REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Koolest prezident EVAR!

POSTED BY: JO753
UPDATED: Monday, May 16, 2016 22:03
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Monday, December 28, 2015 8:54 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr



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Tuesday, December 29, 2015 7:47 PM

OONJERAH



Did he just go gray-haired in 7 years?

Not having fun?


... oooOO}{OOooo ...

I've given up looking for the meaning of life. Now all I want is a cookie.

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Tuesday, December 29, 2015 10:19 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


No. It only took 4.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.nooalf.com

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Wednesday, December 30, 2015 8:29 PM

OONJERAH



Well, I hope he had fun.

I know he'll be in the history books ...

Oo-ooo! What if we survive Our Destructiveness ... &
What if we get to a time when being black is not an Otherness ...
Or a time when the USA is just another little country on the map ...
First Black President of the USA will become a factoid for history buffs.



... oooOO}{OOooo ...

I've given up looking for the meaning of life. Now all I want is a cookie.

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Wednesday, December 30, 2015 11:51 PM

OONJERAH



CHARLES CURTIS (1860-1936)
http://www.californiaindianeducation.org/famous_indians/charles_curtis/
• 31st vice president of the United States, 1929-33.
• First Native American Kansan to serve in U.S. Senate

Close, but no cigar?



... oooOO}{OOooo ...

I've given up looking for the meaning of life. Now all I want is a cookie.

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Thursday, December 31, 2015 12:15 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Wow! Youd think that woud be a big deal in the history books.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.nooalf.com

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Thursday, December 31, 2015 10:24 AM

WHOZIT


Quote:

Originally posted by G:
Turns out we're getting a new TV today - yippee! The one it's replacing is 11 years old - holy sh*t! 2004 tech... back then it was a flagship tv, now it's a dingy with holes in it. We squeezed every pixel we could out of her - thanks old girl!
So my wife and I watched a couple minutes of this Jo, and it was great - we're looking forward to testing out the YouTube access capabilities on the new box and seeing this ep that way.

Imho, we didn't deserve him as our president, weren't ready, too afraid of change. He was too modern for this country and not political adept enough to survive the Republicans.



The new show will be called "Keeping up with the Obama's". We'll get to watch Barry play endless golf and watch his wife eat Lobster. It'll win an EMMY every year it's on.

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Thursday, December 31, 2015 12:29 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


My mom got a new TV a few weeks ago. A Seiki. It wuz cheap, but seemz pretty good so far. It wuz to replase a Sanyo wich wuz krap from the beginning & then the cats peed on it & it seeped into the LCD, making a big gray blob on the bottom corner.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.nooalf.com

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Thursday, December 31, 2015 6:43 PM

OONJERAH



Lesson: Always make sure the sand box smells better (to a cat)
than the furniture does.



... oooOO}{OOooo ...

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Thursday, December 31, 2015 8:25 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


Quote:

Originally posted by Oonjerah:

Lesson: Always make sure the sand box smells better (to a cat)
than the furniture does.



I tryd that, but the perpetrator, PaNDORU, iz evil.

I took the precaution uv bolting the new TV about 5 ft up on the wall.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.nooalf.com

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Friday, January 1, 2016 12:06 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by Oonjerah:

Did he just go gray-haired in 7 years?

Not having fun?


... oooOO}{OOooo ...

I've given up looking for the meaning of life. Now all I want is a cookie.



President Clinton only took 7 years to turn his nose into something Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer would be proud of.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, January 1, 2016 12:09 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:

Originally posted by G:
Imho, we didn't deserve him as our president, weren't ready, too afraid of change. He was too modern for this country and not political adept enough to survive the Republicans.



Anybody who has what they believe is a free-thought in their brain and yet finishes the entire 3 paragraph idea with their "chosen" political ideology is not ready to have a free-thought in their brain.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, January 1, 2016 12:45 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Imho, we didn't deserve him as our president, weren't ready, too afraid of change. He was too modern for this country and not political adept enough to survive the Republicans. - G

Anybody who has what they believe is a free-thought in their brain and yet finishes the entire 3 paragraph idea with their "chosen" political ideology is not ready to have a free-thought in their brain.= 6IX



Saw the vid, I thought it was an embarrassingly stilted vanity project by Bear Grylls' and Obama's publicists. I wonder how many takes it required to get Obama's perfect "Aw shucks, I'm just a man like you." tone to Bear Grylls' "OMG-it's-the-PRESIDENT!" worship.

As far as I can tell- and this is coming from a lifelong Democrat, mind you - the Dems and Repubs don't really represent anything different; they only represent different factions of the power elite contending for the One Ring.

What did Obama do that was so noteworthy?

Well, he continued with the bank bailout.

He gave the health industries a big sloppy kiss, and then shoved us (and our taxes) into their maw.

He backed away from using the Pentagon (our official military) as his go-to foreign policy tool, and turned to the CIA and State Department to continue the work of destabilizing governments in the Mideast and elsewhere- including the drone program in which he gets to execute Americans after a Star Chamber proceeding in which he personally places people on a "kill list", doing away with entire sections of the Constitution, from habeas corpus to trial by a jury of peers.

And speaking of Constitution, he greatly expanded the (ILLEGAL) telecom spying-on-everyone program (begun by GWB), further shredding the Constitutional provisions against illegal search and seizure.

He allied himself with Saudi Arabia, and glossed over the aid that it, Qatar, and Turkey were supplying to jihadist terrorists. Not only that, he relied in CIA to weaponize, fund, and train jihadi terrorists in Syria, materially aiding a terrorist enemy of the USA.

After promising "the most transparent administration ever", he resorted to secrecy, prosecuting more whistleblowers than all other Presidents COMBINED. And with good reason, since he chose to bury himself deep in the bosom of the CIA.

And finally, when all is said and done, under the Obama administration, the rich are richer than ever before, the poor are poorer, and the middle class is disappearing.

Overall, not any better than GWB.

Not cool, Mr Prez, not cool. But hey, MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!



