GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Jayne and Kaylee

POSTED BY: LEIASKY
UPDATED: Sunday, April 23, 2006 08:15
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 24282
PAGE 2 of 2

Friday, April 7, 2006 7:53 AM

JYNNANTONNYX


Quote:

Originally posted by Leiasky:
>You're really gonna make me find that interview aren't you? *sigh* It's gonna take a while coz I have no idea when or where I saw it.

What interview?

There is a Q&A with Joss on the Australian DVD of Serenity where someone actually comes out and pointedly asks him if S/K would stay together.

I've only seen it once, but I believe Joss' response was 'I think they have a good chance', after hemming and hawing a bit over the answer. Anyone else see it?

While I know people like to compare the love triangle stuff with his previous shows, Firefly is nothing like Buffy/Angel, and I just don't believe he'd take the relationships with these characters to the extents he took those.



"A government is a body of people usually notably ungoverned."



Jana asked about an interview I mentioned before where Adam Baldwin talks about Jayne. I can't for the life of me remember where I saw it but I'm still scouring The main thing that stuck out at me that was unique to that interview was that Adam's take on Jayne was that he was from a middle class family (not working class might most people assume) and that Inara is the type of girl for him - of course this is the actor and not Joss.

And being from Australia I've seen the interview Well kinda. I was stupid enough to lend the DVD to my friend after I'd only seen it once, and was only half way through the extras I actually found that QA thing hard to watch - I had no idea our accents were so strong *grin* but they were Queenslanders and they tend to be more ocker

--
"It's just an object. It doesn't mean what you think."

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 7, 2006 7:54 AM

AZTECHROME


The Kaylee/Jayne relationship remains undeveloped.

We all know the score with with Simon. "..sex?"

Yeah. I wish Jewel would would want to have sex with some foppish practitioner like Simon. .....
But Kaylee's lusty enough to have multiple interests, even if she cares about Simon. We've seen that in more than a few episodes.

Now, Jayne not only represents the more masculine and physically strong, but also has that bad-guy allure. If anyone was going to split off his own way and become a bad-boy later in Joss's storyline, it would have been Jayne.

Unfortunately, this was a character driven drama.

There was much more to make of the Jayne/Kaylee relationship; I just don't think we got to see very much of it.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 7, 2006 8:04 AM

LEIASKY


>There was much more to make of the Jayne/Kaylee relationship; I just don't think we got to see very much of it.

I just don't think it was there to begin with.

Though, I will admit that we didn't get to see the series and the characters develop since the show only ran for 14 episodes.

Just as the Jayne fans think Joss would have developed his character more into pushing him toward Kaylee, I think he would have also done the same thing to Simon's.

Unless Joss did it in a REAL believable way, a relationship between Kaylee and Jayne would completely turn me off on the show.

>Now, Jayne not only represents the more masculine and physically strong, but also has that bad-guy allure.

Yes. Very true. I think that is what turns me off on SO many J/K fics because they all take the characters so out of character that I just don't believe it could happen.

Make Simon an ass simply so that J/K can be together. No. Not his character. Make Jayne a softie at heart so that he appeals to Kaylee's warm side? I just don't believe it. He's rough and he's mean.

Oddly, if there was any better match, it'd be River. She may look soft and delicate but she's as rough and as hard-edged as he is.

I agree that its a character driven drama, that's why I was so sucked into it! laugh


"A government is a body of people usually notably ungoverned."

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 7, 2006 8:28 AM

AZTECHROME


I think we see thing from converse vantages.

I always thought Simon had it a little too easy on Kaylee, even though the series was developing that way.

I don't know that Jayne and Kaylee would have happened. I know that Inara was tied up with Mal, and that Zoe was tied up with Wash. Which, as you say, leaves River as sort of the free radical.

Of course I think Joss was planning this all out.

Still, I think I flirtation with Kaylee and Jayne was possible, for a little while; even if only to catalyze Simon into action.

It is indeed a character-driven drama. And what wonderful characters. No matter what your precognitions, you have to agree that the interplay of the crew could have left any number of windows open.

