REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Is Trump Nuts?

POSTED BY: THGRRI
UPDATED: Friday, April 15, 2022 07:01
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Wednesday, April 5, 2017 5:05 PM

DREAMTROVE


Quote:

Originally posted by THGRRI:
So far the man has been crushed by the job. Until Bannon actually leaves I won't have faith Trump is learning from his mistakes. And as for his promise of a no fly zone in Syria, another lie. I think the recent gassing of children may force him into taking some sort of action.


I agree on Bannon. Whether Trump has a no fly zone is now dependent on Russia, because regardless of what people think of it politically, they are now are allies, which means American soldiers are fighting along side Russians, and in such a situation, you need your partner's permission. I suppose the Russians will weigh this on how many planes they have vs. ISIS. A no fly zone over ISIS-controled itself is more likely.

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Wednesday, April 5, 2017 6:30 PM

THGRRI


Quote:

Originally posted by DREAMTROVE:
Quote:

Originally posted by THGRRI:
So far the man has been crushed by the job. Until Bannon actually leaves I won't have faith Trump is learning from his mistakes. And as for his promise of a no fly zone in Syria, another lie. I think the recent gassing of children may force him into taking some sort of action.


I agree on Bannon. Whether Trump has a no fly zone is now dependent on Russia, because regardless of what people think of it politically, they are now are allies, which means American soldiers are fighting along side Russians, and in such a situation, you need your partner's permission. I suppose the Russians will weigh this on how many planes they have vs. ISIS. A no fly zone over ISIS-controled itself is more likely.



Bullshit, we are not allies or anything close to it with Russia. Your fearless leader tried spreading that crap before. When his propaganda machine suggested we went on a bombing run together. Our generals immediately dispelled that as false.

The pressure on Trump to distance himself from Putin has been to date, intense. Watch what happens now.






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Wednesday, April 5, 2017 6:34 PM

THGRRI


Quote:

G

So now he's actually found a way to be wrong by not listening to himself. It's like automatic with him. He's like the George Costanza of presidents.










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Wednesday, April 5, 2017 6:35 PM

THGRRI


I can only hope he gets this right.

Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Quote:

Originally posted by THGRRI:

I think the recent gassing of children may force him into taking some sort of action.

No reason to believe Trump will think of something sensible that will last long term. I believe he will do whatever feels best for Trump at this moment, not permanently solve a longstanding international problem. On 23 April 2016, the United Nations and Arab League Envoy to Syria put out an estimate of 400,000 that had died in the war. The death toll from yesterday's suspected chemical attack currently stands at 72, according to the Syrian Observatory for Human Rights and is expected to rise.

This has happened before in Syria. I don't think Trump ever gave chemical weapons in Syria any thought before today, since he is more an improviser than a historian:

Haunting images of lifeless children piled in heaps reflected the magnitude of the attack, which was reminiscent of a 2013 chemical assault that left hundreds dead and was the worst in the country’s six-year conflict.

www.thesun.co.uk/news/3265208/syria-sarin-gas-massacre-dad-holds-dead-
twins
/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly








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Wednesday, April 5, 2017 7:38 PM

SOCKPUPPET


Trump surrounds himself with people who disagree with him. It's one leadership style, and it's the one he's chosen. So, that, and his family and team, will be the decision making process.

My thought would be to accept the Russian self blame, whether it's true or not, and use it to tell them they can't attack targets by air. Then send an elite team of marines behind enemy lines into ISIS territory, to seize the chemical weapons and transport them back to a place where they can safely be destroyed.

That might've sounded a little JSF of me, but it would be the minimum civilian casualty solution, and require some big damn heroes.

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Thursday, April 6, 2017 8:12 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Quote:

Originally posted by THGRRI:
I can only hope he gets this right.

Getting to "right" is not in Trump's bag of mental tricks. Trump is a short-term tactical thinker, not a long-term policy maker bringing peace to the Middle East. Remember that just days ago, Trump announced that the U.S. no longer had any problem with the regime of Syrian president, and Russian ally, Bashar Assad then Assad dropped sarin bombs.

Trump’s latest New York Times interview is a perfect example of his phony war with the press. It is typical of Trump's mind's inner workings.
www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/4/5/15194056/trump-war-media

If you read the article, you will see in precise detail how both Trump and NYTimes are having a pro wrestling–style show feud for their mutual benefit. The MSM has used the pretense of conflict with the Trump administration as a marketing gimmick. Read our newspapers, watch our shows, make us richer while you see and hear more Trump. But why has Trump been very willing to give big newspaper and television networks the exclusive interviews they crave? What does he get in exchange for his trouble?

What matters to Trump isn’t any actual crushing of the media, but simply driving the narrative in his core followers’ heads that the media is at war with him. With that pretense in place, critical coverage and unflattering facts can be dismissed even as Trump selectively courts the press to inject his own preferred ideas into the mainstream.

Trump’s tactic is not that nutty. It looks like this: “I think it’s going to be the biggest story,” Mr. Trump said in an interview in the Oval Office, declining repeated requests for evidence for his allegations or the names of other Obama administration officials. “It’s such an important story for our country and the world. It is one of the big stories of our time.” He declined to say if he had personally reviewed new intelligence to bolster his claim but pledged to explain himself “at the right time.” The right time never comes.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, April 6, 2017 8:26 AM

DREAMTROVE


So far the list of presidents in the last century who have tried to buck the Military Industrial complex consists of Eisenhower, Trump. (possibly Ford, except he installed a lot of them into power.) I'm not sure where the haters are coming from, unless 1kiki is right.

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Thursday, April 6, 2017 9:02 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


This will have to go under "Is Trump Nuts?" because it shows how functionally sane Trump's election tactics were.
https://theintercept.com/2017/04/06/top-democrats-are-wrong-trump-supp
orters-were-more-motivated-by-racism-than-economic-issues
/

. . . on the very same day that Bernie Sanders offered his evidence-free defense of Trump voters in Boston, the latest data from the American National Election Studies (ANES) was released.

Philip Klinkner, a political scientist at Hamilton College and an expert on race relations, has pored over this ANES data and tells me that “whether it’s good politics to say so or not, the evidence from the 2016 election is very clear that attitudes about blacks, immigrants, and Muslims were a key component of Trump’s appeal.” For example, he says, “in 2016 Trump did worse than Mitt Romney among voters with low and moderate levels of racial resentment, but much better among those with high levels of resentment.”

The new ANES data only confirms what a plethora of studies have told us since the start of the presidential campaign: the race was about race. Klinkner himself grabbed headlines last summer when he revealed that the best way to identify a Trump supporter in the U.S. was to ask “just one simple question: is Barack Obama a Muslim?” Because, he said, “if they are white and the answer is yes, 89 percent of the time that person will have a higher opinion of Trump than Clinton.” This is economic anxiety? Really?

Other surveys and polls of Trump voters found “a strong relationship between anti-black attitudes and support for Trump”; Trump supporters being “more likely to describe African Americans as ‘criminal,’ ‘unintelligent,’ ‘lazy’ and ‘violent’”; more likely to believe “people of color are taking white jobs”; and a “majority” of them rating blacks “as less evolved than whites.” Sorry, but how can any of these prejudices be blamed on free trade or low wages?

