REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Deep state. MSM. Trump ...

POSTED BY: SIGNYM
UPDATED: Wednesday, October 19, 2022 11:44
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Monday, March 19, 2018 9:28 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

The Deep State is Borgoroth, Sauron, The Slayer, yes, even The Alliance.
That's funny, because even Joss Whedon said that The Alliance was based on the US government!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Monday, March 19, 2018 10:06 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

The Deep State is Borgoroth, Sauron, The Slayer, yes, even The Alliance.
That's funny, because even Joss Whedon said that The Alliance was based on the US government!



That's perfect! The Alliance were a faceless menace just off screen, only referenced when the plot needed nudging just like the < echo > DEEP STATE < / echo > Essential for manipulation, er, I mean story telling 101. And they don't have to be paid any royalties! Wonder what the actor's guild has to say about that?

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Monday, March 19, 2018 12:02 PM

THGRRI


Deep state my muscular buttox.

T








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Monday, March 19, 2018 1:03 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


I know GEEBERS likes to poke fun at the idea that super rich people use their money to run the people who run the country. But I noticed that - AS USUAL - he has no information to bring to the table to back up his silliness. He likes to reference FICTION to do that !

Well, GEEBERS has ALWAYS had problems with the concept of evidence. And reality. And honesty.





So anyway ... anyone up for a rational, fact-based, and civil discussion about the topic?

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Monday, March 19, 2018 1:10 PM

THGRRI


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
I know GEEBERS likes to poke fun at the idea that super rich people use their money to run the people who run the country. But I noticed that - AS USUAL - he has no information to bring to the table to back up his silliness. He likes to reference FICTION !

Well, GEEBERS has ALWAYS had problems with the concept of evidence. And reality. And honesty.





Hey kiki your lawyer called. After looking at all the evidence she wants to represent me. So sad...


T

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Monday, March 19, 2018 1:46 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


It seems that THUGR and GSTRING are curiously out of step ...


Quote:

Public Troubled by ‘Deep State’
Monday, March 19, 2018

Bi-partisan concern that government is tracking U.S. citizens

West Long Branch, NJ – A majority of the American public believe that the U.S. government engages in widespread monitoring of its own citizens and worry that the U.S. government could be invading their own privacy. The Monmouth University Poll also finds a large bipartisan majority who feel that national policy is being manipulated or directed by a “Deep State” of unelected government officials. Americans of color on the center and left and NRA members on the right are among those most worried about the reach of government prying into average citizens’ lives.

Just over half of the public is either very worried (23%) or somewhat worried (30%) about the U.S. government monitoring their activities and invading their privacy. There are no significant partisan differences – 57% of independents, 51% of Republicans, and 50% of Democrats are at least somewhat worried the federal government is monitoring their activities. Another 24% of the American public are not too worried and 22% are not at all worried.

Fully 8-in-10 believe that the U.S. government currently monitors or spies on the activities of American citizens, including a majority (53%) who say this activity is widespread and another 29% who say such monitoring happens but is not widespread. Just 14% say this monitoring does not happen at all. There are no substantial partisan differences in these results.

“This is a worrisome finding. The strength of our government relies on public faith in protecting our freedoms, which is not particularly robust. And it’s not a Democratic or Republican issue. These concerns span the political spectrum,” said Patrick Murray, director of the independent Monmouth University Polling Institute.

MORE AT
https://www.monmouth.edu/polling-institute/reports/monmouthpoll_us_031
918
/

ORIGINALLY SOURCED FROM https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-03-19/74-americans-believe-deep-st
ate-running-country


(I do this for THUGR, who is too stupid or too lazy to click on embedded links...)

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Monday, March 19, 2018 2:22 PM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:

Well, GEEBERS has ALWAYS had problems with the concept of evidence. And reality. And honesty.




Speaking of honesty, reality, evidence and my problems... I am having this problem getting you to answer a very simple question: do you know what evidence Mueller has? Yes/No?
So why do you and JSF (and the rest of the Trump boot lickers association) say "still no evidence." Isn't that a dishonest, unreal statement given your lack of knowledge?

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Monday, March 19, 2018 5:21 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Speaking of honesty, reality, evidence and my problems... I am having this problem getting you to answer a very simple question: do you know what evidence Mueller has? Yes/No?

I'm just counting up how many times you misrepresent my post.




So anyway ... anyone up for a rational, fact-based, and civil discussion about the topic?

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Monday, March 19, 2018 5:27 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


So tell me GEEBERS how do you know all of this?
Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
I have no idea what Mueller knows and I don't presume to know what Mueller knows since November 9th of 2016.

Because not only do you pretend to know what Mueller knows, you pretend to know what other people think, and what they do, and what will happen in the future!

The endless fantasy brain that lives inside SIGNYM's skull. Making stuff up 24 hours a day ... that was the voices in your head feeding your hatred ... Suuuuure you did ... That slow drip drip is Mueller taking his time ... he slept with her, we all know it ... With his level of paranoia I wouldn't be surprised, OR he thinks his base is so stupid that they will believe that, OR both ... it feels so right that you have joined the Fox & Friends team ... I'll wait because I know it's going to just get better ... (Nobody from Team Trump?) Not yet - but - don't you see the reason for that? ... I love how Trump idiots can't even guess at the future of this ... (Mueller's) like a zen gardner ... Don Jr. - make sure you chant "no collusion" when they crack him like an egg ... how many Trump True Believers think there's no collusion because Mueller didn't release his findings within a week of being assigned. They don't seem to understand ...
"Could Donald J. Trump get a Top Secret background clearance?" Hell no. His financial records would be scanned with a fine tooth comb, so that for one would exclude him. ... There is a mountain of there there ... There are ways to find out what a legal body like Mueller's may be up to/is up to without it necessarily coming from someone inside. ...





So anyway ... anyone up for a rational, fact-based, and civil discussion about the topic?

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Monday, March 19, 2018 9:19 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by THGRRI:
Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
I know GEEBERS likes to poke fun at the idea that super rich people use their money to run the people who run the country. But I noticed that - AS USUAL - he has no information to bring to the table to back up his silliness. He likes to reference FICTION !

Well, GEEBERS has ALWAYS had problems with the concept of evidence. And reality. And honesty.