--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

There is a difference between THUGR is a genius., and THUGR is a "genius". And everyone knows it except THUGR, who is a "genius".

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Saturday, January 2, 2016 3:53 PM

OONJERAH


Quote:

Originally posted by Brenda:
I'm waiting for the day when you all elect your first Native American president.



I know. Let's elect an Native American woman president.



... oooOO}{OOooo ...
. . .

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Saturday, January 2, 2016 5:31 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Electing a female native American is progress??

AHEM!

Clarence Thomas ... Black Dems gave him a "pass" because he was black. He turned out to be THE most conservative ... and least qualified ... member of the Supreme Court. So voting black ... did that help?

Obama. Half-black, raised partly outside the USA. He turned out to be a tool of the power elite. So, voting black ... did that do any good?

Janet Yellen and Christine LaGarde, at the top levels of international and national banking. Judging by their policies, they're no more committed to fairness and "the little guy (or woman)" than any other top-level male.

Hillary Clinton, neocon extraordinaire/ warmonger.

If you think voting for a race/ sex/ sexual preference/ religion is going to make an improvement, you're sadly mistaken. You're being misled by "identity politics"... voting for someone who LOOKS OR SOUNDS LIKE you, whether or not they will actually carry out policies in your favor. It is a crude form of prejudice that politicians take advantage of to get what THEY want, and you're letting it happen.

If all it takes is a reality-TV video, or the right color skin or sex, to get your vote ... then please vote more intelligently.







--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

There is a difference between THUGR is a genius., and THUGR is a "genius". And everyone knows it except THUGR, who is a "genius".

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Saturday, January 2, 2016 6:49 PM

OONJERAH




So, Signym,

Take yourself too seriously much?





... oooOO}{OOooo ...

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Sunday, January 3, 2016 1:51 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


OONJ, dreaming about electing a native American lesbian or whatever is pretty pointless. Can't we dream bigger?

--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

There is a difference between THUGR is a genius., and THUGR is a "genius". And everyone knows it except THUGR, who is a "genius".

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Sunday, January 3, 2016 3:12 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


The ultimate: A cat for prezident! I nominate HiZeNBRG, and hiz sister, MURE az vise prez.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.nooalf.com

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Sunday, January 3, 2016 3:30 AM

OONJERAH


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
OONJ, dreaming about electing a native American lesbian or whatever is pretty pointless. Can't we dream bigger?



Egad! Is that what I said? ...
... I had no idea. ...

Not sure I can swallow all the words you're putting in my mouth.



BTW, who IS bigger than a native American Lesbian?



... oooOO}{OOooo ...

Looking for my Politically Correct Advisor. ...

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Sunday, January 3, 2016 3:47 AM

OONJERAH


At JO753

The cats I know don't want to be President.
They don't like the lights-noise-commotion ... interference with nap time.

A Dog or maybe a Pig would be happier doing it.



... oooOO}{OOooo ...

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Sunday, January 3, 2016 7:42 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Take yourself seriously much?-OONJ


OONJ, I take what YOU say seriously.


--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

There is a difference between THUGR is a genius., and THUGR is a "genius". And everyone knows it except THUGR, who is a "genius".

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Sunday, January 3, 2016 3:39 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Take yourself seriously much?-OONJ

FWIW my observation is that Signy has a drive to understand the world and all its workings - yes, even dimensions and force and time (ever hear of quarternian math? or have a clue if you have? yeah, me neither) - that my intellectually lazy ass neither shares nor comprehends. Signy thinks, and thinks, and THINKS so much about so many things I get tired just thinking about THAT!

Meanwhile, I'm going to go back to thinking about how to remodel the interior of my house so it's useful, efficient, and universally accessible. And pretty. To me.




SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.

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Sunday, January 3, 2016 7:38 PM

OONJERAH


Quote:

Originally posted by OONJERAH:
Quote:

Originally posted by Brenda:
I'm waiting for the day when you all elect your first Native American president.


I know. Let's elect an Native American woman president.



Seriously, in the USA, land of the free - home of the braves,
we should be able to elect a woman (Hillary Clinton?) or an NA
to the highest office. But my notion is that Americans are not
enlightened enough to elect someone who is both even if such a
candidate were the most qualified. AFAIK, this is the 1st time a
woman has run. NA? Maybe Curtis did run & got the VP spot for
doing so.
My remark was meant in fun, but what was I making fun of? ...
our WASP, bigoted, male chauvinist society, I guess.
I said nothing of lesbians.





... oooOO}{OOooo ...

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Sunday, January 3, 2016 8:25 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


AFAIK, this is the 1st time a woman has run.

For president, yes.

For vice president:
Geraldine Anne Ferraro (August 26, 1935 – March 26, 2011) was an American attorney, a Democratic Party politician, and a member of the United States House of Representatives. She was the first female vice presidential candidate representing a major American political party.
The year was 1984.

But I agree with Signy. Are WE so focused on sex, race, age and gender that we'll pass by the arguably best qualified cough Sanders cough on account of being an old, white, hetero male?




SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.

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Sunday, January 3, 2016 10:23 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK




Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Monday, January 4, 2016 10:12 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.



Quote:

Originally posted by OONJERAH:But my notion is that Americans are not
enlightened enough to elect someone who is both even if such a
candidate were the most qualified.- OOJERAH

Eh? Barack. Hussein. Obama? Former drug user, White/Black man from Hawaii of mixed/Nigerian ancestry studied at Harvard? Anything/anyone can happen

Except anyone who represents the people getting into the White House, apparently.

Seen the upper 0.01% lose any money or influence in the past 7 years?

Yeah, me neither.

People keep thinking that electing a half-black man to the WH represents progress of some sort. The hope appears to rest on the assumption that if we elect someone who LOOKS DIFFERENT ... ie, someone who isn't an old, white, Xtian, hetero male ... that they will bring their "life experience" to the table and ACT DIFFERENT. (Justice Sotomajor)

Well, in my experience, that doesn't happen. Women, blacks, Hispanics, gays etc who make it near the top of the pecking order are very heavily screened in favor of sociopathy, and the one thing about sociopaths- they behave the same, no matter WHAT their skin color, gender, or sexual preference.