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, April 6, 2017 9:10 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Quote:

Originally posted by DREAMTROVE:
So far the list of presidents in the last century who have tried to buck the Military Industrial complex consists of Eisenhower, Trump. (possibly Ford, except he installed a lot of them into power.) I'm not sure where the haters are coming from, unless 1kiki is right.

What did Trump do to get on this list with Eisenhower? I know what Eisenhower did: he gave his Military-Industrial Complex Speech three days before leaving the White House, which was eight years too late. But what did Trump do? So far he has asked for an increase in Military-Industrial Complex spending. Anything else Trump has done?
http://coursesa.matrix.msu.edu/~hst306/documents/indust.html

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, April 6, 2017 9:53 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


What Donald Trump gets wrong (and right) about the unemployment rate
www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/4/6/15181898/trump-unemployment-r
ate


Trump being very sensible and nutty at the same time (if only he could keep those two ingredients separated, never mixing them together. Is that too much to hope for? ):

During the campaign, Trump generally referred to the unemployment rate as “rigged” or even “totally fake.” Since taking office, his administration has grown more friendly to citing the official numbers, even though the rate has remained largely unchanged for months.

Still, Trump continues to have his doubts, and speaking Tuesday morning at a White House town hall for CEOs, he managed to completely mis-explain how the unemployment rate works.

“When you look for a job, you can’t find it, and you give up,” he said, “you are now considered statistically employed.”

That would be a pretty silly way to calculate the unemployment rate, and, indeed, that is not how the unemployment rate is calculated. (More on this in a minute.)

At the same time, Trump is speaking to a bigger truth when he says the unemployment rate may offer a distorted view of the labor market, and his opinion that the current numbers somewhat overstate the health of the economy has some real basis. . . .

One reason Trump’s skepticism about unemployment rates resonates with people is that if you abstract away from the details, it is basically true that the 4.7 percent unemployment rate in March 2017 reflects an economy that is substantially weaker than the 4.7 percent unemployment rate of December 1997. Older people, especially, who were actually in the workforce 20 years ago probably recognize this on an instinctive level, even if they can no more explain the nature of the deterioration than Trump can.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, April 6, 2017 10:33 AM

6STRINGJOKER


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
“When you look for a job, you can’t find it, and you give up,” he said, “you are now considered statistically employed.”

That would be a pretty silly way to calculate the unemployment rate, and, indeed, that is not how the unemployment rate is calculated. (More on this in a minute.)



That is, actually, pretty much exactly how the unemployment rate is calculated.

I've never heard of somebody in my position being called "statistically employed", but I have for quite some time not been considered "unemployed". Quibble over semantics if you must, but what he said is the truth here.

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Thursday, April 6, 2017 11:22 AM

DREAMTROVE


Second,


It's in everything you post. Stop, look around you. You're missing it. You're marching to the beat of the war drums, and still think you're opposing the drummer? You are that drum. If that's not your intention, take a moment and re-examine your world.

You read media outlets. They report what? the Truth? Take a look.

Media operations are expensive corporate endeavors that are owned by extremely rich capitalists and serve to bring large audiences to advertisers. This is the process that made them wealthy capitalists. Advertising is the programming of captured minds. This is what pays the bills. How do we capture minds? <- this it the question the corporates and advertisers are asking. FOX's answer is miniskirts. The left's (CNN/Huff/MSNBC) answer is anger.

And anger turns to hate. Hate argues, and hate goes back for more information to back up its argument, and it needs to return to the trust sources that fed it the anger in the first place. And the cycle repeats. And why? To furnish the angry to the same corporate overlords that run FOX.

And who is the largest corporate overlord, the biggest capitalist of them all? War. War is the ultimate consumer. It destroys what it buys and then needs to buy more. It gets the money by invading people and taking what they have. Oh, in the old days of WWI+II it was simply, just take the oil. Now it's "install a leader who will sign our trade treaty that will allow us to steal what they have in peacetime." It's a war that can't lose. Because the real conquest happens after the war is over, before that, they can an endless number of retries. So there's only one thing that can go wrong.

And that's why they hate Trump. I'm not endorsing him, but it's real important to understand why they hate him. Don't just go back to the anger source, take a moment to really understand what's going on here.

They hate him because he scuttled the trade deals. He scuttled NAFTA, he's undermining the EU, he scuttled the WTO, he's abandoning most favored nation status. What happens instead? Nations work out their own trade deals. That's a disaster for the war machine. What use is it to invade Iraq, murder its people and govt. and install your own if the next person in office is not bound in chains to an international trade deal? He might just decide Iraq should sell its oil at a price they want to whomeever they want. That make the war pointless. It takes away the spoils. Without those spoils how can they pay for the next war?

This is how they work. They need outside money to pay for the war. If they spent their own nation's money, each repetition would by necessity by smaller, and the war machine would get progressively smaller and shrivel up. So, they must invade, and conquer, and then install a trade siphon so they can take the spoils when no one is looking.

And for all of this to happen, they need people to support it. No one would actually support it, so they need them to fear, and hate, and be angry. So, they have the media. It's an anger machine. It was created by Maximilian Robespierre for the purpose of spreading misinformation about the queen of France, with support from our own founding fathers, who wanted her gone because we owed her a billions of French Livres. Much cheaper just to kill her and install a puppet regime. That also gave us left-right politics. And, ultimately, Napoleon, aka, the war machine.

Robespierre's chief of police in Corsica might not have been what the enlightenment had in mind, but if Napoleon had ascended to the throne of France, no disaster would have followed. Napoleon is the result of the system that was installed. International finance, partisanship and the media drive the engine, which has remained the same ever since. Franco-Prussian War, World War I, World War II, the Cold War, and now Bush-Obama's massive Global War on Terror. Borrow money. Invade. Install a policy, more subtle with each repetition, that allows you to steal the money. Pay your creditors. Borrow for the Next War. Repeat.

That cycle is broken if you can't take their money. Everyone has to not pay attention to that. So, look, we have 31 genders! Kim Kardashian has money! Janet Jackson has nipples! Russia is evil! Trump said what?!?!? Herman Cain said what?!? Ubekibekistanstan? Howard Dean went Hyah!?!?!? How evil of him. There's long list of people who didn't who didn't play the game, or played it to well (looking at you, Vlad) or are in the way of the trade treaty.

So we have Maddow and Olbermann and we keep O'Reilly on the side just in case people ever wake up and oppose the war. They feed us anger about attacks they probably did themselves, anger about an election, who won an awards show... it's all the same: Be angry, argue, and come back to us for more, we're here, we have your back, just believe the lie.

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Friday, April 7, 2017 7:45 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Quote:

Originally posted by DREAMTROVE:
Second,


It's in everything you post. Stop, look around you. You're missing it. You're marching to the beat of the war drums, and still think you're opposing the drummer? You are that drum. If that's not your intention, take a moment and re-examine your world.

You read media outlets. They report what? the Truth? Take a look.

You wrote this before Trump fired 60 Cruise missiles at one Syrian airfield. That nice expenditure of money is exactly what the Military-Industrial Complex would admire about Trump. It proves the need to buy many, many more missiles. It is about the money. It is not about winning a war.