Hey kiki your lawyer called. After looking at all the evidence she wants to represent me. So sad...


T



Testing...


Crap. Putting an italics end tag in my signature doesn't fix T's broken posts.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Tuesday, March 20, 2018 1:04 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Testing...
Crap. Putting an italics end tag in my signature doesn't fix T's broken posts.
Do Right, Be Right. :)

really! let's see ....
Quote:

Originally posted by THGRRI:
H





So anyway ... anyone up for a rational, fact-based, and civil discussion about the topic?

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Tuesday, March 20, 2018 1:04 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


testing ...




So anyway ... anyone up for a rational, fact-based, and civil discussion about the topic?

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Tuesday, March 20, 2018 1:05 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


It works in the sig line for the next post down.




So anyway ... anyone up for a rational, fact-based, and civil discussion about the topic?

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Tuesday, March 20, 2018 3:53 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Misrepresentation......that's going around these days. That aside, CC does pose a valid question.


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Speaking of honesty, reality, evidence and my problems... I am having this problem getting you to answer a very simple question: do you know what evidence Mueller has? Yes/No?

I'm just counting up how many times you misrepresent my post.




So anyway ... anyone up for a rational, fact-based, and civil discussion about the topic?

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Tuesday, March 20, 2018 4:04 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Meeee!? Naaawwww! I'm really not that bright, but thanks for thinking it.


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
What I'm trying to understand is who exactly is the Deep State that these guys are so obsessed about. I want them to explain just who the players are; and what their agenda is.



Hey SGG: I think you know the answer.
The Deep State is Borgoroth, Sauron, The Slayer, yes, even The Alliance. They're the big bad that lurk in the shadows that can't be seen, as nasty to pin down as an egg shell in your bowl of cracked eggs. The shape shifters that can be shaped to fill any logic or plausibility gap, a writer's best friend, an enemy of the Truth. Just look at the sludge you have been given as an explanation. Sift through that slurry and you'll only find fool's gold my friend.

But I think you knew that!


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Tuesday, March 20, 2018 5:54 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


SHINY, I did respond to your post but it's on p 4.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Tuesday, March 20, 2018 7:46 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
It works in the sig line for the next post down.




So anyway ... anyone up for a rational, fact-based, and civil discussion about the topic?


Yeah. I don't know why I thought that might work. You'd be putting the closed italics before his open italics. I'm guessing that he manually adds that to his posts, or it's part of his signature along with the font color. He has the closed font color that I had to bitch about for a month before he fixed it. Let's see if he ever gets around to fixing the italics now.

Fucking rude.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Tuesday, March 20, 2018 8:51 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
So tell me GEEBERS how do you know all of this?
Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
I have no idea what Mueller knows and I don't presume to know what Mueller knows since November 9th of 2016.

Because not only do you pretend to know what Mueller knows, you pretend to know what other people think, and what they do, and what will happen in the future!

The endless fantasy brain that lives inside SIGNYM's skull. Making stuff up 24 hours a day ... that was the voices in your head feeding your hatred ... Suuuuure you did ... That slow drip drip is Mueller taking his time ... he slept with her, we all know it ... With his level of paranoia I wouldn't be surprised, OR he thinks his base is so stupid that they will believe that, OR both ... it feels so right that you have joined the Fox & Friends team ... I'll wait because I know it's going to just get better ... (Nobody from Team Trump?) Not yet - but - don't you see the reason for that? ... I love how Trump idiots can't even guess at the future of this ... (Mueller's) like a zen gardner ... Don Jr. - make sure you chant "no collusion" when they crack him like an egg ... how many Trump True Believers think there's no collusion because Mueller didn't release his findings within a week of being assigned. They don't seem to understand ...
"Could Donald J. Trump get a Top Secret background clearance?" Hell no. His financial records would be scanned with a fine tooth comb, so that for one would exclude him. ... There is a mountain of there there ... There are ways to find out what a legal body like Mueller's may be up to/is up to without it necessarily coming from someone inside. ...



Thanks for the quotes - I have to admit all of them are quite good, definitely worth a second reading.
I couldn't help but notice that not once did I suggest I KNOW WHAT MUELLER KNOWS in terms of evidence. In fact, it's like you just grabbed random quotes of mine - sloppy really. In the end it's actually evidence backing up my claim, so thanks for proving my point.

How about you KIKI ... do you know what Mueller knows?

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Tuesday, March 20, 2018 9:01 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Speaking of honesty, reality, evidence and my problems... I am having this problem getting you to answer a very simple question: do you know what evidence Mueller has? Yes/No?

I'm just counting up how many times you misrepresent my post.




Kiki deflecting from my question (one I have asked you for weeks, maybe even months, without answer) again and somewhat desperately.

But I'll indulge you because I know it will only show what a louse you are.

Here's your "misrepresented" post:

KIKI: "I know GEEBERS likes to poke fun at the idea that super rich people use their money to run the people who run the country."

Me: Sorry toots, have known about the ultra wealthy trying to buy their politics for ages, thought it was old news around here. Until you can bring EVIDENCE though, of specific individuals and/or groups of them working together in an organized cabal with specific political strategies then you're just blowing smoke to cover for something else. As I have corrected SIGNYM on many occasions, guessing isn't evidence. Neither is making 10,000 word pronouncements or copying someone else's what-aboutisms.
I poke fun because I find the attempts from people like you to use a form of the "deus ex machina" writing kludge to be laughably obvious. You either don't realize it or don't care - either way it's just another fiction as deflection at best.

KIKI: But I noticed that - AS USUAL - he has no information to bring to the table to back up his silliness. He likes to reference FICTION to do that!

Me: You should read my posts instead of grabbing half sentence quotes - mountains of information.

KIKI: "Well, GEEBERS has ALWAYS had problems with the concept of evidence. And reality. And honesty."

Me: So I addressed evidence, reality and honesty -check

Your turn: Do you know what Mueller knows?

You going to dodge again, or be honest?

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 3:54 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Yes, I saw Siggy....no worries. Now, I'll need a little time to respond.


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
SHINY, I did respond to your post but it's on p 4.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876


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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 4:33 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


I think you know the answer to that....no one knows. I would not ever play Poker with that man; he keeps EVERYTHING close to the vest. No tells, that I can see.