Are the currently-running Presidential female candidates any less warmongering, power-driven, and backstabbing than their male counterparts?

Ah .... No.

Nonetheless, I can guarantee you that there will be women who vote for a woman JUST BECAUSE she is a woman. And that makes as much sense as working-class white guys voting for "beer, bbq, and NASCAR" Bush ... as if he ever represented them either! [/sarcasm]

There are two flawed memes when it comes to voting: "Lesser of two evils" and "Identity politics".
If we're so distracted by our personal racism/ sexism/ ageism when we decide who to vote for .... if we're so spun around that we don't even know what our interests are anymore .... then we pretty much deserve whatever we get. And don't come cryin' later on, when the person you elected screws you over, again, just like the last person did. When you vote for someone, look at their record and put on your thinking cap.


--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

There is a difference between THUGR is a genius., and THUGR is a "genius". And everyone knows it except THUGR, who is a "genius".

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Tuesday, January 5, 2016 10:04 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Who has really benefited from Obama's tenure?

Well ... banks. The wealthy. Arms manufacturers, who are seeing bonanza exports. Pharmaceutical companies, and those who make most of their money from stocks.

Gays.

Interestingly, that is the one area where it can be said that Obama made progress: Rights for gays. Serving openly in the military, and the right to marry.

Neither of which cost the government OR business money.

It was the least he could do. I mean that literally- it was the LEAST COSTLY crumb that he could toss which made everyone feel that ... Oh yeah, Obama is a liberal!

Now, IMHO whatever Obama did to bring the treatment of gays up to more-or-less equality was far overdue. But OTOH, it made not a whit of difference to most people, even as their incomes and prospects were sliding backwards. So not really much progress overall, and backsliding for most.

THOSE are "the people" I'm talking about: the 90%+ who didn't benefit from Obama's reign. Those people who are still struggling finding decent-paying jobs and to pay off their debts. Because it can be truly said that he didn't represent them - not one bit. (And he's still pushing for TTP and TTIP, so who does he represent, really. Eh?)

--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Wednesday, January 6, 2016 12:43 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


You asked me "who" I meant, G. I answered. Dong ma?

--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Wednesday, January 6, 2016 10:35 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


First you say my answers are too complex, now you say they're too simple.

The irreducible fact is that most people are WORSE OFF now. It may be simple but it's fact. But hey, keep on telling yourself that everything's a-OK, because... gay rights, yanno?

--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Thursday, January 7, 2016 12:40 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


I think you are amongst the peepl who havent manajd to catch the wave sins Obama got elected, Sig. Me neither, but I can see most uv the country did.

Sum more than otherz! WAY more! And primarily the same money grubbing freeloader Wall Streeterz who crashed the worldz economy in 08.

But try to remember wut wuz going on in 07 - 10. It coud hav been a huje global cataclizm leaving us in a Road Warrior senario. That wuz the direction we were sliding and if McCain had won, we'd be there now. Freekin Vise Prezident Palin! C'mon! The idiot GoPs were talking libertarian wakko krap about letting the car companyz die, too hell with the unemployed, its their own fault, social programz are wuts dragging down the job creatorz, etc etc etc.

And seriously - with the entire republican population uv the country doing absolutely everything they can to thwart anything that haz even a hint uv common sens to it bekuz Obama iz naturally for it, being a sensibl guy, its a miracle we are not currently fiting over scraps uv food and The Precious Juice.

Hav you seen the carz ordinary peepl are driving theze dayz? Do you notis everybody, even little kidz walking around with the latest jiant fonez? Hav you been to Best Buy, all rejisterz open and still waiting in line behind carts loaded with 70" TVz, computerz and pilez uv moviez?

You havent been getting out much, so are seeing the world thru the fog uv the GoP propaganda machine. Even if you arent tuned into Fox Cable all day just the ekoz are enuf to skew your perseption. Your dimwit antiObama naybor spouting krap he herd on Limbaugh. Druj Report repeaterz everywhere. You cant escape from it. They hav created an alternate reality with a decade uv nonstop torrential garbaj.

Wake up.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.nooalf.com

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Thursday, January 7, 2016 9:29 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:


First you say my answers are too complex, now you say they're too simple.

The irreducible fact is that most people are WORSE OFF now. It may be simple but it's fact. But hey, keep on telling yourself that everything's a-OK, because... gay rights, yanno? = SIGNY

I can't imagine EVER saying your answers are "too complex" - generally too wordy, for sure, but not too complex. The issue you are addressing is TOO COMPLEX for your simple answer - that's also usually true.

"The irreducible fact is that most people are WORSE OFF now." I know it can seem like that for everyone when things aren't going so well for you. Time maybe to tell hubster to get another job - fwiw everyone's hiring where I live. But hey, keep on telling yourself that everything sucks, because... Obama, yanno? = G



So, there you are, bargaining with yourselves.

The fact is that most people are worse off than before. So, in your mind, G, how many people have to be financially in trouble before you finally admit that our leadership isn't really working for us? How many people are you willing sell downriver? 80%? 90%? 95%? More? At what point would you actually say ... Yanno, maybe this policy wasn't designed for us? Or does that realization come to you only when a Republican/Tory is President/ Prime Minister?

Quote:

I think you are amongst the peepl who havent manajd to catch the wave sins Obama got elected, Sig.
Huh? We're doing just fine, thank you! Do you think I'm grousing because of some personal circumstance??? Sheesh! You should know me better by now!
Quote:

Me neither, but I can see most uv the country did.
On WHAT do you base this observation? There are only three indices that look OK:

unemployment rate
GDP
stock market

Those indices are so manipulated as to be meaningless. Actual employment is measured by the "participation rate" which is at a 45-year low, GDP is barely positive and includes financialization which is irrelevant to most people, and the stock market is also irrelevant to most people.

