GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

River - movie look vs. TV look

POSTED BY: SERAFIMO
UPDATED: Saturday, November 12, 2005 13:35
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Saturday, November 5, 2005 8:33 AM

SERAFIMO


Does anyone else think it's kind of weird how much River's clothes changed from series to movie?

I mean, in Firefly she dressed kind of like an early 1990s high schooler - and this sort of seemed to fit her personality.

And in the movie she's wearing the dark colored flowy dresses almost exclusively.

I realize it's a costume designer decision, but I just thought it was interesting.


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Saturday, November 5, 2005 8:35 AM

N0SKILLZ


well, the way i saw it. she was a lil not crazy that day. and was going out, so someone (prolly simon) gave it to her for her to wear.

Then the movie never really slow'd down to were anyone would change (and i don't think they did now that i think of it)

-------------------------------
Death is like sex in high school... If you knew how many times you missed having it you'd be paralyzed- Georgia Lass (Dead Like Me)

*Andersen AFB, Guam*

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Saturday, November 5, 2005 8:45 AM

MIRAMEL


i dunno, it seemed to me she favored that type of dress in the series too. or somthing similer. the OiS dress is the same general type i think. they look a bit like colord nightgowns, come to think of it. not complaining mind :)

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Saturday, November 5, 2005 9:02 AM

PHOEBE


Quote:

Originally posted by N0Skillz:
well, the way i saw it. she was a lil not crazy that day. and was going out, so someone (prolly simon) gave it to her for her to wear.

Then the movie never really slow'd down to were anyone would change (and i don't think they did now that i think of it)

-------------------------------
Death is like sex in high school... If you knew how many times you missed having it you'd be paralyzed- Georgia Lass (Dead Like Me)

*Andersen AFB, Guam*



River wears four different dresses in the movie. One in the opening, one in the Maidenhead scenes, one during the final scenes, and one during her very final scene.

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Saturday, November 5, 2005 9:07 AM

N0SKILLZ


well shows how much i payed attention to wat they were wearing, lol

*scampers off to buy the movie and find his downloaded copy so he can watch it again*

-------------------------------
Death is like sex in high school... If you knew how many times you missed having it you'd be paralyzed- Georgia Lass (Dead Like Me)

*Andersen AFB, Guam*

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Saturday, November 5, 2005 9:22 AM

EMBERS


I figured that she arrived on the ship naked,
and Simon, being a man, hadn't planned any clothes for the poor girl...
so most of the clothes she wore early on where the cast-off extras of Kaylee or Inara...
she was eventually able to buy some clothes for herself and she favored nice light weight dresses that allowed her to move like a dancer,
like we see in Objects in Space, and in the BDM

JMPO of course....

**********************************************
watch the R. Tam Session vids: http://www.hittarivertam.nu/
and buy the 'Serenity' comics published by Dark Horse,
and have you joined the Browncoats yet?
http://browncoats.serenitymovie.com/serenity/?fuseaction=tools.invlink
&u=embers&linkID=36

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Saturday, November 5, 2005 3:35 PM

MALICIOUS


Quote:

Originally posted by N0Skillz:
...Then the movie never really slow'd down to were anyone would change (and i don't think they did now that i think of it)



Well, Inara sure had lots of pretty changes of clothes to wear, considering they left her training house so quickly and I don't recall her packing anything or them carrying any suitcases. I'm ASSUMING all those outfits were in the box of things Mal said she left on the shuttle?

Mal-licious

I'm going to add cursing and the hurling about of things to my repertoire.

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Saturday, November 5, 2005 3:54 PM

VISITINGMYINTENTIONS


I thought the movie look was a designed version of her TV look, i.e. her TV look was a ramshackle, put-together-from-other-folks'-clothes look, while her look in the BDM (okay, so I'm only thinking about the bar scene, as I don't remember the other) was "artfully not quite right". Like those goth kids who pay to have their fishnets pre-ripped.

---------------------------------------------------
Early: Where'd she go?

Simon: I can't keep track of her when she's NOT incorporeally possessing a spaceship, don't look at me --

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Saturday, November 5, 2005 5:16 PM

BLINKER


Quote:

Well, Inara sure had lots of pretty changes of clothes to wear, considering they left her training house so quickly and I don't recall her packing anything or them carrying any suitcases. I'm ASSUMING all those outfits were in the box of things Mal said she left on the shuttle?