Trump called it a "targeted" attack on Syria and the Pentagon called it "proportional." What Trump did was ordinary. He's merely done the smallest, safest, most ordinary thing American presidents do in circumstances like this. It was precisely the kind of limited strike American presidents are addicted to when public opinion requires them to demonstrate anger over something or other, and it's precisely the language every president uses to describe them. Russia will issue a pro forma denunciation, and the Syrians will rebuild their airfield. In a couple of weeks it will all be forgotten. Except for the need to buy more and more missiles from the Military-Industrial Complex.

Each Tomahawk missile cost about $569,000 in 1999 dollars, according to the US Navy, -- equivalent to about $832,000 today.
www.cnn.com/2017/04/06/politics/tomahawk-missiles-explainer/

This would have cost the American taxpayer at least $49,088,000 (£39,353,000).
www.thesun.co.uk/news/3277606/tomahawk-cruise-missiles-syria-chemical-
attack-trump
/

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Friday, April 7, 2017 8:02 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Trump’s $1 trillion infrastructure plan is vaporware that’s never going to happen.
Rambling nonsense is not a legislative strategy.
www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/4/6/15205032/trump-infrastructure
-plan


Trump’s knowledge of complex policy issues can sometimes be lacking.

And to the extent that that’s news, it’s the only actual news Trump made on infrastructure. His remarks make it clear that he doesn’t know anything about the substance of the issue or about the relevant congressional procedures. He doesn’t appear to be familiar with the related provisions of his own administration’s budget, and he isn’t putting in the time to lay the political groundwork for any legislation. The trillion-dollar infrastructure plan doesn’t exist except as a line of rhetoric.

It’s pure vaporware, and unless something dramatic changes to the overall structure of the administration, it always will be.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, April 7, 2017 9:39 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Where is your tax plan, Trump?
www.vox.com/2017/4/7/15208466/trump-tax-reform-plan

The White House wants to lead on tax reform — it just needs a tax reform plan first. Other than a plan and a strategy, they have everything.

One reason presidents traditionally try to develop campaign promises that make some kind of sense is that referring back to what was promised in the campaign is a useful way of getting everyone on the same page. Nobody winds up implementing everything that they pledged, but the pledges are a useful focusing device and serve as a starting point.

Trump’s campaign promises on taxes, however, were contradictory, extreme, and not doable through the budget reconciliation process. Gary Cohn, the top economic policy official in the White House, played no role in crafting them.

And Trump himself never seemed to be able to state clearly what the plan was. This worked surprisingly well for him as a candidate, but as a president it’s left the ship without a compass. The chief executive himself seems unwilling or unable to intervene and clarify which direction he wants to go.

Is Trump nuts? Or is he politically astute and shrewd? Nuts is what it is.

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Friday, April 7, 2017 10:28 AM

DREAMTROVE


Second,

Okay, that's a vote for war. Yes, it's the minimum possible because he doesn't want the war, but now Putin has to do something.

accurate except the bogus info on chemical attacks. What I just said to Jo
Quote:


Deep State: Obey the PNAC plan
Trump: Nah, Assad can stay
Immediately: chemical attack * obvious false flag
Russia: it was us, (probably false narrative)
Deep State: Trump has to do something or he's out
McCain: Trump needs to do something or he's out (probably bait)
Trump: Vlad, sorry, I gotta do something
Putin: Bashir, he's going to do this
Assad: Empty the base
Trump: Bombs away
Putin: Don't intercept, don't respond
Putin: American imperialist aggressor (obvious false narrative)
McCain: Trump is a hero, not a Russian troll (obvious false narrative)
Trump: That was the base that did the attack (obvious false narrative)

* The attack almost certainly went down like this: Deep State to HRC: we need that UN authorization, Assad needs to be blamed for a chemical attack. HRC to ISIS I'm still your commander, attack and make it look like Assad. ISIS: Die everyone! Assad: Uh Oh. Putin: Uh Oh. Trump: Uh Oh. Deep State: Wahoo!



I see Nick is all in for war. Guns to Ukraine? I doubt it's going to happen. Would be a total disaster if it did.

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Friday, April 7, 2017 10:41 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


While it was no doubt prudent for Trump to minimize the number of people killed in the attack, letting Syria know that the strike was coming represents a significant departure from Trump’s own campaign rhetoric. At rally after rally before he was president, and in debates against Hillary Clinton, Trump repeatedly called for surprise attacks and mocked the U.S. military and its Iraqi allies for giving advance notice of a planned offensive against Islamic State fighters to retake the city of Mosul in Iraq.

Pressed on the idea that he did not understand military strategy in an interview just before the election, Trump vowed to teach military experts a thing or two.

“Whatever happened to the element of surprise?” Trump asked in a September debate. “Douglas MacArthur, George Patton, spinning in their graves when they see the stupidity of our country.”

Was Trump nuts while he was campaigning? Or is he now suddenly prudent? Or was the prudence of warning Russia (and Russia warning Syria of a planned Tomahawk cruise missile attack) all supplied by the Pentagon? We will never know until the biographical books on Trump are published with their contradictory claims. Oh, I just realized we won't know then, either, will we?

https://theintercept.com/2017/04/07/trump-surrenders-element-surprise-
warning-russia-planned-strike-ally-syria
/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, April 7, 2017 11:11 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr

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Friday, April 7, 2017 3:01 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Quote:

Originally posted by JO753:
Exellent appraizal by Paul Krugman:

The most revealing thing in the interview may be Mr. Trump’s defense of Bill O’Reilly, accused of sexual predation and abuse of power: “He’s a good person.” This, I’d argue, tells us more about both the man from Mar-a-Lago and the motivations of his base than his ramblings about infrastructure and trade.

One thing down-on-their-luck rural whites often say is that Mr. Trump is honest, that he tells it like it is. In other words, Mr. Trump is, arguably, less hypocritical about the darker motives underlying his worldview than conventional politicians are.

Hence the affinity for Mr. O’Reilly, and Mr. Trump’s apparent sense that news reports about the TV host’s actions are an indirect attack on him. One way to think about Fox News in general, and Mr. O’Reilly in particular, is that they provide a safe space for people who want an affirmation that their uglier impulses are, in fact, justified and perfectly O.K. And one way to think about the Trump White House is that it’s attempting to expand that safe space to include the nation as a whole.

And the big question about Trumpism — bigger, arguably, than the legislative agenda — is whether unapologetic ugliness is a winning political strategy. If it is not a winner, than Trump is nuts to defend O’Reilly.
www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/04/07/bill-oreillys-advert
iser-exodus-is-even-worse-than-it-looks/?utm_term=.0fae8abd3146


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, April 7, 2017 3:34 PM

6STRINGJOKER


lol... that's rich Second.

Republicans want safe spaces from Liberal SJW safe spaces now.