Trouble is everyone and their mother is trying to figure out what he knows; and we hear about it on a daily basis, much to my chagrin because there's so much news that needs to have a spotlight. Anyway, we could speculate like the rest, but it will get us nowhere.

One thing is certain, people in the White House are getting nervous. So much so that somewhat irrational, at least that's what Trump and company want us thinking, behavior is the thought of the day. Now that speaks volumes. Rather peculiar behavior for someone who claims innocence. Still though, we can't jump the gun. Let Mueller and company run it's course because passing judgment at this point is premature.

Shakespeare spoke of this thusly:

Quote:

"Will all great Neptune's ocean wash this blood clean from my hand?
No, this my hand will rather
The multitudinous seas incarnadine, making the green one red"



-Hearing a knocking at his palace gate, Macbeth fears that he can never wash away the evidence of his guilt.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

A bit of a stretch, I know, but I thought I would end this response with class.


SGG









Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Speaking of honesty, reality, evidence and my problems... I am having this problem getting you to answer a very simple question: do you know what evidence Mueller has? Yes/No?

I'm just counting up how many times you misrepresent my post.




Kiki deflecting from my question (one I have asked you for weeks, maybe even months, without answer) again and somewhat desperately.

But I'll indulge you because I know it will only show what a louse you are.

Here's your "misrepresented" post:

KIKI: "I know GEEBERS likes to poke fun at the idea that super rich people use their money to run the people who run the country."

Me: Sorry toots, have known about the ultra wealthy trying to buy their politics for ages, thought it was old news around here. Until you can bring EVIDENCE though, of specific individuals and/or groups of them working together in an organized cabal with specific political strategies then you're just blowing smoke to cover for something else. As I have corrected SIGNYM on many occasions, guessing isn't evidence. Neither is making 10,000 word pronouncements or copying someone else's what-aboutisms.
I poke fun because I find the attempts from people like you to use a form of the "deus ex machina" writing kludge to be laughably obvious. You either don't realize it or don't care - either way it's just another fiction as deflection at best.

KIKI: But I noticed that - AS USUAL - he has no information to bring to the table to back up his silliness. He likes to reference FICTION to do that!

Me: You should read my posts instead of grabbing half sentence quotes - mountains of information.

KIKI: "Well, GEEBERS has ALWAYS had problems with the concept of evidence. And reality. And honesty."

Me: So I addressed evidence, reality and honesty -check

Your turn: Do you know what Mueller knows?

You going to dodge again, or be honest?


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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 4:35 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


I got a giggle out of it.

SGG

Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

The Deep State is Borgoroth, Sauron, The Slayer, yes, even The Alliance.
That's funny, because even Joss Whedon said that The Alliance was based on the US government!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876


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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 5:27 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:

One thing is certain, people in the White House are getting nervous. So much so that somewhat irrational, at least that's what Trump and company want us thinking, behavior is the thought of the day. Now that speaks volumes. Rather peculiar behavior for someone who claims innocence. Still though, we can't jump the gun. Let Mueller and company run it's course because passing judgment at this point is premature.

Mueller is working at the slow speed set by the Federal Courts and Federal elections. If Mueller finishes too quickly and his evidence gathering isn't perfect, his entire investigation would have been pointless because either the GOP Congress will threw his report in the trash or the crooks will be reelected. But I don't have to be slow as Mueller to decide if Trump was colluding with Putin. One data point is enough for me:

Trump did not follow specific warnings from his national security advisers Tuesday when he congratulated Russian President Vladi­mir Putin on his reelection — including a section in his briefing materials in all-capital letters stating “DO NOT CONGRATULATE,” according to officials familiar with the call…..It was not clear whether Trump read the notes, administration officials said. Trump, who initiated the call, opened it with the congratulations for Putin, one person familiar with the conversation said.

I’m sure we’re all glad to know that it’s henceforth official US policy to congratulate autocrats for winning rigged elections. That’s making America great again.

Quote of the Day: “Nice Work, Vlad”
www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2018/03/quote-of-the-day-nice-work-vlad/

I suppose most Republicans would need a recorded Trump/Putin phone call about money transfers between Trump/Putin secret bank accounts before they would change their minds about Trump. Even that might not make any difference to their love of him. Trump has magnanimously donated his $400,000 salary to charity, but he does deserve Russian billions for his hard work. www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/trumpometer/promise/1341/tak
e-no-salary
/

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 5:54 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Herez your cheif Deep State story teller in action:



Wuzzup with this 'bought & paid for' fraze that iz so popular in the eko chamber? Iz there sum way uv buying stuff without paying for it that requirez them to add the 'paid for' part?


----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.7532020.com

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 7:47 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Yanno, I know I'm going to take a lot of flak for this, but I do have to say: YOU guys have gone full retard about Russia.

In my reading of Russia, UNLIKE US, THE UNITED STATES, everything Russia has done has been defensive. The biggest threat to world peace and stability has not been Russia, but the USA, and the only reason why you're now hyperventilating and paranoid is because one nation has decided to fight back against American hegemony and the crush of the "unipolar moment". You wouldn't be taking this ridiculous stance if you have an objective reading of the last 50 years, a modicum of respect for the interests of other nations, a view of the USA as a "nation among nations" and not (somehow) the "world police", and especially if you spent some time thinking about our ACTUAL interests and the threats to those interests, instead of following every (ahem) red herring that's dragged in front of your noses. I only mention this in the Deep State thread because you guys slavishly follow the deep state line, despite it being totally antithetical to you, to your freedom, and to the economic interests of you and your children.

I love my country (the USA) and despite the egregious violence that WE have visited on the world since WWII, "intervening" in dozens and dozens of nations, sometimes multiple times and killing millions of people in the process ... Indonesia, Philippines, Iran, Chile, Brazil, Nicaragua, Honduras, Colombia, El Salvador, Panama (in fact, every nation in S and Central America except Costa Rica), Sudan, Ethiopia, Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Yemen, Pakistan, Sudan ... to no good end, as far as I can tell ... it pains me greatly to see us be so evil and waste so much money while doing it, and to see that none of you have drawn a single lesson from history about the absolute corruption of absolute power.