Quote:

It coud hav been a huje global cataclizm leaving us in a Road Warrior senario.


Or here's a better idea, JO! Let's compare it to what "might have been": It could have been worse! Now, that's a good measure for supporting the status quo because ... well it can't really be measured, can it? All you have to do is set your example to be "bad enough" ... We could be radioactive ash by now! and THIS timeline doesn't look so bad, does it? Wow, in fact, compared to what might have been, Obama's a friggin' savior.

-----------

Solving our economic and financial crises ... and BTW, they hasn't been solved yet ... isn't complicated. It's not rocket science and - if you want- I can go over all of that again. It's not rocket science, it's not "complicated" but it does have one important problem embedded in it:

It would require removing money and influence from TPTB.

THAT'S the "complication" that seems to stymie Obama. THAT'S what preventing him from moving on some relatively straightforward actions which would at least slow down the next financial crisis. It's not because "it's complicated" or that "the economy is recovering" but simply that he would have to cross those in power ... ie, NOT US ... in order to represent us. Which, of course, he's not about to do. So he doesn't represent us.

AND BTW- GSTRING, since you seem to think you know so much about the economy, have you looked at the Baltic Dry Index, the USA participation rate, USA trucking indices, USA manufacturer's orders, and commodity prices lately? They are pointing to a huge - and I mean HUGE - contraction underway. And if you're Albertan, or you live in fracking state where large percentages of state income come from oil, well, it'll suck to be you.

By no stretch of the imagination is Obama the koolest prezident evar. Not because he solved our various economic/ financial/ fiscal crises, not because he's black, not because he preserved our Constitutional rights, not because he's an international peacemaker who represents our interests abroad, and certainly not because he appeared on some reality TV show.


--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Thursday, January 7, 2016 4:30 PM

REAVERFAN


Quote:

The new show will be called "Keeping up with the Obama's". We'll get to watch Barry play endless golf and watch his wife eat Lobster. It'll win an EMMY every year it's on.
Are you seriously that misinformed?

Of course you are! The very definition of a low information voter.

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Friday, January 8, 2016 1:10 AM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


I beleev I sed this befor, Sig - the prezident iznt the King. If the office had more power, I'm sure he woud hav gotten alot more dun. And probably woud hav much less gray hair.

http://pleasecutthecrap.com/obama-accomplishments/

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.nooalf.com

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Friday, January 8, 2016 9:49 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

I beleev I sed this befor, Sig - the prezident iznt the King. If the office had more power, I'm sure he woud hav gotten alot more dun. And probably woud hav much less gray hair.
And I believe I said this before: It's not just a problem of "failure to accomplish", but that what Obama DID accomplish screwed us over. Now, if a President was really on our side, why would he screw us over like that?

What I've noticed is that Obama seems to be very sensitive to how he LOOKS to the population, so all of his dirty work is either done in secret (like drone-killing or wiretapping everyone) or by proxy (like putting Baucus in charge of health insurance). It's called "How to do what TPTB want, and still have the liberals think that you're OK".


--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Friday, January 8, 2016 2:52 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

I think you are amongst the peepl who havent manajd to catch the wave sins Obama got elected, Sig. Me neither, but I can see most uv the country did
I wanted to get back to this, JO.

Most uv the country DIDN'T. Everyone seems to think that "everyone else" is doing better, that they're the individual exceptions, the failures, but they're not as alone as they think.

GSTRING managed to avoid nearly all of the indexes that I mentioned which show something entirely different than what you believe. And those were just off the top of my head. I can add income distribution, the wealth gap, real (inflation-adjusted) wages, lowered life expectancy among whites, the addiction epidemic ...

Nobody likes to feel like a victim, but we've been victimized. Only a few came out of this as winners. It's not just you, JO, that feels as if they didn't catch the wave.

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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Saturday, January 9, 2016 11:54 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

SIGNYM = FRAUD

I know I'm not a fraud, but I know what YOU are. Do you want me to tell everyone?

OK, here's my explanation. Yes, it's going to be wordy, so you'll have to have some patience.

There are TWO things that business media, banks, and the President refer to when they talk about "the economy", but although conflated, they're not the same thing.

The first is the economy... the activity of making things (wheat, beef, houses, tools, chemicals, medicines) or providing services (childcare, teaching, health care, etc.) that others consume.

The other part that is often conflated with "the economy" is FINANCE. It is the business of "making money with money" - usually lending money with the idea of getting more back. That include bank loans, the stock market, hedge funds, derivatives, speculation on fine art, gold, diamonds, or futures commodities, etc. There is NO direct relationship between finance and the economy. But because the "business news" always starts out with the stock market report, most people think of the stock market as the temperature of the economy, but it's not.

In order to see how THE ECONOMY is doing, and how real people are doing, you have to look at the indexes that relate to jobs and wages, not at the stock market or other financial indicators

Unfortunately, the most-widely looked-at indexes - GDP and unemployment rate - tend to be so highly filtered as to provide unrealistic numbers.

If you look at the "unemployment rate" you'd be forgiven for thinking that everyone has a decent job except you. But the problem with the unemployment rate is that

1) You only have to be employed for an hour a month to be considered "employed".
2) You have to be actively looking for work.
3) It says nothing about the wages that you're making.

So the unemployment rate doesn't reveal underemployment, it doesn't reveal the "discouraged worker", and it doesn't say anything at all about how much money people are making. If you want to see the REAL picture, you kind of have to dig it out of other indexes which aren't publicized, for example, the inflation adjusted PER HOUR wages for most people have not risen at all in the past



You might think this is status quo for most people, except that the actual NUMBER OF HOURS PER WEEK has gone down from about 39 to about 34.



So in reality, wage earners are making about 15% less than before.

In you want a big-picture view of the economy, you can also look at how much is being shipped/ trucked around the globe, or across the country. Or you can look at the price of "commodities" ... specifically the raw materials need to "make stuff"- coal, oil, natgas, iron ore, copper, aluminum. If prices are low, that means that manufacturing is slowing down.