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Friday, April 7, 2017 5:13 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



Quote:

Now that those who voted for Trump can no longer play the "Hillary is a War Hawk!" what's left?
Are you pretending that she's not?
Quote:

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/hillary-clinton-says-she-supported-more-ag
gressive-action-in-syria
/
Hillary Clinton Says She Supported More Aggressive Action-in Syria

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/hillary-clinton-also-called-for-strik
es-on-syrian-airfields-yesterday-2017-04-07

Hillary Clinton also called for strikes on Syrian airfields yesterday

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-people-hillary-clinton-idUSKBN179058
Hillary Clinton calls for U.S. to bomb Syrian air fields




Care to try addressing the facts, again?

Or do you shoot nothing but blanks?


Originally posted by G:
"I coined the slogan "We Suck!"© many years ago."
G is an avowed Putin-loving, pro-Russian, anti-American troll.

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Friday, April 7, 2017 6:02 PM

DREAMTROVE


Second,

I think who he doesn't want to give advance notice to is the CIA. They might move to change his plan, or their consequences. I still would like to see the full report on what happened with the Yemen mission.

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Friday, April 7, 2017 6:14 PM

THGRRI


Quote:

Originally posted by G:
Quote:

Originally posted by JO753:
Exellent appraizal by Paul Krugman:



I love Krugman. He tells it like it is.

Now that those who voted for Trump can no longer play the "Hillary is a War Hawk!" what's left?

-----------------------------
The Truth about Russian Trolls: http://bit.ly/2nwoDoz



Shit, it's Hillary mania around here. Our Russian trolls and moron, are trying desperately to change the subject away from Russia getting kicked in the ass. That and our trolls waking up to the fact that Putin won't and can't do shit about it.






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Friday, April 7, 2017 6:43 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by THUGGER:
blah blah blah ... Russian Trolls ... blah blah blah

blah blah blah ... Russian trolls ... blah blah blah ... Putin ... blah blah blah





Care to try addressing the facts, again?

Or do you shoot nothing but blanks?


Originally posted by G:
"I coined the slogan "We Suck!"© many years ago."
G is an avowed Putin-loving, pro-Russian, anti-American troll.

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Friday, April 7, 2017 6:51 PM

DREAMTROVE


1kiki.
lol

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Friday, April 7, 2017 7:08 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Quote:

Originally posted by 6STRINGJOKER:
lol... that's rich Second.

Republicans want safe spaces from Liberal SJW safe spaces now.

O'Reilly is in trouble with his advertisers. O'Reilly has paid $13 million to five women to settle claims of sexual harassment or inappropriate conduct. Trump's been there, done that, has the t-shirt. He feels O'Reilly's pain, as do Trumpettes.
www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/04/07/bill-oreillys-advert
iser-exodus-is-even-worse-than-it-looks/?utm_term=.0fae8abd3146


Most recent time Trump has been sued for being O'Reilly: www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2017/01/17/apprentice-contestant-summer
-zervos-slaps-donald-trump-with-defamation-lawsuit.html


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, April 7, 2017 8:47 PM

6STRINGJOKER


Maybe he did, maybe he didn't. Funny how you never hear about a poor man being sued for sexual harassment, huh?

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Friday, April 7, 2017 9:09 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Quote:

Originally posted by 6STRINGJOKER:
Maybe he did, maybe he didn't. Funny how you never hear about a poor man being sued for sexual harassment, huh?

I know a real-life case where she didn't sue; she shot him. Much more effective since she couldn't afford to sue. Everybody lived; no one went to jail, but he learned. Too bad Trump didn't run into someone like that who would teach him to behave himself.

Here is a case where it wasn't Trump or O'Reilly being sued:
Quote:

Former Humble ISD officer presses sexual discrimination suit
By Keri Blakinger Published 7:00 pm, Monday, February 13, 2017
www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/houston/article/Former-Humble-ISD-off
icer-presses-sexual-10929968.php


A former Humble ISD police officer on Friday launched a sexual discrimination suit against the district, claiming supervisors in the small department harassed her from day one, telling her she "looked gay" and making explicit comments about women's bodies.
Robin Carr is now asking for up to $1 million in a sweeping lawsuit that accuses the department of everything from fostering a hostile work environment to invasion of privacy to slander.
"It was bad over there," said Lynne Jurek, the attorney representing Carr. "There's a lot of issues with Humble ISD police department."
Humble ISD has not yet formally responded to the suit in court and district spokeswoman Jamie Mount said Monday that the district "does not comment on pending litigation or personnel matters."
For Carr, the problems allegedly started right after she began her full-time job as a probationary police officer in June 2014.
One department sergeant, the suit alleges, talked to the new hire about other women's - and even other officers' - breasts and buttocks, creating "an atmosphere where sexual harassment and discrimination in the workplace is prevalent."
The problems may have extended beyond Carr's treatment, as another Humble ISD officer claimed one problem sergeant texted her nude photos, according to the suit.
During her time there, Carr struggled to complete training - a problem she says was due to a lack of certified officers able to show her the ropes.
The training officer Carr was belatedly assigned first gave her a silent treatment for days and then started asking "clearly inappropriate personal questions about Ms. Carr's sexual orientation and lifestyle," according to the suit.
Another training officer quizzed Carr about her dating life and whether she went to strip clubs - and even launched into discussions about his own sexual conquests, the suit alleges.
"She was very uncomfortable and embarrassed about it," Jurek said.
Eventually, Carr was assigned to ride with an uncertified officer and made to work nights.
Throughout her training, she was regularly ordered to drive an old patrol car with an outdated inspection sticker, no seat belt and a bad battery.
"If you want to be a man you need to learn how to jump a battery," she claims one supervisor told her.
Despite consistent complaints that her performance wasn't up to par, Carr was never formally written up - and eventually a fellow officer explained the cause for her bad treatment.
"She was informed by a co-worker that she being treated the way she was because of her sexuality," Jurek said.
In February 2015, Carr got a call from a lieutenant telling her she needed to "resign or quit."
She did - and now is asking for compensation for emotional pain, back pay, attorney's fees, inconvenience, loss of earnings and more.
Before entering her complaint in Harris County court, Carr had already filed a discrimination charge with the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission and was awarded a right to sue letter, her attorney said. She also filed a charge with the Texas Workforce Commission's Civil Rights Division, alleging violations.



The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, April 7, 2017 9:16 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

against the district
deep pockets
Quote:

asking for up to $1 million
a large sum of money


How does this disprove the contention that only rich people get sued for sexual harassment?




Care to try addressing the facts, again?

Or do you shoot nothing but blanks?


Originally posted by G:
"I coined the slogan "We Suck!"© many years ago."
G is an avowed Putin-loving, pro-Russian, anti-American troll.

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Friday, April 7, 2017 11:00 PM

6STRINGJOKER


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6STRINGJOKER:
Maybe he did, maybe he didn't. Funny how you never hear about a poor man being sued for sexual harassment, huh?

I know a real-life case where she didn't sue; she shot him. Much more effective since she couldn't afford to sue. Everybody lived; no one went to jail, but he learned. Too bad Trump didn't run into someone like that who would teach him to behave himself.