-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 9:32 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Yanno, I know I'm going to take a lot of flak for this, but I do have to say: YOU guys have gone full retard about Russia.

In my reading of Russia, UNLIKE US, THE UNITED STATES, everything Russia has done has been defensive. The biggest threat to world peace and stability has not been Russia, but the USA, and the only reason why you're now hyperventilating and paranoid is because one nation has decided to fight back against American hegemony and the crush of the "unipolar moment". You wouldn't be taking this ridiculous stance if you have an objective reading of the last 50 years, a modicum of respect for the interests of other nations, a view of the USA as a "nation among nations" and not (somehow) the "world police", and especially if you spent some time thinking about our ACTUAL interests and the threats to those interests, instead of following every (ahem) red herring that's dragged in front of your noses. I only mention this in the Deep State thread because you guys slavishly follow the deep state line, despite it being totally antithetical to you, to your freedom, and to the economic interests of you and your children.

I love my country (the USA) and despite the egregious violence that WE have visited on the world since WWII, "intervening" in dozens and dozens of nations, sometimes multiple times and killing millions of people in the process ... Indonesia, Philippines, Iran, Chile, Brazil, Nicaragua, Honduras, Colombia, El Salvador, Panama (in fact, every nation in S and Central America except Costa Rica), Sudan, Ethiopia, Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Yemen, Pakistan, Sudan ... to no good end, as far as I can tell ... it pains me greatly to see us be so evil and waste so much money while doing it, and to see that none of you have drawn a single lesson from history about the absolute corruption of absolute power.

Signym, with even the slightest, flimsiest justification, Americans willing support the stupid wars you mentioned. With that kind of solid American support for the troops, the Pentagon can go wherever and do whatever to whoever. The Pentagon certainly gets the money every year for the stupid wars and I don't see tax protestors with signs saying "Don't Spend MY Money On YOUR War!"

I was around for the Vietnam War. Texans (80 to 90%) were for kicking the hell out of Commies in North Vietnam. They knew all about the South Vietnamese being killed by American troops, said they didn't believe it, but truthfully they did not care who got killed. Didn't bother Texans more than a little bit that Marines were murdering civilians on our side. The situation looked as absurd as in WWII if American planes were bombing Germany, Scotland, Wales, and Ireland with the justification that there might be German infiltrators everywhere. Americans went so crazy in love with killing toward the end of WWII that a majority approved of nuking children. Even today, the majority of Americans (but not all) are still, after so many failed wars, completely crazy in love with killing foreigners. And that is why America has a crazy foreign policy. Americans support the troops, regardless of who they kill.
"How Congress Got Us Out of Vietnam"
http://prospect.org/article/how-congress-got-us-out-vietnam

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 10:08 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by JO753:
Herez your cheif Deep State story teller in action:

Wuzzup with this 'bought & paid for' fraze that iz so popular in the eko chamber? Iz there sum way uv buying stuff without paying for it that requirez them to add the 'paid for' part?


----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.7532020.com



He's not the chief of anything. I don't watch FOX News and never have. I might have heard an hours worth of words out of this man in my entire life, and that includes whenever he might have been talked about by somebody else.

The Deep State was around long before Hannity was a thing. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if he were actually deep state friendly himself, whether wittingly or unwittingly.

What I'm saying is, though I don't know what ridiculous amount of money he gets paid per year, I know it's many, many more times than what he is worth. It would make sense to have somebody like him talk about the Deep State. He's a figurehead of the "beast" that is FOX News, and therefore everything he has to say is dismissed by anybody who watches Rachel Maddow everyday.

If I were a part of the deep state, I'd have Hannity talking about us everyday if I didn't already have Maddow doing it.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 10:41 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Lt. Col. Ralph Peters is a warmonger’s warmonger. As such, he fits in perfectly as a commentator on Fox News. But he’s finally decided he’s had enough of this talk of Deep State and has decided to leave the network. Here’s his email explaining his resignation: www.buzzfeed.com/tomnamako/ralph-peters

Over my decade with Fox, I long was proud of the association. Now I am ashamed. In my view, Fox has degenerated from providing a legitimate and much-needed outlet for conservative voices to a mere propaganda machine for a destructive and ethically ruinous administration. When prime-time hosts—who have never served our country in any capacity—dismiss facts and empirical reality to launch profoundly dishonest assaults on the FBI, the Justice Department, the courts, the intelligence community (in which I served) and, not least, a model public servant and genuine war hero such as Robert Mueller—all the while scaremongering with lurid warnings of “deep-state” machinations—I cannot be part of the same organization, even at a remove. To me, Fox News is now wittingly harming our system of government for profit.

As a Russia analyst for many years, it also has appalled me that hosts who made their reputations as super-patriots and who, justifiably, savaged President Obama for his duplicitous folly with Putin, now advance Putin’s agenda by making light of Russian penetration of our elections and the Trump campaign. Despite increasingly pathetic denials, it turns out that the “nothing-burger” has been covered with Russian dressing all along. And by the way: As an intelligence professional, I can tell you that the Steele dossier rings true—that’s how the Russians do things. The result is that we have an American president who is terrified of his counterpart in Moscow.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 11:19 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


lol buzzfeed



Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 11:26 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Signym, with even the slightest, flimsiest justification, Americans willing support the stupid wars you mentioned ... I was around for the Vietnam War. Texans (80 to 90%) were for kicking the hell out of Commies in North Vietnam. - SECOND
Then why are YOU making the same mistake now, with Russia?

And just OOC, how did YOU feel about our invasions of Panama, Grenada, Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, Iraq, and Libya, our occupation of Lebanon, and our attempted destruction of Syria? Please, don't tell me about "texans".

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 11:27 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM: ... it pains me greatly to see us be so evil and waste so much money while doing it, and to see that none of you have drawn a single lesson from history about the absolute corruption of absolute power.


So we DO agree about Puttie and absolute power and absolute corruption!

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 11:31 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM: ... it pains me greatly to see us be so evil and waste so much money while doing it, and to see that none of you have drawn a single lesson from history about the absolute corruption of absolute power.


So we DO agree about Puttie and absolute power and absolute corruption!



I don't give a rat's ass about Putin. The only time I pay attention to what Russia does is when it might affect OUR essential interests, and so far, that hasn't happened.