The point that I was making is that the indicators are pointing to a economic slowdown which is already occurring. It's worldwide; and Obama has failed to prepare for it. Also, the go-to response to a worldwide economic slowdown has been (at times) world war, because nothing jacks up production like making things that blow themselves up.

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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Sunday, January 10, 2016 9:09 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Yeah, I took Econ in high school so this was pretty much covered in the first week - thanks for the trip down memory lane.
So, since you already know about the role of trucking, shipping, wages, etc in indicating economic activity, NONE of the indexes that I mentioned should have been unfamiliar to you.

You should have acknowledged them them right away as being familiar and relevant. But instead of furthering the discussion about THE ECONOMY - which you claim to have SOME knowledge of- you once again turn it personal, and try to discredit me (again) by claiming I didn't know the indexes, and by implying they weren't relevant. In other words, you lied. Again.

Well, I'm glad I could explain to you what you apparently already know - and what you tried VERY hard to discredit. You'd rather "win the argument" by any means possible than discuss anything real, you stupid troll. So thanks for demonstrating - once again- why you should be ignored at every step, since you seldom have anything to add except personal insult.

Quote:

"Obama failed to prepare for it." 'Cuz, yanno, it's all Obama's fault.
Obama came to office just as the banking and reinsurance dominoes were falling. Because, just like a bunch of drunk and tottery men on an icy sidewalk hanging onto each other for support, the insurances on the crappy investments that they sold each other didn't provide them mutual support, it tied them together like a line of dominoes. When one fell, they all started falling together.

What Obama did was stop the avalanche. There are several things he could have done differently in the moment:

Appoint Shiela Bair, head of the FDIC, as Treasury Scy, instead of Tim Geithner, Wall Street protégé. That was his biggest failing. If you appoint the wrong person, you get the wrong advice. In this case, Geithner's advice was to save Wall Street, and they've been doing it ever since.

Stop giving the banks money. Announce that the government would stand behind all mortgages until the banks figured out who owned WHICH mortgage (the massive robo-signing scandal, which no one was ever prosecuted for), and then help the banks pick up the pieces. It would have been FAR CHEAPER to back the mortgages than to back the banks, which used to mortgages to back 10X more bad debt.

Allow the public to know WHICH banks were failing. Part of the "master plan" was to shove money at ALL the banks, because the government didn't want to reveal which banks were failing... because THE BANKS didn't want to reveal which banks were failing. Really??? Yeah, thanks for protecting our interests, Obama! (not!)

Then, in addition, Obama required the stable banks to absorb shaky ones. Because, if part of the problem is too big to [be allowed] to fail, nothing solves that problem like making banks bigger! AMIRIGHTORWHAT?

The follow actions that Obama took leaned into the problem: He approved of a "bail-in" agreement with the Bank of England http://www.bankofengland.co.uk/publications/Documents/news/2012/nr156.
pdf
which allows the banks to take YOUR DEPOSITS in case of an impending default. Because YOUR DEPOSITS ARE NO LONGER YOUR MONEY HELD FOR SAFEKEEPING, they are an UNSECURED LOAN TO THE BANK. In other words, you have lent them your deposit, and your pension has lent them THEIR deposit, with no assurance of being paid back. If the bank faces default, they're allowed to take whatever amount of deposit required to make them whole, and give you (the depositor) whatever shares of their (failing) stock in their bank as they deem a fit recompense.

It wouldn't be so bad if it was just the FDIC and the BoE, but Obama negotiated an extension of that concept to ALL G20 nation banks during their meeting in Australia, and it has just come into effect, as of Jan 1 2016. http://ellenbrown.com/2014/12/01/new-rules-cyprus-style-bail-ins-to-hi
t-deposits-and-pensions
/

I could go on about all of the crap that Obama DID, and then from there to all of the stuff he SHOULD HAVE DONE BUT DIDN'T. It would be a long, long post. What it all winds up is that the wealthy, and their banks, and corporations, have been protected by their access to zero pct interest rates while everyone else gets the shaft.

Now, I know this isn't the first time I've written about this, and not the 2nd, and not the 3rd. Maybe it's about time that you started picking up on and remembering this stuff because IT'S IMPORTANT. Far more important than any reality TV show, and far more important than gays rights.

-----------------

One more thing that I'd like to point out to JO and to anyone else who has had the patience to read this far. It's a little sideways, but it explains a lot about why banks have become so powerful.

If you or I decided to set of a fancy programmable photocopier and get a superior stock of cotton rag paper and set up a money-printing machine in our basement, we would be prosecuted as counterfeiters. Because ONLY the government has the right to print money, correct???

But it we OWNED A BANK, and decided to loan out money that WE DIDN'T HAVE, by simply adding some bits to someone's account, have we not just "created money"? The answer is: Yes, we have.) Except for the government, banks are the only entity LEGALLY EMPOWERED TO CREATE MONEY. They don't print currency, but what they DO do is add to someone's bank account (add money) from money THEY DON'T HAVE. About 70% of circulating money come from these kinds of addition. It's called "fractional reserve banking" ... allowing banks to lend what they don't have, as long as they have SOME real-money backing (5% or less, when all is said and done) behind those loans.

What happens is that banks get to loan phantom money, but what they want in return is real money plus interest. The only way those loans can be paid off is if the economy grows by at least the same rate as the interest rate on the loans. Since most loans are well above the growth rate of the economy (except the loans that the Fed gives to the banks, and the loans the banks give to their own investment arms, to each other, and to favored customers) it's a fair bet that those loans will never be paid in full.

--------------

And, since I'm only feeding GSRTING'S overweening narcissism by replying to him, in which he tries to turn EVERY thread into a thread about ... GSTRING! ... I'm ignoring him now.