Here is a case where it wasn't Trump or O'Reilly being sued:
Quote:

Former Humble ISD officer presses sexual discrimination suit
By Keri Blakinger Published 7:00 pm, Monday, February 13, 2017
www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/houston/article/Former-Humble-ISD-off
icer-presses-sexual-10929968.php


A former Humble ISD police officer on Friday launched a sexual discrimination suit against the district, claiming supervisors in the small department harassed her from day one, telling her she "looked gay" and making explicit comments about women's bodies.
Robin Carr is now asking for up to $1 million in a sweeping lawsuit that accuses the department of everything from fostering a hostile work environment to invasion of privacy to slander.
"It was bad over there," said Lynne Jurek, the attorney representing Carr. "There's a lot of issues with Humble ISD police department."
Humble ISD has not yet formally responded to the suit in court and district spokeswoman Jamie Mount said Monday that the district "does not comment on pending litigation or personnel matters."
For Carr, the problems allegedly started right after she began her full-time job as a probationary police officer in June 2014.
One department sergeant, the suit alleges, talked to the new hire about other women's - and even other officers' - breasts and buttocks, creating "an atmosphere where sexual harassment and discrimination in the workplace is prevalent."
The problems may have extended beyond Carr's treatment, as another Humble ISD officer claimed one problem sergeant texted her nude photos, according to the suit.
During her time there, Carr struggled to complete training - a problem she says was due to a lack of certified officers able to show her the ropes.
The training officer Carr was belatedly assigned first gave her a silent treatment for days and then started asking "clearly inappropriate personal questions about Ms. Carr's sexual orientation and lifestyle," according to the suit.
Another training officer quizzed Carr about her dating life and whether she went to strip clubs - and even launched into discussions about his own sexual conquests, the suit alleges.
"She was very uncomfortable and embarrassed about it," Jurek said.
Eventually, Carr was assigned to ride with an uncertified officer and made to work nights.
Throughout her training, she was regularly ordered to drive an old patrol car with an outdated inspection sticker, no seat belt and a bad battery.
"If you want to be a man you need to learn how to jump a battery," she claims one supervisor told her.
Despite consistent complaints that her performance wasn't up to par, Carr was never formally written up - and eventually a fellow officer explained the cause for her bad treatment.
"She was informed by a co-worker that she being treated the way she was because of her sexuality," Jurek said.
In February 2015, Carr got a call from a lieutenant telling her she needed to "resign or quit."
She did - and now is asking for compensation for emotional pain, back pay, attorney's fees, inconvenience, loss of earnings and more.
Before entering her complaint in Harris County court, Carr had already filed a discrimination charge with the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission and was awarded a right to sue letter, her attorney said. She also filed a charge with the Texas Workforce Commission's Civil Rights Division, alleging violations.



The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly



That's not a sexual harassment suit.

That's a woman doing a job that requires her to be tough and she couldn't hack it. There's no shortage of sleezy lawyers who will do that kind of work no charge when there is a big payday at the end.

The only people I feel bad for in that lawsuit are the local tax payers who are going to foot the major bill for her to live on easy street the rest of her life because somebody called her the twat that she proved herself to be.

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Saturday, April 8, 2017 9:42 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Donald Trump Remains Puzzled About West Wing Chaos
www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2017/04/donald-trump-remains-puzzled-ab
out-west-wing-chaos


It's time for the latest Donald Trump pivot. The Wall Street Journal reports that the crisis in Syria "has sharpened Mr. Trump’s desire to cut some of the drama out of his West Wing." He's finally going to get presidential!

President Donald Trump is considering a major shake-up of his senior White House team, a senior administration official said Friday....In recent days, he has talked to confidants about the performance of chief of staff Reince Priebus and has asked for the names of possible replacements....Another top aide who could be removed or reassigned in a shake-up is Steve Bannon, chief strategist, who has been sparring with Jared Kushner, the president’s son-in-law and one of his closest advisers.

In fairness, Trump can't fire himself, but is he really so clueless that he doesn't realize the infighting springs directly from his own chaotic personality, not from the folks around him? If he provided clear direction on both policy and communications—and stopped tweeting random crap all the time—things would calm down fast.

But he'll never figure that out.


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Saturday, April 8, 2017 9:48 AM

THGRRI


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Donald Trump Remains Puzzled About West Wing Chaos
www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2017/04/donald-trump-remains-puzzled-ab
out-west-wing-chaos


It's time for the latest Donald Trump pivot. The Wall Street Journal reports that the crisis in Syria "has sharpened Mr. Trump’s desire to cut some of the drama out of his West Wing." He's finally going to get presidential!

President Donald Trump is considering a major shake-up of his senior White House team, a senior administration official said Friday....In recent days, he has talked to confidants about the performance of chief of staff Reince Priebus and has asked for the names of possible replacements....Another top aide who could be removed or reassigned in a shake-up is Steve Bannon, chief strategist, who has been sparring with Jared Kushner, the president’s son-in-law and one of his closest advisers.

In fairness, Trump can't fire himself, but is he really so clueless that he doesn't realize the infighting springs directly from his own chaotic personality, not from the folks around him? If he provided clear direction on both policy and communications—and stopped tweeting random crap all the time—things would calm down fast.

But he'll never figure that out.


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly



I hope he does get more presidential. Even if we had to drag him there while he was kicking and screaming.






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Saturday, April 8, 2017 10:39 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


I hope he screwz up sumthing big enuf to get axed asap.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.7532020.com

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Saturday, April 8, 2017 10:50 AM

THGRRI


Quote:

Originally posted by JO753:
I hope he screwz up sumthing big enuf to get axed asap.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.7532020.com



Well, yeah, that would be better.






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Saturday, April 8, 2017 1:05 PM

DREAMTROVE


Quote:

Originally posted by JO753:
I hope he screwz up sumthing big enuf to get axed asap.

Okay, stick a fork in it, this democracy's done.

Srsly. Consider for a moment what you are saying, Jo. You want the president to fail, ie, America to fail, so the left can seize power. And then we can have a little USSR again. TPP, like the EU. great.

And to clarify, so I'm not Putin WRDz into your mouth, I mean that Donald J Trump, the popularly elected President of the United States, (Hey, even I still can't say that with a straight face, but we have to get used to it) is a very pro-American candidate. And I accept that 59%. I think He might've lost to Sanders. But the democratic party ain't democratic anymore, and no law says they can't rig their primary. So, to want President Trump to fail is to want America to fail, because if you replace him with a leftie in this political climate, that means getting on board with the TPP, and WTO, and global corporate neo=imperialism. Which is it for America. That's what happens to the US. So, skipping Hillary Clinton, because frankly, I'd vote for Bashir al Assad before I would vote for Hillary, some deep state coup ousts the president with an impeachment (they never pass) and a series of threats, attempted assinations, or assassination, because that's what works, which is already a movement by the CIA (the real deep state) to install some puppet of the left, who will get on board with the corporatist trade treaties.

What do you think of Bernie? (I'm serious, I want to know.) Myself, i voted for Sanders, but I'm not about to support a CIA coup to install Sanders. I'm definitely supporting the idea of Trump is the legit president, and his supporters appear to be anything but deplorable. I'd like Sanders to run again, or support someone to run again, but my point is, whomever the CIA installs in going to answer to them, which means all the old Clinto-Bush-Obama nonsense comes back to the fore.