Feels to me like the box was written in just to explain where Mal's dress came from, so sure... no reason it can't account for all of hers too.

_________
Sliders: Gate Haven - http://slidersweb.net/blinker

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Saturday, November 5, 2005 5:22 PM

EMBERS


Quote:

Originally posted by Malicious:
Well, Inara sure had lots of pretty changes of clothes to wear, considering they left her training house so quickly and I don't recall her packing anything or them carrying any suitcases. I'm ASSUMING all those outfits were in the box of things Mal said she left on the shuttle?


this is one of the things that is fun to read in the Visual Companion...
Joss threw it in as a throw away line...
and then it turned out to explain a bunch of stuff,
plus both Morena and Nathan had a whole 'back story about it'
Joss asked Nathan who said that Mal had opened the box, and had smelled every item she left behind...
so Joss asked Morena and she said Inara on purposely left all the sweetest smelling things behind just to drive him crazy
(they both came to this independent of each other)

pretty funny, huh?


**********************************************
watch the R. Tam Session vids: http://www.hittarivertam.nu/
and buy the 'Serenity' comics published by Dark Horse,
and have you joined the Browncoats yet?
http://browncoats.serenitymovie.com/serenity/?fuseaction=tools.invlink
&u=embers&linkID=36

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Saturday, November 5, 2005 5:23 PM

RITAK7


river was a cute girl in the series but gosh darn in the movie she grew up and has such defined cheekbones she looks like a real beauty someone Yeats would fall for

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Saturday, November 5, 2005 6:08 PM

VANCOUVER


Quote:

Originally posted by N0Skillz:
well, the way i saw it. she was a lil not crazy that day. and was going out, so someone (prolly simon) gave it to her for her to wear.

Then the movie never really slow'd down to were anyone would change (and i don't think they did now that i think of it)

-------------------------------
Death is like sex in high school... If you knew how many times you missed having it you'd be paralyzed- Georgia Lass (Dead Like Me)

*Andersen AFB, Guam*



Plus, remember, Serenity represents the final episode of Season Two, the way Joss wrote it (i.e., writing an entire season's worth of script for the movie, and then having to whittle it down to just a two-hour segment with a major climax at the end), so who knows where they've been and how she's developed. Simon has presumably "destripped" her amygdala, as implausible as that seems neurologically, and the Lethal Weapon part of her Academy/dance training (plie, chop; jete, chop; arabesque, chop...) has clearly continued to come to the fore since her little shut-eye shooting stunt in Season One, and those sorts of things can affect a girl's fashion sense. I thought she looked close to the same, if a tad more glamorous--in a way that could only be expected two or three years in to Summer Glau's ballerina-to-actress transformation.

Vancouver

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Saturday, November 5, 2005 8:37 PM

GIANTEVILHEAD


It's pretty obvious that Simon didn't "destrip" River's amygdala, which isn't really possible, since she still didn't have the ability to suppress emotions.

"I swallowed a bug." -River Tam

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Sunday, November 6, 2005 3:03 AM

DONCOAT


Quote:

Originally posted by Giantevilhead:
It's pretty obvious that Simon didn't "destrip" River's amygdala...since she still didn't have the ability to suppress emotions.

Agreed. The clinching evidence is her cry during the battle scene: "I can't shut them up, they're all made up of rage..."

Which makes the subsequent events even more wonderful. "My turn!" -- the key moment in the movie (for me) -- meant that she'd found the key to shutting them out, and it was (wait for it!) love.

The battle was won at that instant; the subsequent fighting was just a coda. It was a mighty achievement for poor, broken little River.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ain't about you, Jayne. It's about what they need.

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Sunday, November 6, 2005 8:29 AM

LIMINALOSITY


Quote:

Originally posted by DonCoat:
"My turn!" -- the key moment in the movie (for me) -- meant that she'd found the key to shutting them out, and it was (wait for it!) love.



Hey Don!
love, huh? Hee hee, I might tend to agree with that...what a surprise!
Playing the vid for everyone (IMO) released the information so it wasn't her lonely secret anymore, the nightmare popped out of her head like toast out of a toaster (and she barfed, symbolically)...which gave her the clarity to make the decision for self-sacrifice, the ultimate offering. Mmmm, yes, beautifully wrought.