--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Sunday, January 10, 2016 10:40 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Here's an interesting article about the Purchasing Manager's Index (PMI)

Here are 2 completely different ways of thinking about the exact same chart
Quote:

Hartnett thinks that the market just does not appreciate how serious that sub-50 ISM PMI is.

"Recession risks remain mispriced: profits highly correlated with PMIs and in both US & China PMI’s weak," he said. "Note ISM <45 level has coincided with US recession 11/13 times since WW2."

Because Hartnett is considering an ISM PMI below 45, the measure becomes a much more robust leading indicator.


http://www.businessinsider.com/2-different-signals-from-ism-manufactur
ing-2016-1


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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Sunday, January 10, 2016 1:28 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


You dont seem to hav an idea uv the magnitude uv oppozition Obama haz been up agenst sins day -365, Sig.

http://swampland.time.com/2012/08/23/the-party-of-no-new-details-on-th
e-gop-plot-to-obstruct-obama
/

We can argue detailz uv wut Obama did forever, but wut wuz possible for him at any time iz another matter.

You hav also clearly forgotten how bad thingz were going. We werent just in a dich on the side uv the road, we were teetering on a cliff.

The GoPS hav dun their best to hinder any recovery, deny that its occuring, wile denying they are responsibl for putting us on the ej uv ruin.

Just this morning on Gearge Stephanopolisz show Mitch McConnell sed "the White House iz painting a rozy picture for the future. (about Obamaz upcoming State uv xu Union address) There iz no rozy future!"

HA! The old turtle still haz it!

I woud hav dun thingz differently if I were prez, but who knowz, it coud hav been a dizaster. Without knowing all the detailz, hindsite iz not 20 20.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.nooalf.com

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Sunday, January 10, 2016 1:43 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


JO, I have not forgotten how bad things were. I was following extremely closely, from before it even became apparent, and posted so here, often, that the financial sector was going to take a dive, even as Republicans were saying that the economy was ON FIRE!

That is why I was so focused on who Obama would appoint for Treasury Scy.

Let's agree to agree that Obama stayed the avalanche. Whether he did it by the best means possible, it was done. But once the avalanche was stayed, then what? In his first term, he had overwhelming support, AND a completely Democratic Congress. What was his excuse then?

Quote:

We can argue detailz uv wut Obama did forever, but wut wuz possible for him at any time iz another matter.
Apparently, REPRESENTING US was beyond his power. Even you think so.

You insist on seeing him as a man of good intentions, overwhelmed by TPTB. What I focus on is what he did when nobody was looking ... what he did in secret, from his Presidential powers. He stabbed us in the back then too.

You seem to think that I'm criticizing Obama like a Republican, from the right. I'm actually criticizing Obama FROM THE LEFT, if that makes my POV clearer. Not everyone who criticizes Obama is a rightwinger Republican.

--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Sunday, January 10, 2016 5:23 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


If I wuz prez, I woud hav cleared the books for all home ownerz except anybody in manajment at any financial institution! In other wordz, if you had a morgaj, you woudnt anymore - the house iz yourz.

The new rule woud be that wenever therez a finacial crash, all dets are lost. That woud end the boom&bust system that the money shufflerz uze to steal all the welth.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.nooalf.com

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Friday, January 22, 2016 2:40 AM

OONJERAH


Obama: "I'm 'going to cry' at Malia's high school graduation. Malia's
graduating in June."
http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/21/politics/malia-obama-graduation-cries/?i
id=ob_lockedrail_bottomlist&iref=obinsite


Plus shortest ever State of the Union address.


... oooOO}{OOooo ...

Be the power of positive thinking; keep a good attitude.

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Friday, January 22, 2016 4:18 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


For once you make perfect sense. I'm with you, what good does it do to forgive the banks for nearly destroying the world's economy, bailing them out (with our tax dollars I might add) and then handing them a bonus by merely changing mortgage debt in their favor. That's a double whammy!

Your proposal would definitely spank the banks and reward the average home owner, who the banks tried to screw. The president didn't go far enough and only gave the filthy bums a slap on the wrist, with a bankroll from our pockets. But let's not put it all on the president, Congress could have done something as well, the cowards. The greedy bastards - banks and their
supporters - just finished legally robbing us, again!

SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by JO753:
If I wuz prez, I woud hav cleared the books for all home ownerz except anybody in manajment at any financial institution! In other wordz, if you had a morgaj, you woudnt anymore - the house iz yourz.

The new rule woud be that wenever therez a finacial crash, all dets are lost. That woud end the boom&bust system that the money shufflerz uze to steal all the welth.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.nooalf.com


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Friday, January 22, 2016 4:23 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


I get that enough wasn't done, although some of it was already in the works before Obama set foot in the Oval office, but where do you get your info that Obama "secretly" used his presidential powers to further screw us?

I'm curious!


SGG


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
JO, I have not forgotten how bad things were. I was following extremely closely, from before it even became apparent, and posted so here, often, that the financial sector was going to take a dive, even as Republicans were saying that the economy was ON FIRE!

That is why I was so focused on who Obama would appoint for Treasury Scy.

Let's agree to agree that Obama stayed the avalanche. Whether he did it by the best means possible, it was done. But once the avalanche was stayed, then what? In his first term, he had overwhelming support, AND a completely Democratic Congress. What was his excuse then?

Quote:

We can argue detailz uv wut Obama did forever, but wut wuz possible for him at any time iz another matter.
Apparently, REPRESENTING US was beyond his power. Even you think so.

You insist on seeing him as a man of good intentions, overwhelmed by TPTB. What I focus on is what he did when nobody was looking ... what he did in secret, from his Presidential powers. He stabbed us in the back then too.

You seem to think that I'm criticizing Obama like a Republican, from the right. I'm actually criticizing Obama FROM THE LEFT, if that makes my POV clearer. Not everyone who criticizes Obama is a rightwinger Republican.

--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.