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Saturday, April 8, 2017 3:20 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


How about the alternative where Congressional Republicans truly investigate Trump,
even looking into his tax returns and business conflicts of interest? His blind trust is not blind. If Trump is clean, then no problem. If Trump is dirty, which no one will ever know so long as the Republican controlled Congress takes it responsibilities so lightly, the Congressional Republicans remove Trump from office. Pence becomes President. There is no take over by the Democrats.
It is the Republicans that prove, or refuse to prove, Trump is clean.
Quote:

Originally posted by DREAMTROVE:
Quote:

Originally posted by JO753:
I hope he screwz up sumthing big enuf to get axed asap.

Okay, stick a fork in it, this democracy's done.

Srsly. Consider for a moment what you are saying, Jo. You want the president to fail, ie, America to fail, so the left can seize power. And then we can have a little USSR again. TPP, like the EU. great.

And to clarify, so I'm not Putin WRDz into your mouth, I mean that Donald J Trump, the popularly elected President of the United States, (Hey, even I still can't say that with a straight face, but we have to get used to it) is a very pro-American candidate. And I accept that 59%. I think He might've lost to Sanders. But the democratic party ain't democratic anymore, and no law says they can't rig their primary. So, to want President Trump to fail is to want America to fail, because if you replace him with a leftie in this political climate, that means getting on board with the TPP, and WTO, and global corporate neo=imperialism. Which is it for America. That's what happens to the US. So, skipping Hillary Clinton, because frankly, I'd vote for Bashir al Assad before I would vote for Hillary, some deep state coup ousts the president with an impeachment (they never pass) and a series of threats, attempted assinations, or assassination, because that's what works, which is already a movement by the CIA (the real deep state) to install some puppet of the left, who will get on board with the corporatist trade treaties.

What do you think of Bernie? (I'm serious, I want to know.) Myself, i voted for Sanders, but I'm not about to support a CIA coup to install Sanders. I'm definitely supporting the idea of Trump is the legit president, and his supporters appear to be anything but deplorable. I'd like Sanders to run again, or support someone to run again, but my point is, whomever the CIA installs in going to answer to them, which means all the old Clinto-Bush-Obama nonsense comes back to the fore.



The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Saturday, April 8, 2017 6:14 PM

DREAMTROVE


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
How about the alternative where Congressional Republicans truly investigate Trump,
even looking into his tax returns and business conflicts of interest? His blind trust is not blind. If Trump is clean, then no problem. If Trump is dirty, which no one will ever know so long as the Republican controlled Congress takes it responsibilities so lightly, the Congressional Republicans remove Trump from office. Pence becomes President. There is no take over by the Democrats.
It is the Republicans that prove, or refuse to prove, Trump is clean.


Hillary loves that plan. Any plan where the DNC decides who is president instead of the voters is a terrible plan, and not democracy. It's probably treason. Speaking of treason, that's what you impeach someone for. Sure, there are technicalities, but that's the plea bargain after you step down form treason. Nixon resigned. (The treason was invading Cambodia.) Ron Paul and Larry Craig voted to impeach Clinton from treason in Yugosalvia, (using the US UN peacekeeping contingent to arm Al Qaeda in an offensive to exterminate an ethinc minority in Bosnia (100,000 herzogovinians) Monica Lewinsky case was a setup by Clinton ally Newt Gingrich (To silence Linda Tripp about Vince Foster.) Thing is, I think you know all this, and you're just jumping on a partisan bandwagon like an operative. Because hte whingathon is not the resistance, but if you guys overthrow the govt. you will find that there is a resistance. And it's not because people love Trump. BTW, Pence has said he would not accept that. I assume that means he'd step down. President Paul Ryan is what you'd get. And a CIA deep state coup. And WWIII. Because Russia. And we'll invite them in to help stop that. And that's not treason, that's patriotism.

Still not completely happy with Trump, but much more unhappy with this idea that because the SJWs don't like that they lost an election we should throw democracy out with the bathwater.

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Sunday, April 9, 2017 9:43 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Sorry to say, you are writing nonsense. This has nothing to do with what Hillary wants. In the USA's democracy, it is the Congressional Republicans' responsibility to prove Trump is clean. They aren't doing it. If the Constitution allowed, we could hold another national election to decide if Trump is guilty or not, but if the Congressional Republicans won't do their job of investigating Trump, it won't be done.

Republican Devin Nunes of California, in charge of one tiny part of investigating Trump, is now under investigation by the House Committee on Ethics because of public reports that he “may have made unauthorized disclosures of classified information.”
www.nytimes.com/2017/04/06/us/politics/devin-nunes-house-intelligence-
committee-russia.html


None of the other so-called "investigations" of Trump are proceeding in any way other than erratic whitewashes. I'm sure a Republican Congress and Republican voters don't want to know what crimes Trump might have committed. It makes them feel better to only pretend to investigate because they would feel really bad should they find a crime. This is where Hillary comes in -- she won't feel bad at all if Trump resigns like Nixon did. In August 9, 1974, Congressional Republicans and Democrats actually cared about the country more than about their political parties. Those days are gone.

"When the President does it, that means that it is not illegal." - Nixon
Trump would agree.
Quote:

Originally posted by DREAMTROVE:
Quote:

Originally posted by second:
How about the alternative where Congressional Republicans truly investigate Trump,
even looking into his tax returns and business conflicts of interest? His blind trust is not blind. If Trump is clean, then no problem. If Trump is dirty, which no one will ever know so long as the Republican controlled Congress takes it responsibilities so lightly, the Congressional Republicans remove Trump from office. Pence becomes President. There is no take over by the Democrats.
It is the Republicans that prove, or refuse to prove, Trump is clean.


Hillary loves that plan. Any plan where the DNC decides who is president instead of the voters is a terrible plan, and not democracy. It's probably treason. Speaking of treason, that's what you impeach someone for. Sure, there are technicalities, but that's the plea bargain after you step down form treason. Nixon resigned. (The treason was invading Cambodia.) Ron Paul and Larry Craig voted to impeach Clinton from treason in Yugosalvia, (using the US UN peacekeeping contingent to arm Al Qaeda in an offensive to exterminate an ethinc minority in Bosnia (100,000 herzogovinians) Monica Lewinsky case was a setup by Clinton ally Newt Gingrich (To silence Linda Tripp about Vince Foster.) Thing is, I think you know all this, and you're just jumping on a partisan bandwagon like an operative. Because hte whingathon is not the resistance, but if you guys overthrow the govt. you will find that there is a resistance. And it's not because people love Trump. BTW, Pence has said he would not accept that. I assume that means he'd step down. President Paul Ryan is what you'd get. And a CIA deep state coup. And WWIII. Because Russia. And we'll invite them in to help stop that. And that's not treason, that's patriotism.

Still not completely happy with Trump, but much more unhappy with this idea that because the SJWs don't like that they lost an election we should throw democracy out with the bathwater.


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Sunday, April 9, 2017 9:45 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Libel in a world without truth
https://qz.com/935534/a-strategic-guide-to-navigating-the-law-like-don
ald-trump
/

Trump’s claims about Obama constitute accusing a sitting US president of a crime. LawNewz noted that legal experts say Obama “has a strong case for a libel lawsuit.”