Russia doesn't have 1000 military installations all over the world, and Russia's military budget doesn't hold a candle to ours. Boy, are YOU a corrupt deep-state supporter!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 11:57 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

I don't give a rat's ass about Putin. The only time I pay attention to what Russia does is when it might affect OUR essential interests, and so far, that hasn't happened.



You so funny! You owe me a keyboard!

Say more funny things about how you don't care about Russia!

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 12:04 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

I don't give a rat's ass about Putin. The only time I pay attention to what Russia does is when it might affect OUR essential interests, and so far, that hasn't happened. Russia doesn't have 1000 military installations all over the world, and Russia's military budget doesn't hold a candle to ours. Boy, are YOU a corrupt deep-state supporter!
- SIGNY

You so funny! You owe me a keyboard!
Say more funny things about how you don't care about Russia!- GSTRING



Ah yes, another diversion. I see you're back in "GSTRING" mode.

Show me where and how Russia has threatened OUR essential interests. I'll bet you that you can't.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 12:19 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


It does seem as though to some people the word "Russia" is the argument in and of itself, doesn't it?

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 12:39 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

Signym, with even the slightest, flimsiest justification, Americans willing support the stupid wars you mentioned ... I was around for the Vietnam War. Texans (80 to 90%) were for kicking the hell out of Commies in North Vietnam. - SECOND
Then why are YOU making the same mistake now, with Russia?

And just OOC, how did YOU feel about our invasions of Panama, Grenada, Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, Iraq, and Libya, our occupation of Lebanon, and our attempted destruction of Syria? Please, don't tell me about "texans".

How do I feel? I was once a soldier for Uncle Sam. Long story involving a helicopter crash, but I became anti-war. I'm pretty sure smarter people than me could be anti-war without volunteering or becoming a casualty. But most Americans, even soldiers, don't want to know or think. It is too uncomfortable to realize your country is wasting its time and money in wars. That does not make me a friend of Russia. It is dangerous because it is too much like America.

I am certain that a majority of Americans are indifferent to killing non-Americans. Like slaughtering cattle for beef, most Americans won’t do the messy, bloody work themselves, but they will pay butchers to do it for them. They patriotically pay their American troops, people like me, to slaughter foreigners for freedom, which is better than beef. If, big if, a majority of Russians are as indifferent to killing non-Russians, that would explain the off and on hostility between America and Russia. It would be sad for the world if a majority of Russians believe like Americans that foreigners are cheap and expendable life, like cattle, pigs, and chickens. Americans are squeamish about killing mostly when it is done in R-rated fashion in front of them. When done for entertainment (Firefly) or patriotism, Americans approve of killing.
www.foodispower.org/slaughterhouse-workers

I saw: "I’m a Russian scientist. Why can’t Americans see past my citizenship?"
https://massivesci.com/articles/russia-scientists-research-trust-ameri
ca
/
Quote:

In my adopted home, I’ve found distrust divorced from the reality of my work. . . . From colleagues to taxi drivers, I am subject to a steady barrage of comments. They usually come as jokes: was it I who hacked the DNC? Do I know Putin? Can I tamper with some doping probes? . . . But even if I don’t take their curiosity personally, those jokes underscore the bigger problem that’s underneath: lack of trust and subtle hostility. With the newly intensified interest in Russian affairs, I feel that people increasingly tend to equate the word “Russian” with corruption, online trolling, human rights violations, and “fake news.” . . . Views of Russia in the US and Canada are overwhelmingly negative (and were even before the news about the indictments and election meddling surfaced).

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 1:50 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


I didn't post that Mueller had no evidence. Try to keep up.
Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
Misrepresentation......that's going around these days. That aside, CC does pose a valid question.


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Speaking of honesty, reality, evidence and my problems... I am having this problem getting you to answer a very simple question: do you know what evidence Mueller has? Yes/No?

I'm just counting up how many times you misrepresent my post.




So anyway ... anyone up for a rational, fact-based, and civil discussion about the topic?






So anyway ... anyone up for a rational, fact-based, and civil discussion about the topic?

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 2:40 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

How do I feel? I was once a soldier for Uncle Sam. Long story involving a helicopter crash, but I became anti-war. I'm pretty sure smarter people than me could be anti-war without volunteering or becoming a casualty. But most Americans, even soldiers, don't want to know or think.
No wonder you're pissed off. But I think people get stampeded. Right before the second invasion of Iraq, most people were "for" because they had been convinced (by the WH, and the complicit media, esp the NYT) that Saddam has WMD, and they were absolutely mesmerized by the threat. NOW, most people realize that it was a waste.

Quote:

It is too uncomfortable to realize your country is wasting its time and money in wars.
It is too uncomfortable to realize that our fearless leaders are corrupt quislings who will send soldiers to die for the petrodollar, or for nothing, and that our media lies to us day and night.

Quote:

That does not make me a friend of Russia. It is dangerous because it is too much like America.- SECOND
First, I disagree that it is "too much like America". Most Americans make the mistake of thinking that other places are just like them, that other nations have the same kinds of goals (worldwide dominance) and that other people react with the same motivations. Again, my reading of Russia is that is that their actions have been defensive in nature. It's not necessary to be a "friend" of Russia to get an objective reading of their actions and intentions. It's a good idea not to be stampeded ... AGAIN ... into thinking that someone is our mortal enemy when they aren't.

Also, Russia's military budget is less than the military budget INCREASE proposed by Trump, so Russia's reach is necessarily far more limited than ours.

Quote:

I am certain that a majority of Americans are indifferent to killing non-Americans. Like slaughtering cattle for beef, most Americans won’t do the messy, bloody work themselves, but they will pay butchers to do it for them. They patriotically pay their American troops, people like me, to slaughter foreigners for freedom, which is better than beef.
Like I said: No wonder you're pissed off. You and your fellow soldiers are thrown into a meat-grinder to save the rest of us Americans from having to wonder if we really are "good people", or not.

