28, 2004 9:42 PM

PALINDROME


"Nazis. I really hate those guys."

given: America/The Allies still have San Francisco.

given: Archer has mysteriously arrived in Nazi/Axis territory by a means unknown.

In theory, if the Deathstar (sorry, I mean "Xindi weapon") caused a pesky 'temporal rift,' why was he sent to Earth [why not open space?] and why did he land on... land? 3/4ths of the planet is water, yeah? He's got a 75% chance of landing in the drink.

Time travel and Nazis. Dang. Could it be more contrived? 5000 years of recorded history and they have to pick WW2.

To boldly go where someone else has already boldly gone. But more so.

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Saturday, May 29, 2004 1:57 AM

GWYNETHH


The episode smells of corporate committee writing for at least the last 10 minutes.
I had hopes for an honest finale, but Paramount Inc. never fails to let us down.
How can all these networks be so full of the clueless?

Let Trek Die a Clean Death

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Saturday, May 29, 2004 2:24 AM

BOOMERGOODHEART


I like this series, and I liked the cliffhanger. I've liked this show from the beginning. It's interesting to see how humans started into space (at least in the Trek world).


Hmmmm...then again, maybe I just like ogling Trip without his shirt on. Vulcan nuero-pressure anyone?

BoomerGoodheart
"I love my Captain."

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Saturday, May 29, 2004 5:06 AM

GINOBIFFARONI


I like the idea behind the series, I forgave some of the weaker plot in season one due to you gotta have time to do some character / plot developement.

But with the exception of maybe half of this last season, the writing has been lackluster.

I like some story arcs which go 3-5 eps

I like darker plot lines

I like having characters who you don't know what they might do next.

If they could do these things with DS9, why not E ?

" Thats not fair !!!!
I didn't even have a soul when I did that!"

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Saturday, May 29, 2004 5:45 AM

GUNRUNNER


Quote:

Originally posted by palindrome:
In theory, if the Deathstar (sorry, I mean "Xindi weapon") caused a pesky 'temporal rift,' why was he sent to Earth [why not open space?] and why did he land on... land? 3/4ths of the planet is water, yeah? He's got a 75% chance of landing in the drink.



I think Daniels or his 31st century friends might have a hand in that, since if he wound up in the hands of the Nazis he might have a chance to figure out why that Nazien is there.

Oh yea and Temporal Rifts can send an object anywhere. Remember the Enterprise-C was sent across light year in addition to across time.

WWII makes sense since anyone trying to alter the future of space travel would start with WWII since the 1st large-scale rockets were used and the 1st Nuclear weapons were built. Since rockets launched the 1st Earth built Warp-Ship in to space and nuclear reactors run Impulse Engines it makes sense WWII two works.

But I think I know exactly why the Timeline was so altered, it was Doctor McCoy going though The Guardian of Forever! They are now in that Timeline where the US entry in to WWII was delayed by that Social Worker.

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Saturday, May 29, 2004 7:50 AM

DRAGONWINE


This show was doomed from its initial concept. To stupidly go back to before the beginning and screw up every bit of canon established by all other Trek series. We know the Federation happens, and to go back and tell the tale of how it almost didn't could have been told in one episode of any other Trek series. From the design of the ship to the first ten minutes of the very first episode (It was that bad, couldn't stand any more drek) this show was a mistake. And people got paid for this disaster, on purpose. Cancel this show or the dog gets it!

Besides, Firefly did in less than one season what these others could not do in seven!

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Sunday, May 30, 2004 5:35 AM

GHOULMAN


HAHAHAHahahaha ... let me get this straight.

Fanboy: Oh Mr. Braga? Will you give me a great ending to your year long Xindi arc story? Like those Joss Whedon shows I love...

Braga: (in Marvel comic badguy voice) NO Fanboy scum! You will be sodomized by me... with a cliffhanger ending! Now bend over.

Give me a big fat frellin' kiss on the trekkie lips. Can't believe that after a year long arc that ENT had a cliffhanger ending... with Nazis! HAHAHA! Give me strength. Go and ask your english teacher why this isn't how you write a story, especially a whole arc! Fucking amazing.

Worst ending ever.

It's a complete fucking of the show .. yet again. How can they completely sabotage the story? I know, let's just blow away any drama or excitement we developed over the last year, oh and we failed to do that btw, and betray the audience who stuck with us. Wha?

I mean, you know ENT is laughing at you people right? You know that Braga and Berman do this because of thier utter contempt for the Trek audience right? They took the show and didn't even bother to read the scripts all the way through. Who is the story editor on this show? Oh yea, there isn't one. Just Braga.

Now, since Braga and Berman have been shit on by all the Trekkies out there do you wanna bet this horrifically terrible ending was a 'fuck you'?

It was.

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Sunday, May 30, 2004 6:15 AM

CYBERSNARK


The alien in Germany isn't a Reman. Remans have greenish-tinged translucent skin and yellow eyes; this guy had grey, pasty skin and red eyes. Also; cheek spikes. Odds are he's some new race (like the Suliban or Xindi).

That Romulans are involved in the Temporal War isn't too far-fetched; wide-spread speculation says that Silik's shadowy advisor is a Romulan.