Technically speaking, it’s true that Obama may have a case. But technically doesn’t mean realistically, at least not when it comes to Donald Trump. Outrageous claims are his specialty, and Trump is the master of staying legally circumspect while appearing to be publicly reckless.

Libel is defined as a written published statement that is false and injurious to the reputation of another. To prove libel against a public figure, the statement has to have been made with both “reckless disregard for the truth” and “actual malice.”

Richard Painter, former ethics counsel to US president George W. Bush, told LawNewz that “an accusation of illegal wiretapping… would likely be criminal if a government official ordered it. Accusing someone of a crime is actionable as libel.” Painter noted that the “actual malice” standard is clearly met in this situation, and that Obama could sue Trump for his defamatory words.

To defeat such a suit, Trump would have to show he didn’t act maliciously and didn’t know what he said was false.

Any ambiguity surrounding Trump’s beliefs or intentions is crucial from a legal perspective. The president makes outrageous statements regularly, and takes them back whenever it’s clever. Being bombastic is standard practice for Trump, which makes it difficult to show he acted disingenuously, or with malice, in any particular instance. Playing loose with facts and attribution—and liberally accusing publishers of peddling “fake news”—likewise makes it easy to argue that he didn’t know what was said was untrue.

Herein lies one part of Trump’s legal genius: If everything you say is outrageous, then really nothing is. What’s a reckless disregard for the truth when we can’t agree on what truth is anyway?

There’s proof that this approach actually works for Trump in the context of defamation. In January, before he assumed the presidency, Trump defeated a libel claim filed in New York state court by Cheryl Jacobus, who he said in a tweet turned “hostile” after he denied her a job that she “begged” for. The judge wrote of Trump:

His tweets about his critics, necessarily restricted to 140 characters or less, are rife with vague and simplistic insults such as ‘loser’ or ‘total loser’ or ‘totally biased loser,’ ‘dummy’ or ‘dope’ or ‘dumb,’ ‘zero/no credibility,’ ‘crazy’ or ‘wacko’ and ‘disaster,’ all deflecting serious consideration…Indeed, to some, truth itself has been lost in the cacophony of online and Twitter verbiage to such a degree that it seems to roll of the national consciousness like water off a duck’s back.

In other words, Trump’s tweets—both substantively and in terms of volume—make it difficult to take him seriously, which works in his favor.

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Sunday, April 9, 2017 10:39 AM

THGRRI


A post worth repeating. The problem is that dreamtove tows the Trump/Putin line. He'll claim he doesn't but the totality of his posts shows otherwise.

Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Sorry to say, you are writing nonsense. This has nothing to do with what Hillary wants. In the USA's democracy, it is the Congressional Republicans' responsibility to prove Trump is clean. They aren't doing it. If the Constitution allowed, we could hold another national election to decide if Trump is guilty or not, but if the Congressional Republicans won't do their job of investigating Trump, it won't be done.

Republican Devin Nunes of California, in charge of one tiny part of investigating Trump, is now under investigation by the House Committee on Ethics because of public reports that he “may have made unauthorized disclosures of classified information.”
www.nytimes.com/2017/04/06/us/politics/devin-nunes-house-intelligence-
committee-russia.html


None of the other so-called "investigations" of Trump are proceeding in any way other than erratic whitewashes. I'm sure a Republican Congress and Republican voters don't want to know what crimes Trump might have committed. It makes them feel better to only pretend to investigate because they would feel really bad should they find a crime. This is where Hillary comes in -- she won't feel bad at all if Trump resigns like Nixon did. In August 9, 1974, Congressional Republicans and Democrats actually cared about the country more than about their political parties. Those days are gone.

"When the President does it, that means that it is not illegal." - Nixon
Trump would agree.







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Sunday, April 9, 2017 10:53 AM

6STRINGJOKER


It might not really matter. Only time will tell. If Trumps actions in the last 48 hours are any indication of what is to come than we might as well have voted Hillary in for the presidency.

Now we wait.

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Sunday, April 9, 2017 11:11 AM

DREAMTROVE


Nick, Second,

You guys like democracy when you win, and not when you don't. You'd rather have a coup than lose an election. While the Sanders camp is talking about who to run in 2020, the Clinton camp is talking about how to empower the CIA to overthrow the govt. One side doesn't belong in the "democratic" party.

I'm towing no line. At the moment Trump is looking okay to me. Did you notice how quickly I was willing to give up if he went into all out war on Syria? But it seems like the bombing was an organized op he and Putin worked out to throw the deep state off the scent. I'll have to accept that as necessary if it was.

But Sig has a point, if anyone is reading what she posts. If Trump signs on to the PNAC agenda, then what advantage did any of us gain. I get that T will be happy again, but it's not going to help.


Second, yes, it's the Hillary camp that started the empower Pence idea. I don't like that idea because I'm no fan of Pence. Hillary said he's harder to beat. I care less about winning elections and more about having sensible policy. Pence is a smart guy, but he's also a right wing establishment oil & coal guy. I think he's Trump's environmental problem, and it would get worse in a Pence admin. I'd rather keep Trump.


T, as for Putin, I have serious issues with Putin, more than I have with Trump. That said, he's resistance to globalism and World War. If I were a Russian or voted in their elections, I might consider other options. I know Kasperov, which of course would color my vote, but from an ideological perspective, I think a lot of Russians might support him, a lot might support Poklonskaya, who is more of a nationalist. What you're not going to see is a pro-globalist Russia. Nor are you going to see a defeat of Russia by the west. We have a couple thousand years of history on that one. We got a pro-Western ruler in for four years and used him to crash the Russian economy. They won't forgive that for centuries. You remove Putin by some other means than an election and you won't get Kasperov or Poklonskaya, you'll get another strongman just like him with less restraint, which won't be good for either of us, and much worse for everyone in the middle.

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Sunday, April 9, 2017 12:55 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


It is in the Constitution, NOT Hillary’s idea, to replace Trump with VP Pence, if Trump is slightly less or more crooked than Nixon. The Constitution does make any allowances for you liking a crooked President better than an honest Vice-President. Except in Nixon's case, V.P. Spiro Agnew was a bigger crook than Nixon. Agnew resigned rather than go to jail for tax evasion and taking bribes. Once Agnew's past got a proper investigation, after he was elected, he was ruined by what was found. Agnew is a very small time criminal compared to what Trump could have done in the last 30 years with his mysterious taxes he won't reveal to investigators. Nothing about Trump's past got non-partisan Congressional scrutiny before the election. Now is the time and the next four years.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiro_Agnew#Criminal_investigation_and_r
esignation


In 1972, Republican voters were whining that Nixon was an honest man and Watergate was a witch hunt intended to overthrow a democratically elected President. It took hundreds of days of investigations by Congress to prove Nixon was a crook.

All the while Nixon was declaring he was innocent (innocent!) he told the world. Expect the same from Trump, declaring his innocence, with even more shouting and less dignity than Nixon.

Too bad Trump will not help prove his innocence by turning over his tax returns and placing his businesses into a real blind trust. It will take hundreds of days to prove Trump is, or is not, a crook. Congress has not even started the work they are responsible for in the Constitution. Congress is faking it.
Quote:

Originally posted by DREAMTROVE:
Nick, Second,

You guys like democracy when you win, and not when you don't. You'd rather have a coup than lose an election. While the Sanders camp is talking about who to run in 2020, the Clinton camp is talking about how to empower the CIA to overthrow the govt. One side doesn't belong in the "democratic" party.