I also agree with Embers that (after arriving naked) she started out wearing castoffs. The crazy quilt outfit of sweater, floaty double layer skirt and clunky boots that she wore in Safe was my favorite.
The Visual Companion is a treasure trove of fabulosity, every child should have one of their very own.

...and I agree with one of Unvisited Intentions that her gear is always "artfully not quite right". I think that's what the costumers were going for with every one of her outfits in both show and movie: River herself is artful, but unbalanced.

Vancouver: Plie, chop; jete, chop.......lol, re-read; lol...



Thanks to viral marketing...SERENITY: reopening soon in a theater near you.
Shiny Trees! Yavanna made Shiny Trees!

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Sunday, November 6, 2005 8:41 AM

CYBERSNARK


(GILES)
And since the picture you've just painted means I shall never eat toast of any kind ever again. . .
(/GILES)

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Sunday, November 6, 2005 8:47 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


I think River's a sexy,zesty lil' number, no matter what she's wearin'.

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Sunday, November 6, 2005 9:51 AM

VANCOUVER


Quote:

Originally posted by Giantevilhead:
It's pretty obvious that Simon didn't "destrip" River's amygdala, which isn't really possible, since she still didn't have the ability to suppress emotions.

"I swallowed a bug." -River Tam



Agreed that she's still pretty buggy, for the rest of Firefly and for Serenity, but Simon seems to think some kind of "destripping" is possible, or how do you explain his "treatment" of her after Ariel? He tells Mal, in so many words, that now that he knows what's wrong with her, he can help her. And he IS a surgeon, so presumably he would know. It's true that he doesn't seem to get the dose right (or whatever he's doing with those subsequent injections), but certainly at the end of Ariel he speaks confidently about his ability to reverse the damage. I personally would have thought, once stripped, always stripped, but...decided to assume that neurology is more advanced in the future.

Vancouver

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Sunday, November 6, 2005 10:10 AM

LIMINALOSITY


Quote:

Originally posted by Cybersnark:
(GILES) toast (/GILES)



But Giles will still have all those lovely cups of tea and memories of near misses,,,and wheatabix...dipped in blood...Ooops....and the candy bar from near the end of season 7 that he stuffed into his mouth whole.


I love the heaviness of River's boots contrasted with the grounded yet fairy-light feel of her carefully placed bare feet.

Thanks to viral marketing...SERENITY: reopening soon in a theater near you.
Shiny Trees! Yavanna made Shiny Trees!

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Sunday, November 6, 2005 10:11 AM

DONCOAT


"Once stripped, always stripped" would make a good title for a porn vid, though...

Since I'm not at all sure what "stripped" means when it comes to neurobiology, I'd say it's safe to say that it could be undone. Or at least, it's hard to argue that it absolutely couldn't be, in the fyooture.

I've been trying to remember whether there's any sartorial transtion for River in the comics. She didn't have a very big role there. Should I go look?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ain't about you, Jayne. It's about what they need.

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Sunday, November 6, 2005 10:18 AM

DONCOAT


Another thing just occurred to me about the movie River. The costumers had a practical challenge to meet.

Her costumes had to allow her the freedom of movement to kick people every which way from Sunday -- forward, backward, roundhouse, and a few ways nobody ever thought of before -- without showing any naughty bits. Or looking like they would have shown some naughty bits if not for some clever costume designer.

Speaking of which, did anybody notice her move in the Maidenhead fight where she swept a bottle off the bar, sailed it through the air, and clonked a guy in the head with it, all in the same smooth move as whacking some other guy? Mighty slick.

There have been many, many forms of martial arts, quite a number of which are blends of earlier forms -- but I don't think I've ever seen a blend that included classical ballet until now.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ain't about you, Jayne. It's about what they need.

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Sunday, November 6, 2005 1:51 PM

GIANTEVILHEAD


Quote:

Originally posted by DonCoat:
Which makes the subsequent events even more wonderful. "My turn!" -- the key moment in the movie (for me) -- meant that she'd found the key to shutting them out, and it was (wait for it!) love.


It's not a matter of shutting out the other emotions since it's just not physically possible, it's more of how an even stronger emotion is able to overcome all the other emotions.