Quote:

If, big if, a majority of Russians are as indifferent to killing non-Russians, that would explain the off and on hostility between America and Russia. It would be sad for the world if a majority of Russians believe like Americans that foreigners are cheap and expendable life, like cattle, pigs, and chickens. Americans are squeamish about killing mostly when it is done in R-rated fashion in front of them. When done for entertainment (Firefly) or patriotism, Americans approve of killing.
I think Americans have exceptional reactions because they believe themselves, at heart, to be an exceptional people and morally righteous. In this board, it is rare to find anyone who consistently applies the same rules in all directions. WISHY is all hot to trot about prejudice against women and POC, but grants Antifa the right to act with impunity against while males. THUGR is such a strong believer of "freedom" in Russia that he would allow a surveillance state and restrict freedom of speech here at home. GSTRING claims to have the interests of people at heart, but constantly overlooks the massive human rights violations committed by the USA in favor of focusing on someplace far away, over which he has no control.

It's not just a matter of ethical and intellectual rigor, altho that helps. People here really don't see others "over there" as people; there's no emotional connection. They only ally themselves with people that are ideologically convenient, so they can protect that narrative that they're "good people'.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 4:39 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Sum disjointed comments on the above posts:

Wen you aksept the Strongest Gang perspectiv, everything makes sens.

Aksept the idea that America iz the strongest gang in the world, and you realize that maintaining that pozition, even tho its expensiv, iz better than letting sum other gang take the title. Especially a gang with a worse manajment structure.

Anybody who thinks that letting despots do az they want in the world wont eventually bekum a problem for the US haz a poor grasp uv their predatory nature.

Look wut happened with Russia. A failed state taken over by an oportunistic strongman. Now he haz control uv our goverment and iz furiously working hiz puppet to consolidate that power.

A dictatorship iz inherently more effectiv, efficient and faster than a democrasy. Like a bull vs a couger, the massiv weight advantaj and hornz only delay defeat.

Suppoze the CIA had taken a longer view wen Gorbachev threw in the towel and launched a seksessful campane to take over Russia or turn it into a real democrasy? 'A stich in time savez 9,000,000.'

Hannity made 37,000,000$ last yir. In spite uv your claimz uv ignoring him, 6string, he iz worth every penny bekuz hiz messij saturated the Nation so well that it got to you anyway.

America iz a virtual oligarky due to money controlling the politicianz. There appearz to be a growing backlash agenst this wile at the same time its getting wors. 2 billionairez will be slugging it out in November for the governorship uv Illinois. More than 130,000,000$ wuz spent in the primariez alone for a job that payz 177,412$. Wy do you think billionairez are so interested in grabbing this relatively powerless pozition?

Col Ralf Peterz iz a chowderhed. How duz he think Trump got anywhere near The Oval Offis? He helped Fox corral and nurture the idiots uv America into the voter army that TrumPutin carjacked!

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.7532020.com

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Wednesday, March 21, 2018 4:47 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by JO753:


Hannity made 37,000,000$ last yir. In spite uv your claimz uv ignoring him, 6string, he iz worth every penny bekuz hiz messij saturated the Nation so well that it got to you anyway.



Maddow made 7,000,000 last year. Forbes named her the most powerful person in cable news on June 6th of 2017. She's worth every penny because her message saturated the Nation so well that it got to me anyway.



You entirely missed my point anyhow. My point was that if I was the Deep State, I would have EITHER ONE OF THEM talking endlessly about me. Right away that means that half of the country is going to dismiss it as partisan bullshit. It doesn't matter which side, really.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Thursday, March 22, 2018 1:59 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


We belong to the court of public opinion Second, and we don't have much effect when it comes to our resident Destroyer in Chief. Whoa, there I go again, shooting my mouth off. But this is what it is all about, donating our thoughts to the general milieu. No fault in that. We, as a people, have the right, you know as Americans. It's Constitutionally protected.

But, in a country that values the rule of law, we must await the results of the Special Counsel's investigation, better known as the Witch Hunt. Mueller's appointment marks the second time in our recent history (I never thought I would live to see the likes of this again) that we face a crisis in decency and democracy all rolled into one giant crap-ball. We have a representative, as the leader of the country, who goes around saying (like the cheating husband to his wife) "Are you going to believe me or your lying eyes."

(The above example is in no way a commentary on the life and times of Mr. Trump, but if the shoe fits...)

That one data point you mention may very well be the thing that's enough for most:
DO NOT CONGRATULATE, you would think, would not have to be pointed out to a "normal" leader of the free world. I'm talking about a person using common sense and NOT doing what it has been claimed he did, which is to call and deliberately offer congratulations to a Mafia boss 1) after have taken revenge against a former Russian agent, and 2) Having his political opponents effectively eliminated.
Exactly what a dictator would do to ensure his continued march towards total dominance.

Sometimes I think we're watching a tense spy-thriller movie. No, this is real life.

Quote:

I’m sure we’re all glad to know that it’s henceforth official US policy to congratulate autocrats for winning rigged elections. That’s making America great again.


I agree.....with everything you posit.

Mueller is slowly gathering credible evidence, I'm assuming. If not, this has been a complete and utter waste of time. Somehow, from all I've researched on the man, I don't think that the above is so. Mueller is NOT wasting his time. He is taking his time, and I believe it's the way to go. Meanwhile, we continue with our contributions to the court of public opinion. It is all we can do, for the moment.


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:

One thing is certain, people in the White House are getting nervous. So much so that somewhat irrational, at least that's what Trump and company want us thinking, behavior is the thought of the day. Now that speaks volumes. Rather peculiar behavior for someone who claims innocence. Still though, we can't jump the gun. Let Mueller and company run it's course because passing judgment at this point is premature.

Mueller is working at the slow speed set by the Federal Courts and Federal elections. If Mueller finishes too quickly and his evidence gathering isn't perfect, his entire investigation would have been pointless because either the GOP Congress will threw his report in the trash or the crooks will be reelected. But I don't have to be slow as Mueller to decide if Trump was colluding with Putin. One data point is enough for me:

Trump did not follow specific warnings from his national security advisers Tuesday when he congratulated Russian President Vladi­mir Putin on his reelection — including a section in his briefing materials in all-capital letters stating “DO NOT CONGRATULATE,” according to officials familiar with the call…..It was not clear whether Trump read the notes, administration officials said. Trump, who initiated the call, opened it with the congratulations for Putin, one person familiar with the conversation said.

I’m sure we’re all glad to know that it’s henceforth official US policy to congratulate autocrats for winning rigged elections. That’s making America great again.