If only we'd seen their vistas.


NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 7, 2006 8:40 AM

SILLYLITTLEDUCK


You don't think Joss would do the samething to these characters as he do to all of his others? You're joking right, Joss is always saying he thinks happy couples are boring. I think if Firefly and run seven season like Buffy it would have involved just as many messed up relationships, probably more since Buffy had three main character's to mess around with and Firefly has nine. (okay four if you count Giles) I do think it's not 100% fair to compare Kaylee/Simon/Jayne to Fred/Gunn/Weasley. I truthfully think it would have been more of a Ross and Rachel from friends thing. On and off so much it becomes annoying but in the end they loved eachother the whole time.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 7, 2006 8:49 AM

AZTECHROME


Quote:

Originally posted by sillylittleduck:
You don't think Joss would do the samething to these characters as he do to all of his others? You're joking right, Joss is always saying he thinks happy couples are boring.
On and off so much it becomes annoying but in the end they loved each other the whole time.



Don't get me wrong. I basically agree. I just think that the Jayne/Kaylee exploit could have been briefly dramatic, while inciting some other characters (Simon, Malcolm); to finally get off their asses and pursue those girls.

Everytime Jayne gets near one of the girls, one of the other guys gets really jealous. I think they could have played off of that well....

We just didn't get to see enough. Joss had some shocks in store for us, i bet you.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 7, 2006 8:54 AM

SILLYLITTLEDUCK


I completely agree with you! We just didn't see enough of what Joss had going on in his twisted little mind. If given the chance he probably would have been throwing us for loops every chance he got
I Mean hello the move. HE KILLED OFF WASH AND BOOK. I was sad when I saw that movie the first time, never having seen firefly I wasn't too attached but once I rewatched to movie after watching the series, despite that I knew how it ended I still got so upset when Wash and Book were killed.


NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 7, 2006 9:08 AM

AZTECHROME


Quote:

Originally posted by sillylittleduck:
HE KILLED OFF WASH AND BOOK. I was sad when I saw that movie the first time, never having seen firefly I wasn't too attached but once I rewatched to movie after watching the series, despite that I knew how it ended I still got so upset when Wash and Book were killed.




Don't we all wish it could be otherwise....

Poor Joss. He got one more chance to blow on the embers. Some people made the 2hr stretch, and some didn't. Some of my favorites didn't.

(I know there's alot of Wash lovers out there. But I think Ron Glass had more immediate potential to propel the diegesis.)

I'll be happy to argue about it endlessly

What can I say; It's hard to see something so sympatico dissolve over corporate pressures. But I've said that to every newbie.

Ok. I'm done ranting.

Sorry 'bout that.


NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 7, 2006 9:29 AM

SILLYLITTLEDUCK


Oh I agree with Joss that it propelled the story along, making everything mean more and more intense since you're thinking they all really could die. But do you think speilberg could to that? No, way to many director are unwilling to end the movie unhappily. I love that Joss is willing to do it, but I still moarned the loss of Wash and Book (Oh, I love Alan Tudyk he is just amamzing.)

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 7, 2006 9:52 AM

FERT1


I don't think it can be argued that Jayne ONLY saw Kaylee as a little sister, since Joss, the series creator, says that Jayne has a crush on Kaylee. Joss of all people ought to know! There is also plenty of evidence on the show, as others have mentioned.

I will also point out that Jayne is much more hostile toward Simon than River, even though River is the much greater liability. The ship actually NEEDS a Dr. Crazy girl? Not so much. He gets especially hostile toward Simon when Kaylee has been flirting with Simon. Just the way he watches the two, it is definitely jealousy.

Now that being said, it doesn't mean that it is or ever will be mutual. I think Kaylee has a certain fondness for Jayne as she does everyone on the ship. It's just who she is. At the same time, I think she sees him as mean and crude, and not the least bit appealing as a love interest.