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Friday, January 22, 2016 8:35 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

I get that enough wasn't done, although some of it was already in the works before Obama set foot in the Oval office, but where do you get your info that Obama "secretly" used his presidential powers to further screw us?
Well, maybe the Constitution doesn't mean much to anyone, but the first thing that Obama did IN SECRET is everything that Snowden told us about: we are being surveilled without restriction. There goes the Fourth Amendment ... pppfffft! No writ, no warrant describing the person and things to be searched, no cause.

In addition, the SECRET DRONE PROGRAM which allowed Obama to be judge, jury, and executioner of American citizens ... no right of trial and jury of peers, no habeas corpus or requirement to show cause. Entire additional sections of the Constitution ... ppffffttt!

Then there are the CIA black ops, funded outside the Congressionally-approved budget.

None of this would have come to light if it hadn't been for Snowden and other whistleblowers, who Obama is prosecuting with a vengeance! Obama, you should recall, was a Constitutional lecturer. He knows what he's breaking, and there is no question that he started this in secret and intended (and still intends) this to STAY secret, and will keep as much secret as long as possible.




--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Sunday, January 24, 2016 2:41 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


I bet this haz been posted here befor:
https://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/08/09/1320193/-Three-Charts-to-Ema
il-to-Your-Right-Wing-Brother-In-Law-Updated?detail=emailclassic


Showz wut a fantasy land the Fox newz addicts are living in.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.nooalf.com

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Tuesday, January 26, 2016 3:22 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Yeah, you're right The Constitution doesn't mean much to any red-blooded American anymore.........what with Cowboy Clive doing his thing out there
in the boonies of Hillbilly Nevada or some such.

But we're talking about Obama aren't we. So, you think that Snowden is a hero? One question: If he's such a hero, then why did he run? Why did he blow the whistle? What was his motive? Actually, I could investigate that
on my own. He stole a shitload of documents, that much I know. Claims
Americans, innocent Americans were spied on...........Hmmmmmm, where
did I hear that before?

Again, I digress. This is about Obama and his secrets which, of course, no other president before him has had. Then Congress should impeach him, shouldn't they? They have control of both houses don't they? Oh, what evil lurks in the heart of the "colorful" president born in Kenya. By the way, have you ever heard of the Patriot Act? Just asking!

"Hastily passed 45 days after 9/11 in the name of national security, the Patriot Act was the first of many changes to surveillance laws that made it easier for the government to spy on ordinary Americans by expanding the
authority to monitor phone and email communications, collect bank and credit reporting records, and track the activity of innocent Americans on the internet. While most Americans think it was created to catch terrorists,
the Patriot Act actually turns regular citizens into suspects."
(Source: www.aclu.org)

U.S.A. P.A.T.R.I.O.T. - Uniting and Strengthening American by Providing
Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism Act of 2001.
Signed into law by George W. Bush on October 26, 2001.

Gee, how clever of Obama to do that way back in 2001. Makes ya think how
good is Kenya's intelligence community......to sneak him into the country
through Hawaii, become a Constitutional law professor, then a senator, then
a president, then a traitor; by changing the intelligence culture within
our society, and now..........what!? A dictator!? Are ya waiting for the black helicopters? Are ya singing the praises of one Donald J. Trump, a
true American? Gee, Obama is sure a clever and resourceful man to do all that. Oh, wait, he had the help of the Kenyan intelligence community, I
almost forgot. They were able to outsmart the C.I.A., F.B.I., NSA and countless other government ghosts and spies all these years.

Yes, in May 2011, Obama signed an extension of key provisions within the
Patriot Act that approved:

1- Roving wiretaps, to track "lone wolf" terrorists and to obtain relevant
records to further the investigation after securing an order from a federal court.
2- Allows the FBI to apply to the FISA court to issue orders granting access to tangible items in foreign intelligence and international terrorism cases.
3- Section 6001 of the Intelligence Reform & Terrorist Prevention Act of 2004, closes a loophole that could allow individual terrorists to slip through the cracks of FISA surveillance; a.k.a. the "lone wolf" provision.
(Source: Huffington Post)

I can see where an ordinary, law-abiding citizen would be afraid of having his phone and computer tapped. And there was that report (on 60 Minutes, I think) that revealed the Army was eavesdropping on their employees. Of course, they were using it for personal reasons and not officially condoned
spying.

Well, not to worry. Trump to the rescue, he'll make America great again.
Maybe he'll pardon Snowden, that great American, and the country will
rejoice at his return to the land of E Pluribus Unum.


SGG


"Freedom's just another word for, nothing left to lose."


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

I get that enough wasn't done, although some of it was already in the works before Obama set foot in the Oval office, but where do you get your info that Obama "secretly" used his presidential powers to further screw us?
Well, maybe the Constitution doesn't mean much to anyone, but the first thing that Obama did IN SECRET is everything that Snowden told us about: we are being surveilled without restriction. There goes the Fourth Amendment ... pppfffft! No writ, no warrant describing the person and things to be searched, no cause.

In addition, the SECRET DRONE PROGRAM which allowed Obama to be judge, jury, and executioner of American citizens ... no right of trial and jury of peers, no habeas corpus or requirement to show cause. Entire additional sections of the Constitution ... ppffffttt!

Then there are the CIA black ops, funded outside the Congressionally-approved budget.

None of this would have come to light if it hadn't been for Snowden and other whistleblowers, who Obama is prosecuting with a vengeance! Obama, you should recall, was a Constitutional lecturer. He knows what he's breaking, and there is no question that he started this in secret and intended (and still intends) this to STAY secret, and will keep as much secret as long as possible.




--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.


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Tuesday, January 26, 2016 8:04 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
Yeah, you're right The Constitution doesn't mean much to any red-blooded American anymore.........what with Cowboy Clive doing his thing out there
in the boonies of Hillbilly Nevada or some such.

Well, so far YOU don't seem to interested in defending it against clear violations.

Quote:

But we're talking about Obama aren't we.

SGG, I've been squawking about the spying since NIXON started using the FBI to infiltrate protest organizations!