Quote of the Day: “Nice Work, Vlad”
www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2018/03/quote-of-the-day-nice-work-vlad/

I suppose most Republicans would need a recorded Trump/Putin phone call about money transfers between Trump/Putin secret bank accounts before they would change their minds about Trump. Even that might not make any difference to their love of him. Trump has magnanimously donated his $400,000 salary to charity, but he does deserve Russian billions for his hard work. www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/trumpometer/promise/1341/tak
e-no-salary
/


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Thursday, March 22, 2018 2:09 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Acerbic as usual. But why would CC ask the question again, if, as you claim, you previously responded.

Never mind. I withdraw the question.


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
I didn't post that Mueller had no evidence. Try to keep up.
Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
Misrepresentation......that's going around these days. That aside, CC does pose a valid question.


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Speaking of honesty, reality, evidence and my problems... I am having this problem getting you to answer a very simple question: do you know what evidence Mueller has? Yes/No?

I'm just counting up how many times you misrepresent my post.




So anyway ... anyone up for a rational, fact-based, and civil discussion about the topic?






So anyway ... anyone up for a rational, fact-based, and civil discussion about the topic?

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Thursday, March 22, 2018 2:17 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


This guy is such a low scumbag snake and isn't worth a moment's time. Fuck him and the donkey he rode in on. Respectfully.


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by JO753:
Herez your cheif Deep State story teller in action:



Wuzzup with this 'bought & paid for' fraze that iz so popular in the eko chamber? Iz there sum way uv buying stuff without paying for it that requirez them to add the 'paid for' part?


----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.7532020.com


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Thursday, March 22, 2018 8:15 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

I think Americans have exceptional reactions because they believe themselves, at heart, to be an exceptional people and morally righteous. In this board, it is rare to find anyone who consistently applies the same rules in all directions. WISHY is all hot to trot about prejudice against women and POC, but grants Antifa the right to act with impunity against while males. THUGR is such a strong believer of "freedom" in Russia that he would allow a surveillance state and restrict freedom of speech here at home. GSTRING claims to have the interests of people at heart, but constantly overlooks the massive human rights violations committed by the USA in favor of focusing on someplace far away, over which he has no control.

It's not just a matter of ethical and intellectual rigor, altho that helps. People here really don't see others "over there" as people; there's no emotional connection. They only ally themselves with people that are ideologically convenient, so they can protect that narrative that they're "good people'.

I do a certain amount of calculation, but I look at different numbers than most Americans. For a famous example where my calculation differed from the majority of Americans: Americans turned against the Iraq War because of this number: 4,540
That is the Iraq Coalition's US Military Fatalities
http://icasualties.org/

American fatalities increased slowly. As that number got bigger, more Americans changed their opinion. Once the number got big enough, enough Americans had flipped to opposing the Iraq War. Only then did the war lose some power in minds of Congressmen. The typical Congressman would have never voluntarily changed his mind from his first vote approving the war, but voters forcefully changed his mind for him.

Americans did NOT turn against the Iraq War because of this number: 1,455,590
That is the estimated Iraqi Deaths due to U S. Invasion.
www.justforeignpolicy.org/iraq

No matter how big the Iraqi fatalities, it might just as well be zero from the beginning to the end of the war. The number never made it into most American’s calculation of when to stop supporting the war.

The thinking of most Americans about foreign policy has always been the same as during the Iraq War. Deaths of Americans are the only real number. Deaths of foreigners? It is always zero, at least in the minds of a majority of Americans. (As another famous example: Japan would not have been nuked and firebombed if most Americans had cared about children in general. But they really don't. America and Russia would not have built 50,000 atom bombs per country if they cared about children, but they really don't, except their own child.) Congress and the President can do as they please, making as much money as possible and having the most fun in their lives being big shots making life and death decisions, for as long as the American deaths don't get too large to be ignored by the American voters.

More sophisticated people than Congressmen had larger reasons than I did for not supporting the Iraq War:
www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2002/11/the-fifty-first-state/302
612
/
Quote:

Going to war with Iraq would mean shouldering all the responsibilities of an occupying power the moment victory was achieved. These would include running the economy, keeping domestic peace, and protecting Iraq's borders
Iraq war could cost US over $2 trillion, says Nobel prize-winning economist
www.theguardian.com/world/2006/jan/07/usa.iraq

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Thursday, March 22, 2018 9:20 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

I think Americans have exceptional reactions because they believe themselves, at heart, to be an exceptional people and morally righteous. In this board, it is rare to find anyone who consistently applies the same rules in all directions. WISHY is all hot to trot about prejudice against women and POC, but grants Antifa the right to act with impunity against while males. THUGR is such a strong believer of "freedom" in Russia that he would allow a surveillance state and restrict freedom of speech here at home. GSTRING claims to have the interests of people at heart, but constantly overlooks the massive human rights violations committed by the USA in favor of focusing on someplace far away, over which he has no control.

It's not just a matter of ethical and intellectual rigor, altho that helps. People here really don't see others "over there" as people; there's no emotional connection. They only ally themselves with people that are ideologically convenient, so they can protect that narrative that they're "good people'. - SIGNY

I do a certain amount of calculation, but I look at different numbers than most Americans. For a famous example where my calculation differed from the majority of Americans: Americans turned against the Iraq War because of this number: 4,540
That is the Iraq Coalition's US Military Fatalities
http://icasualties.org/

American fatalities increased slowly. As that number got bigger, more Americans changed their opinion. Once the number got big enough, enough Americans had flipped to opposing the Iraq War. Only then did the war lose some power in minds of Congressmen.- SECOND

Agreed. But, in addition to the number of fatalities ... which Bush cynically tried to cover up by having American bodies delivered under cover of darkness ... there was the ongoing investigation which DIDN'T find WMD that so many people were frantic about before the war.

Quote:

The typical Congressman would have never voluntarily changed his mind from his first vote approving the war, but voters forcefully changed his mind for him.- SECOND
So, the voting public DOES make a difference, in your view?