No one but Joss can say for sure, but I suspect that is how it would have continued. Just look at how Willow pined for Xander for years, nothing ever really came out of it, except for a brief flirtation. I think Kaylee goes for the more sensitive type - something Jayne definitely isn't. Joss just adores the unrequited love.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 7, 2006 10:00 AM

REENIE



I screwd this up and didn't hit "reply with quote"...so as someone else so eloquently put it

"But Kaylee's lusty enough to have multiple interests, even if she cares about Simon. We've seen that in more than a few episodes.

Now, Jayne not only represents the more masculine and physically strong, but also has that bad-guy allure. If anyone was going to split off his own way and become a bad-boy later in Joss's storyline, it would have been Jayne. "

I couldn't agree more. In end, I think Simon wouldn't be enough for Kaylee.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 7, 2006 10:04 AM

AZTECHROME


Quote:

Originally posted by Fert1:
I don't think it can be argued that Jayne ONLY saw Kaylee as a little sister, since Joss, the series creator, says that Jayne has a crush on Kaylee.



Sure, but who doesn't have a slightly more than platonic crush on Kaylee. I think even Mal, with all his preoccupations, would be hard pressed to label Jewel as a mere prettifying accessory. (In fact, we know for mostly sure that Mal hired Kaylee because of her exprtise in the field... and her spirit; which is happy-go-lucky.

Quote:

I think Kaylee has a certain fondness for Jayne as she does everyone on the ship. It's just who she is. No one but Joss can say for sure, but I suspect Joss just adores the unrequited love.


No arguments here; but don't you think those two could shape up to be a really *interesting* pair of unrequited love. Just for a little while. Jane and Kaylee in a romance is like a clubfoot dancing with a ballerina. Amusing, at least. Worth the writing for sure.

-the end.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Tuesday, April 11, 2006 2:26 AM

KAYLEESTHEGREATEST


I found somthing else to me thinking they have no hints of getting hooked.
As soon as I said those words I wished i could take them back. Jayne isnt the one i should be pooring my soul out to.All hell do is tease

Someday the verse will spit in your soup but at least they gave you soup.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Tuesday, April 11, 2006 3:51 AM

SAB39


Jayne doesn't deserve Kaylee.

[spoilers for Dead or Alive follow]

Hell, he couldn't even bear to part with his gorram stupid turtle for her when she needed some cheerin' up.

And it's Kaylee so you know the turtle really would have cheered her up. Especially combined with the gesture, coming from Jayne who clearly loved it.

It's funny really. I've never bought into Jayne and Kaylee, but if he'd given her that stupid turtle, I think I'd have been forced to reconsider... As it turns out, he just proved my point.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Tuesday, April 11, 2006 7:18 AM

SQUISH


Quote:


I just don't think it was there to begin with.



Well, I think it is clearly there on Jayne's part. Whether it was there on Kaylee's part could potentially be argued. We may never know what would have happened (which is where the fun of fanfic lies). And besides it was television. People never stay together in television! Viewers don't actually like it, no matter what they might say.

Quote:


I think that is what turns me off on SO many J/K fics because they all take the characters so out of character that I just don't believe it could happen.



This is interesting because I've always thought that many of the J/K fics were the best out there as far as characterization. Now I will agree that not all of them are. And to me one mark of a good J/K fic (or any non-canon relationship fic) is how they get rid of the other person (in this case Simon). As much as I like J/K, I don't like to see Simon portrayed as out of character just to get him out of the way. However, it can also be said that more than a few S/K fics have weak characterizations, making Simon and Kaylee both so sweet it's a bit much to take. Also making Simon practically abandon River just for Kaylee (which we all know isn't going to happen, it's just not in him). I think Simon is a bit darker than many people portray him in fics and Joss might eventually have gotten around to that. For example, what would Simon do if it was a question of choosing between River and Kaylee (in a life-saving type of situation)?


Just a few thoughts, didn't mean to rattle on so much.

-squish

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 21, 2006 5:50 AM

JYNNANTONNYX


Jana, I still can't find the gorram interview but I did find a video clip It looks like it was taken at a convention, and it's pretty short.



Hope that works.

--
"It's just an object. It doesn't mean what you think."