I'm towing no line. At the moment Trump is looking okay to me. Did you notice how quickly I was willing to give up if he went into all out war on Syria? But it seems like the bombing was an organized op he and Putin worked out to throw the deep state off the scent. I'll have to accept that as necessary if it was.

But Sig has a point, if anyone is reading what she posts. If Trump signs on to the PNAC agenda, then what advantage did any of us gain. I get that T will be happy again, but it's not going to help.


Second, yes, it's the Hillary camp that started the empower Pence idea. I don't like that idea because I'm no fan of Pence. Hillary said he's harder to beat. I care less about winning elections and more about having sensible policy. Pence is a smart guy, but he's also a right wing establishment oil & coal guy. I think he's Trump's environmental problem, and it would get worse in a Pence admin. I'd rather keep Trump.


T, as for Putin, I have serious issues with Putin, more than I have with Trump. That said, he's resistance to globalism and World War. If I were a Russian or voted in their elections, I might consider other options. I know Kasperov, which of course would color my vote, but from an ideological perspective, I think a lot of Russians might support him, a lot might support Poklonskaya, who is more of a nationalist. What you're not going to see is a pro-globalist Russia. Nor are you going to see a defeat of Russia by the west. We have a couple thousand years of history on that one. We got a pro-Western ruler in for four years and used him to crash the Russian economy. They won't forgive that for centuries. You remove Putin by some other means than an election and you won't get Kasperov or Poklonskaya, you'll get another strongman just like him with less restraint, which won't be good for either of us, and much worse for everyone in the middle.


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Sunday, April 9, 2017 5:04 PM

DREAMTROVE


Not the intention to be used to overthrow the president. I know it wasn't a democracy, but that's not really a due process, it's whining. Bear in mind that it has never happened, no vice president has been installed, etc. I don't know why you don't like Trump. I'm not sure there is a reason. I'm sure this approach doesn't get you anywhere. Support a candidate to run in 2020, or move somewhere with a world leader you like, or let it go.

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Sunday, April 9, 2017 5:53 PM

6STRINGJOKER


Agreed.

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Sunday, April 9, 2017 7:49 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Republicans said the same about Nixon: “Shutup! He’s my President! His (Vietnam) War is to protect America from Commies, you dirty hippies!” Nixon won by a landslide in 1972. And yet Nixon and his V.P. got kicked from office in 1973-74 for small crimes. Nixon did worse than Watergate, which was a small crime he committed in 1971 to prevent public knowledge of a big crime Nixon committed in 1968, before he was President.
www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/george-f-will-nixons-long-shadow/2014/
08/06/fad8c00c-1ccb-11e4-ae54-0cfe1f974f8a_story.html


There are 25 million reasons to think Trump has something crooked in his past worse than anything Nixon or Spiro Agnew did. The first step to proving Trump is clean, innocent and wholesome is reading Trump’s income tax returns. The next step is a real investigation by Congress, not the fake one the Republicans are doing.
http://money.cnn.com/2017/01/18/news/trump-university-settlement-payme
nt
/
Quote:

Originally posted by DREAMTROVE:
Not the intention to be used to overthrow the president. I know it wasn't a democracy, but that's not really a due process, it's whining. Bear in mind that it has never happened, no vice president has been installed, etc. I don't know why you don't like Trump. I'm not sure there is a reason. I'm sure this approach doesn't get you anywhere. Support a candidate to run in 2020, or move somewhere with a world leader you like, or let it go.


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Sunday, April 9, 2017 9:13 PM

DREAMTROVE


It's like beating your head against a fence post.

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Sunday, April 9, 2017 11:21 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Quote:

Originally posted by DREAMTROVE:
It's like beating your head against a fence post.

And Nixon plus Spiro Agnew were noble, honest and patriotic heroes right up to the day that Republican Congressmen walked into their offices to tell them to either resign or else go to jail. I think what Barry Goldwater told Nixon was "Get the hell out of town, you creep."
https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Barry_Goldwater

Today's Republican leaders, Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan, are too weak and dishonest to tell a Nixon or an Agnew that it was all over. Trump is perfectly safe in the White House until McConnell and Ryan grow some balls.

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Monday, April 10, 2017 12:55 AM

6STRINGJOKER


As terrible a president as Obama was for 8 years I didn't bitch about him half as much as Second has in 3 months.

I did bitch about GWB a lot though.

Maybe I'm just getting lazy in my old age.

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Monday, April 10, 2017 7:36 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two


Quote:

Originally posted by 6STRINGJOKER:
As terrible a president as Obama was for 8 years I didn't bitch about him half as much as Second has in 3 months.

I did bitch about GWB a lot though.

Maybe I'm just getting lazy in my old age.

Why complain just because Trump’s past has more yet-to-be-investigated scandals than Obama and Bush and Bill Clinton and Nixon added together? Why complain just because Trump’s first hundred days have more mistakes and fewer accomplishments than any previous President?

My complaint about Bush would be that going to war with Iraq meant shouldering all the responsibilities of an occupying power the moment victory was achieved. These include running the economy, keeping domestic peace, and protecting Iraq's borders—and doing it all for years, or perhaps decades.
www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2002/11/the-fifty-first-state/302
612
/

Trump is on Bush’s road to making another Middle East country, Syria, the Fifty-First State of the USA. Trump added a new twist that Bush didn’t think of: a war with Russia over Syria. I do hope Congressional Republicans convince Trump not to start more wars with Islam.

Donald Trump Has Never Been an Isolationist
www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2017/04/donald-trump-has-never-been-iso
lationist


Here is Doyle McManus today:
Quote:

In some ways, the most remarkable thing about President Trump’s decision to fire missiles at Syria last week was how oddly traditional he made it sound. As he explained his reasons for military action, our normally unorthodox president borrowed a well-worn list of justifications from his predecessors: United Nations resolutions, international norms, compassion for civilians (in this case, “beautiful babies”), even the proposition that “America stands for justice.”

It was as if the Donald Trump who ran as an America First isolationist had suddenly morphed, once confronted with real-life choices, into an old-fashioned internationalist.

I've read quite a few versions of this, and I don't get it. Sure, Trump ran as American First, but that was mostly related to trade. When it came to military action, he didn't say much, but when he talked about Iraq and Syria his preferred solution was to "bomb the shit out of ISIS." In a primary debate, he suggested he might send 30,000 ground troops to Iraq. He described himself repeatedly as "the most militaristic person you'll ever meet." He wants to increase the Pentagon's budget by $54 billion, and he recently approved a multibillion arms deal for Bahrain. He hasn't yet approved a plan to arm the Kurds, but apparently Kurdish leaders are hopeful that this will change soon.

Donald Trump is no isolationist. He's a standard-issue hawkish, blustering Republican when it comes to war in the Middle East. There was absolutely nothing surprising about his cruise missile display against Syria, and nothing to suggest it represents a policy change of any kind. Why do so many people think otherwise?

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