And Hoshi's linguistic skills were explained (somewhat unclearly, I'll admit) in the first few episodes: she's a savant. Y'know, like those child prodigies that can play Beethoven on their fifth birthday. It's a documented phenomenon; some people's brains just "take" to different things (music, mathematics [see: Tam, River], visual arts, dance, and, in Hoshi's case, languages). The "downside" is that a savant is usually grossly deficient in some other aspect. The concert musician is autistic, the dancer can't walk straight, the mathematician is a stutterer. Hoshi is kinda a coward --almost to the point of phobia. I'll admit to wishing that character quirk had been played up beyond a little screaming in an early ep and a pep-talk from T'Pol, but them's the breaks.

Quote:

Originally posted by dragonwine:
This show was doomed from its initial concept. To stupidly go back to before the beginning and screw up every bit of canon established by all other Trek series.

Um, how?

Vulcans were Earth's first contact. Check (as seen in First Contact).
Zefram Cochrane lived long enough to become a citizen of Alpha Centauri before he "died" (as per TOS' comment that Cochrane was "from Alpha Centauri"). Check.
Andorians were a martial race, who were significant enough to play a part in the founding of the Federation. Check.

If anything, Enterprise is adding to the established canon, demonstrating just why getting the Vulcans and Andorians to work together is such a Big Deal.

As I stated elsewhere, the "Ferengi Kerfuffle" is a non-issue; Archer & crew never learned the identities of the raiders. Until Picard's Enterprise actually meets them face-to-face, they will remain "unknown big-eared aliens."

Quote:

We know the Federation happens, and to go back and tell the tale of how it almost didn't could have been told in one episode of any other Trek series.
It's not about the Federation, it's about humanity, and how we evolve from the real, flawed people on Archer's crew into the enlightened paragons of Roddenberry's vision.

It's about dealing with bigotry and racism (humans dislike Vulcans, Vulcans distrust humans and Andorians, Andorians hate Vulcans, Xindi hate humans, humans hate Xindi, etc), and how they must be overcome in order to improve ourselves. The question isn't "can we blow up the bad guys?" it's "should we risk blowing up our future allies?"

More than that, Enterprise is about normal people, who happen to be thrown into situations beyond anything they were expecting or prepared for. They are tested, and become greater heroes for it.

Quote:

From the design of the ship to the first ten minutes of the very first episode (It was that bad, couldn't stand any more drek)
Ah, well then, if the first ten minutes of the first show didn't make you go "OH MY F*&KING GAWD, THIS IS THE BESTEST SHOW EVAR!!!111!!one!!1" then it must suck. My mistake.

Quote:

this show was a mistake. And people got paid for this disaster, on purpose. Cancel this show or the dog gets it!
Yes, and end the entire franchise (no TV series, no movie, the books, great as they are, can't keep the entire property afloat). Free up one more hour for Sureality TV.

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Sunday, May 30, 2004 6:40 AM

BOOMERGOODHEART


Well said, CyberSnark!

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Monday, May 31, 2004 2:24 PM

DRAGONWINE


If you bought into Enterprise then I have some property, and a watch, and a bridge to sell. If I want a good story, or good acting..you know something other than cardboard....I won't turn on Ent, and as for "Sureality" tv, well I just turn the tv off.

In any case, bottom line, Enterprise did indeed suck from scene one to cliffhanger. The team of BnB just serve up the trash weekly and still get paid. Sad little people on a sad little hill.

Thank you, and goodnight!

PS...could have sworn this was the firefly forum, not the drek zone.

It's a nothing part til you don't got one, then you have to go to ebay.....aaaaagh!

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Monday, May 31, 2004 3:12 PM

SKIP


This about sums up my views on the Enterprise finale...

http://www.reallifecomics.com/daily.php?strip_id=1205

Hehe...I love real life comics (even has some great Firefly related comics a few months back)

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Monday, May 31, 2004 4:04 PM

PEACE


I have never liked ENT, thought it was underwritten, didn't watch the cliffhanger, and I'm rather glad I didn't. The franchise needs a change or a chance to lie fallow.

IMO, here's how you save the franchise here and now-- return to the period immediately after the Dominion War-- Starfleet is stretched so thin (the war was costly and resources are strained) that they have to recommission moth-balled ships to serve as patrol vessels. You take one of these, a cranky POS liable to break down at a moment's notice despite upgrades, and put a crew of misfits and minimally functional crewfolk onboard (personnel is stretched thin, too) and send them out to the frontiers of the Federation to deal with dangers and threats that really call for bigger and better ships, but, hey, they're the only ones out there, handling missions that are gut-wrenching and sometimes on the thin line of shady....

Hey, this is starting to sound familiar....

Oh, bugger! Now I have to wait for someone to wake up!

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Monday, May 31, 2004 5:28 PM

CLEANER


Peace, Enterprise was written so you didn't have to be a trek nerd and know everything that came b4.

As someone that never got fully into Startrek (to damn PC)I've really enjoyed it. If trekies feel like they've seen it all b4 then too bad, it wasn't written to target just trekies.

As for character development I hope they keep it at the current low level. Everytime they've tried for lots of character development in ST it turned into a soap opera in space (ie STNG, DS9, Voyager) at which point I've stopped watching.

This forum was made to support a show that was cancelled. To trash any show here makes this place and the people in it look like a real joke. Take the complaints to your trek nerd forums pls.

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