Quote:

Americans did NOT turn against the Iraq War because of this number: 1,455,590
That is the estimated Iraqi Deaths due to U S. Invasion. No matter how big the Iraqi fatalities, it might just as well be zero from the beginning to the end of the war. The number never made it into most American’s calculation of when to stop supporting the war.- SECOND

Agreed. They only care about who the media tells them to care about, and only as long as the media reminds them to care: The hurricane victims, the mass shooting victims ... But the next news cycle? POOF! The victims are gone!

Quote:

The thinking of most Americans about foreign policy has always been the same as during the Iraq War. Deaths of Americans are the only real number. Deaths of foreigners? It is always zero, at least in the minds of a majority of Americans.- SECOND
Except the poor White Helmets, the poor Russian journalists, the poor illegal immigrants ... But those millions of people that the media ignores? You're right: they may as well be zero.

One place where Americans are exceptional is that Americans are exceptionally vulnerable to propaganda. Their memories last only as long as the media reminds them.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Thursday, March 22, 2018 9:36 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

This guy is such a low scumbag snake and isn't worth a moment's time. Fuck him and the donkey he rode in on. Respectfully. - SHINY


I've never listened to Hannity before now, but I would treat him the same way I'd treat any other: Is what he says TRUE? Can it be verified? Or are you just pissed off because he threatens your ideology?

Also, you may recall that Glenn Greenwald ... famous left-wing investigative journalist ... was the initial video in the thread, and HE was talking about the deep state. Is HE full of shit too? Is everyone full of shit except you?



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Thursday, March 22, 2018 9:49 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


And finally ...

Quote:

Originally posted by JO753:
Sum disjointed comments on the above posts:

Wen you aksept the Strongest Gang perspectiv, everything makes sens.

Unless the perspective itself is wrong, and then NOTHING makes sense.

Quote:

Aksept the idea that America iz the strongest gang in the world, and you realize that maintaining that pozition, even tho its expensiv, iz better than letting sum other gang take the title.
Why? What would happen if "someone else" [MOST LIKELY CHINA] took that position? Be specific.

Quote:

Especially a gang with a worse manajment structure.
So? Don't let them "manage" you and you'll be alright.

Quote:

Anybody who thinks that letting despots do az they want in the world wont eventually bekum a problem for the US haz a poor grasp uv their predatory nature.
Such as? Be specific.

Quote:

Look wut happened with Russia. A failed state taken over by an oportunistic strongman. Now he [PUTIN] haz control uv our goverment and iz furiously working hiz puppet to consolidate that power.
Wow, JO and his unsupported delusion, again!

Quote:

A dictatorship iz inherently more effectiv, efficient and faster than a democrasy. Like a bull vs a couger, the massiv weight advantaj and hornz only delay defeat.
The United States has such a diversity of resources that - properly managed- we can withstand just about every pressure applied to us. The only thing that we lack is some strategic metals like tantalum and cobalt.

Quote:

Suppoze the CIA had taken a longer view wen Gorbachev threw in the towel and launched a seksessful campane to take over Russia or turn it into a real democrasy? 'A stich in time savez 9,000,000.
OH, THEY TRIED! Don't you remember the "shock treatment" that was applied to Russia, which caused the GDP to drop 25% and the reduced the male lifespan by 10 years?

Quote:

Hannity made 37,000,000$ last yir. In spite uv your claimz uv ignoring him, 6string, he iz worth every penny bekuz hiz messij saturated the Nation so well that it got to you anyway.
Why does it make any difference how much Hannity made?

Quote:

America iz a virtual oligarky due to money controlling the politicianz. There appearz to be a growing backlash agenst this wile at the same time its getting wors. 2 billionairez will be slugging it out in November for the governorship uv Illinois. More than 130,000,000$ wuz spent in the primariez alone for a job that payz 177,412$. Wy do you think billionairez are so interested in grabbing this relatively powerless pozition?

Col Ralf Peterz iz a chowderhed. How duz he think Trump got anywhere near The Oval Offis? He helped Fox corral and nurture the idiots uv America into the voter army that TrumPutin carjacked!

Yanno, JO, when you stop obsessing about RUSSIA!!! you actually make some sense. For example, how can you say that we're an oligarchy controlled by the moneyed, and at the same time say that Putin is controlling us?

Ditch the delusion, you'll do a lot better.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Thursday, March 22, 2018 10:12 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
Acerbic as usual. But why would CC ask the question again, if, as you claim, you previously responded.
Never mind. I withdraw the question.



fwiw:

KIKI: "And yet ... Mueller hasn't found Trump 'colluding' with Russians."

http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=62243&mid=1
047428#1047428


Which started the whole, "how do you know what Mueller knows?" question and silent denial parade.

@SGG - pretty silly really because everyone knows that no one on this board knows what Mueller knows - fun to see them make such lame statements though. Just like their BFF, 'Rump pounding a table and claiming "No Collusion! No Collusion!" over and over.

Here's a question for you SGG: why do you think so many people, whether politicians or pundits or regular dumb @ss citizens, grovel so much at this fat a-hole's feet? Do they hope to catch some table scraps? Is it like some kind of messiah worship where common sense and morality are obscured by obsession? Curious.

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Thursday, March 22, 2018 12:13 PM

THGRRI


President Trump’s lawyer John Dowd has confirmed with NBC News that his resigning. NBC’s Kristen Welker reports on the circumstances, and how it affects the special counsel’s Russia investigation.

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/watch/john-dowd-resigns-as-trump-s-top-lawy
er-in-special-counsel-investigation-1192177219989


Second Trump lawyer abandons sinking ship.


T

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Thursday, March 22, 2018 12:54 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Rand Paul Admits "Absolutely, The Deep State Exists"

Authored by Jay Syrmopoulos via TruthInMedia.com,

Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY) said Tuesday during an appearance on The Laura Ingraham Show podcast that the term “deep state” accurately describes how an unelected bureaucracy of national security officials in positions of power exert influence without Congressional oversight.

“Absolutely, there is a deep state, because the deep state is the intelligence agencies that do not have oversight,” he said.

“Only eight people in Congress know what they’re doing, and traditionally, those eight people have been a rubber stamp to let the intelligence communities do whatever they want. There is no skeptic among the eight people that are supposedly overseeing the intelligence community.”


https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-03-22/rand-paul-admits-absolutely-
deep-state-exists



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

America is an oligarchy
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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