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 21, 2006 6:07 AM

SANDS


I like Jayne don’t get me wrong. But I really like Kaylee and I don’t think Jayne’s good enough for her. He’s a liar, a dog, and a traitor. Every time I see a post about this I always think “Hey! What’s wrong with Simon? He’s a nice guy.” I like how Simon is a blundering idiot in social situations and I like how Kaylee is nonstop sweet. It’s a match made in heaven its also one of the best parts of the story so like, STOP TAKING IT AWAY FROM ME!

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 21, 2006 3:19 PM

SQUISH


Quote:

Originally posted by JynnanTonnyx:
Jana, I still can't find the gorram interview but I did find a video clip It looks like it was taken at a convention, and it's pretty short.



Hope that works.

--
"It's just an object. It doesn't mean what you think."



OMG! Thank you for that! He is just too cute for words!

-squish

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 21, 2006 4:29 PM

JYNNANTONNYX


Quote:

Originally posted by squish:
Quote:

Originally posted by JynnanTonnyx:
Jana, I still can't find the gorram interview but I did find a video clip It looks like it was taken at a convention, and it's pretty short.



Hope that works.

--
"It's just an object. It doesn't mean what you think."



OMG! Thank you for that! He is just too cute for words!

-squish



Ain't he Try searching for "Adam Baldwin" in you tube - there is only a few hits but they're pretty good.

--
"It's just an object. It doesn't mean what you think."

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 21, 2006 6:07 PM

CANTONHEROINE


I'm aware of this interview:-
http://www.chud.com/index.php?type=interviews&id=4546
where he refers to Jayne being from a middle-class background. I think the other you're thinking of is the one from StarLog magazine. I don't have a link for that one, but I do have scans of the interview.

Quote:

"I would bring things down to, 'What drives this guy sexually?' That's interesting to watch, and I tried to play that Inara (Morena Baccarin's beautiful high-class prostitute) is the ideal woman for Jayne. I said to Joss, 'Jayne has a crush on Inara.' Joss replied, 'No, you don't!' I said, 'Well I'm going to play it that way.' I don't know how much it actually comes across in the movie, but that's what I tried to do. Anytime Inara was in the same room as me, I tried to convey that attraction."
In the early days of Firefly Jayne was supposed to have a romantic interest in Kaylee (Jewel Staite), the ship's mechanic. "I was aware of that, but I always thought of Kaylee and Jayne as having more of a sister-brother relationship," says Baldwin. "She's like Jayne's needling little sister. Inara, on the other hand, oozes sex. I thought a dynamic between Inara and Jayne would be an interesting undercurrent, and if I was to play it in scenes with Mal, it would be somewhat more dangerous and raise the stakes. But this is all 'actory' stuff, subtexturally, that I wanted to lay in. It's really a backstory in my mind, though not necessarily in Joss' or Morena's."



See? Even Adam was aware of Jayne's interest in Kaylee on the original show. It was obviously something that Joss particularly wanted, and had discussed as being part of that character's motivations.

--*--*--*--*--

Check out my artwork:
http://s43.photobucket.com/albums/e365/CantonHeroine/Sketches
REN: "We're not hitchhiking anymore! We're RIDING!!"
Ren & Stimpy (Space Madness)

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 21, 2006 6:44 PM

JYNNANTONNYX


Quote:

Originally posted by CantonHeroine:
I'm aware of this interview:-
http://www.chud.com/index.php?type=interviews&id=4546
where he refers to Jayne being from a middle-class background. I think the other you're thinking of is the one from StarLog magazine. I don't have a link for that one, but I do have scans of the interview.

Quote:

"I would bring things down to, 'What drives this guy sexually?' That's interesting to watch, and I tried to play that Inara (Morena Baccarin's beautiful high-class prostitute) is the ideal woman for Jayne. I said to Joss, 'Jayne has a crush on Inara.' Joss replied, 'No, you don't!' I said, 'Well I'm going to play it that way.' I don't know how much it actually comes across in the movie, but that's what I tried to do. Anytime Inara was in the same room as me, I tried to convey that attraction."
In the early days of Firefly Jayne was supposed to have a romantic interest in Kaylee (Jewel Staite), the ship's mechanic. "I was aware of that, but I always thought of Kaylee and Jayne as having more of a sister-brother relationship," says Baldwin. "She's like Jayne's needling little sister. Inara, on the other hand, oozes sex. I thought a dynamic between Inara and Jayne would be an interesting undercurrent, and if I was to play it in scenes with Mal, it would be somewhat more dangerous and raise the stakes. But this is all 'actory' stuff, subtexturally, that I wanted to lay in. It's really a backstory in my mind, though not necessarily in Joss' or Morena's."