Were you not here when I brought up - over and over- the revelation by AT&T technician Mark Klein that BUSH had started splicing into the AT&T lines at their San Francisco exchange? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A

For my pains, I was treated like some sort of woo-woo leftwing conspiracy nutjob who was making to much of nothing!

This isn't about OBAMA, and that you keep reacting as if I'm targeting OBAMA specifically (Because he's half-black? Because he's a Democrat?) is frustrating beyond belief. Try removing the individual from the argument. I'd be making the same criticisms whether Obama was purple or green or Republican or Peace&Freedom. Violating the Constitution is violating the Constitution, no matter who's doing it.

Quote:

So, you think that Snowden is a hero? One question: If he's such a hero, then why did he run?
You're kidding, right?

Quote:

Why did he blow the whistle? What was his motive? Actually, I could investigate that
He blew the whistle - LIKE SO MANY OTHERS- because he was participating in an activity that was frankly unconstitutional. He lost a LOT because of it. But, yeah- go ahead and "investigate" it. While you're at it, why don't you investigate what he revealed as well?

Did you hear about the 50 or so DIA analysts who blew the whistle on the fact that their reports on our anti-ISIL strategy were being re-written into happy-talk for political purposes? No, of course not.

There are a lot of whistleblowers out there, blowing whistles. Maybe you should listen to them.

Quote:

He stole a shitload of documents, that much I know. Claims Americans, innocent Americans were spied on...........Hmmmmmm, where did I hear that before?
Lots of places. Possibly even here, from me, about GWB. The fact that you heard about other instances of surveillance instigated by other Presidents doesn't make Obama's violations any less true, or any less important. Stop trying to make exceptions for Obama. It's beneath you, or it should be. Apply the same rigorous standards that you would apply to Bush or any other President. Insert "BUSH" everywhere you hear about a criticism of Obama, and if you find certain actions would be heinous under Bush, then they should be equally heinous under Obama. Isn't that so?

Quote:

Again, I digress. This is about Obama and his secrets which, of course, no other president before him has had.
Yeah, thanks for mis-stating what I said.

I'm an equal-opportunity accuser. Do you want me to start linking the many, many criticisms of BUSH that I made here? Why would you distort my viewpoints that way? Because what I've said has been very clear, and not at all muted.

By the way, you will see, if you bother to look, that I gave OBAMA a VERY wide margin when he was first elected. Despite his lack of record, I voted for him on the basis that I already knew what Hillary was about (neocon) and that if Obama only managed to keep 15% of his many promises, he wouldn't be doing too badly.

I defended him against the rightwing "birther" nutjobs who were claiming that he was a Kenyan Muslim socialist. As if! I didn't start to have SUBSTANTIVE criticisms until about three years into his first term, when he had proven himself to be both a corporate shill and a serial Constitutional transgressor.


Quote:

Then Congress should impeach him, shouldn't they?
Yes, they should. Bush too.

YOU HAVE TO WONDER, or at least you might want to wonder, what the POINT of all of this surveillance is. What was it meant to accomplish? Did it actually catch any terrorists, prevent any terrorist acts?

ER... no.

Quote:

They have control of both houses don't they? Oh, what evil lurks in the heart of the "colorful" president born in Kenya.
Oh my fucking god. Why do you keep turning this into some sort of reaction to rightwing nutjobs?

Quote:

By the way, have you ever heard of the Patriot Act? Just asking!
yes, I've heard of the Patriot Act. It's unconstitutional. Just in case you've forgotten what we're talking about, here is the part in the Constitution about search and seizure. It's pretty plain what the Founding Fathers had in mind when they wrote it, it's very short, and worth a thoughtful read on your part:

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

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Gee, how clever of Obama to do that way back in 2001.
And I have faulted BUSH, over and over, and over and over about torture, about the Patriot Act, about using 9-11 and cooked intelligence to lead us into pointless wars that destabilized the entire mideast, about mass surveillance.

Just because Obama does the same thing, does that make it better?


Whenever somebody criticizes OBAMA, liberals (such as yourself?) reply with "But BUSH...!" We've had two miscreants in the WH in a row. One Democrat, one Republican. Neither one of them has represented the interests of the American people. Both have violated the Constitution. The fact that Obama is half-black is irrelevant to his misdeeds, or at least it should be, if you're trying to judge equally.

And just wait till the rest of the shit comes out. Both Presidents- very, very dirty.


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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Tuesday, January 26, 2016 10:10 PM

JO753

rezident owtsidr


I giv alot uv leeway to prezidents. Even if I disagree with wut they are doing, I assume they know more than I do and its posssible that wut looks stoopid to me iz bekuz uv sumthing I dont know.

Even tho its clear that Bush went after Hussain based on liez, I am still 50/50 az to wether it wuz a bad thing. There iz probably stuff we wont know till much later in the century that woud chanje your mind.

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.nooalf.com

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Tuesday, January 26, 2016 10:44 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Originally posted by JO753:
I giv alot uv leeway to prezidents. Even if I disagree with wut they are doing, I assume they know more than I do and its posssible that wut looks stoopid to me iz bekuz uv sumthing I dont know.

It iz alsoh possibl that wut luks stoopid to yu iz bekuz thay don't shayr yur mohtivashuns.

You're assuming that you're dealing with ethical people.

Quote:

Even tho its clear that Bush went after Hussain based on liez, I am still 50/50 az to wether it wuz a bad thing. There iz probably stuff we wont know till much later in the century that woud chanje your mind.
I doubt there is anything that could be revealed that would make me relax my position.

Yu want too noh how Iy noh?

Because if they had a GOOD REASON for their strategy, they could have explained it to me already. The only reason to keep it secret is because (1) there are clear and immediate reasons not to reveal strategy (doubtful) and (2) they know I wouldn't agree to their terms.

But I agree that there is probably stuff we won't know until later (if ever) that will make me think that both Bush and Obama were even bigger dicks than I thought.

For a guy who believes in being logical, you kind of turn it off when evaluating your "betters". A pretty good example of people diving into the social structure and not thinking individually.

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