"I swallowed a bug." -River Tam

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Sunday, November 6, 2005 2:49 PM

MER


Personally, I think her attire is basically the same except she's showing more of her form or her outfits are showing more of her personality.
Maybe Kaylee and Zoe took her shopping.

^_^ God I love that bar sequence in Serenity. It still makes me go 'WTF' today.

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Sunday, November 6, 2005 11:20 PM

PSYCHICRIVER


Slightly off-topic, but still...

My sister has taken to dressing like River. She begged mum to buy her some boots that have an un-canny likeness to River's, and on Saturday when I came home from work, she was wearing a a black floaty with complete with the boots.

I was like *frown* wannabe much?

PsychicRiver

"Two by two, hands of blue."
"We'll take care of each other. I'll knit!"
"I swallowed a bug."

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Monday, November 7, 2005 2:22 AM

DONCOAT


Quote:

Originally posted by Giantevilhead:
Quote:

Originally posted by DonCoat:
Which makes the subsequent events even more wonderful. "My turn!" -- the key moment in the movie (for me) -- meant that she'd found the key to shutting them out, and it was (wait for it!) love.


It's not a matter of shutting out the other emotions since it's just not physically possible, it's more of how an even stronger emotion is able to overcome all the other emotions.

Well, at the risk of extending this hijack even further, I'd like to comment on this.

I agree completely that she still can't shut out the feelings -- she still can't not feel.

However, the brain is a remarkably adaptable organ. People who've had major injuries to part of the brain can regain the lost functions by retraining other parts of the brain. Blind people use their visual cortex to process sound. People with chronic pain can learn techniques to reduce or eliminate it by mind control alone.

What I'm suggesting is that there may still be a physical aspect to River's achievement. She may be using other parts of her brain to compensate -- to "dismiss" or "set aside" the overwhelming outside input (catchy phrase there).

Whether or not this is a conscious process is another question. It was just a few minutes earlier that River was a quivering, helpless wreck in the fetal position. Yet when she realized what she had to do to save Simon and the others, she was able to function.

I wonder: was she able to ignore the Reavers' rage, or did she somehow use it, and turn it against them? If so, that mental judo may be her greatest weapon of all.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ain't about you, Jayne. It's about what they need.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 7:32 AM

REKA


Quote:

Originally posted by Phoebe:
River wears four different dresses in the movie. One in the opening, one in the Maidenhead scenes, one during the final scenes, and one during her very final scene.



Five, actually, and six costumes total. The additional ones are the dress she wears only for the funeral scene, and then the blue body-suit thing she's wearing in the Alliance lab facility. The dress as she's flying Serenity at the end might be the same dress she wears under her brown top, etc., at the beginning. The cut and color are the same.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 1:35 PM

GIANTEVILHEAD


Quote:

Originally posted by DonCoat:
Well, at the risk of extending this hijack even further, I'd like to comment on this.

I agree completely that she still can't shut out the feelings -- she still can't not feel.

However, the brain is a remarkably adaptable organ. People who've had major injuries to part of the brain can regain the lost functions by retraining other parts of the brain. Blind people use their visual cortex to process sound. People with chronic pain can learn techniques to reduce or eliminate it by mind control alone.

What I'm suggesting is that there may still be a physical aspect to River's achievement. She may be using other parts of her brain to compensate -- to "dismiss" or "set aside" the overwhelming outside input (catchy phrase there).

Whether or not this is a conscious process is another question. It was just a few minutes earlier that River was a quivering, helpless wreck in the fetal position. Yet when she realized what she had to do to save Simon and the others, she was able to function.

I wonder: was she able to ignore the Reavers' rage, or did she somehow use it, and turn it against them? If so, that mental judo may be her greatest weapon of all.


Certain functions in the brain cannot be compensated for. Adaptation does not occur that fast, it happens over a long period of time, the parts of the brain compensating for the lost part would actually have to physically grow. If you’re blind, it’s not like there’s a switch in the brain that you can turn on and then you become the Dare Devil, it takes time and training. Assuming that the lost portion of River’s brain can be compensated for, she would have to practice trying to suppress her emotions before she can actually do it.

Back on topic, you'd think that Simon would have brought some clothes for River. He has a wardrobe of his own but didn't bring anything for River.

"I swallowed a bug." -River Tam

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