See? Even Adam was aware of Jayne's interest in Kaylee on the original show. It was obviously something that Joss particularly wanted, and had discussed as being part of that character's motivations.

--*--*--*--*--

Check out my artwork:
http://s43.photobucket.com/albums/e365/CantonHeroine/Sketches
REN: "We're not hitchhiking anymore! We're RIDING!!"
Ren & Stimpy (Space Madness)



*hugs* THANK YOU!! The StarLog interview was the one I was referring to. I hadn't read the interview you linked me to, so thanks :)

Love the picture too *lol* I'm not saying that there isn't a Jaylee dynamic within the show but I think that boat has sailed with the Simon/Kaylee development in the movie. I don't think it's going to be an easy relationship and maybe Jayne might get between them, but I think, ultimately, they'll probably get married, or the like.

I just see River/Jayne as a more likely option. But that's just me

--
"It's just an object. It doesn't mean what you think."

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 21, 2006 8:25 PM

CANTONHEROINE


I agree that the movie totally torpedoed the idea of Jaylee, but it was there on Firefly and I keep it in my little shipper heart.

Being a Rayne fan, have you seen the footage from DragonCon 2005 where Adam (and the rest of the cast) react to that idea? He seemed totally squicked and even washed out his mouth before answering the question... "She's TWELVE!!"

Made me laugh.


--*--*--*--*--

Check out my artwork:
http://s43.photobucket.com/albums/e365/CantonHeroine/Sketches
REN: "We're not hitchhiking anymore! We're RIDING!!"
Ren & Stimpy (Space Madness)

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 21, 2006 8:34 PM

JYNNANTONNYX


Quote:

Originally posted by CantonHeroine:
Being a Rayne fan, have you seen the footage from DragonCon 2005 where Adam (and the rest of the cast) react to that idea? He seemed totally squicked and even washed out his mouth before answering the question... "She's TWELVE!!"

Made me laugh.



No, but I've heard about it. You wouldn't have a link to some footage?

Well, Summer is actually older than Jewel - and River maybe young but she's been through a lot ... *lol* the things we do to keep our ship alive, huh

Edited to add: You're Australian! *hugs* My boyfriend lived most of his life in Tasmania but I've never been :)
--
"It's just an object. It doesn't mean what you think."

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, April 21, 2006 9:45 PM

CANTONHEROINE


I haven't got the link handy, but I'll try and track it down for you. If I recall correctly, I got it from one of the other threads on this site and burned it onto disc.

EDIT: I FOUND IT!! WOO HOO!! You can download the video from here:
http://www.jivemagazine.com/article.php?pid=3725

(And yes, I'm Australian *returns hug, cheers* . There are a few of us that get about on this site. I like to think of myself as the Lone Tasmanian Browncoat as I've never come across another one.)
--*--*--*--*--

Check out my artwork:
http://s43.photobucket.com/albums/e365/CantonHeroine/Sketches
REN: "We're not hitchhiking anymore! We're RIDING!!"
Ren & Stimpy (Space Madness)

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Sunday, April 23, 2006 8:15 AM

RAVENHAIR


CantonHeroine - thanks for the link to that video! Is it me or are the BDH just adorable! They come across as being so genuine and funny! Again, what a perfect cast...

Adam Baldwin's reaction to Rayne was funny. I wonder if any of them have read the fanfic?

*****
Mal:We're still flying.
Simon: That's not much.
Mal: It's enough.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

YOUR OPTIONS

NEW POSTS TODAY

USERPOST DATE

FFF.NET SOCIAL