REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Well... here 'Fahrenheit 9/11' is.

POSTED BY: QUICKSAND
UPDATED: Thursday, March 30, 2006 07:02
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 21854
PAGE 3 of 3

Tuesday, June 29, 2004 10:21 AM

JASONZZZ


Quote:

Originally posted by Hjermsted:
Listening to the opinions of people who haven't even watched the film has become tiresome.

The film is out there now. Go see it. THEN let's discuss. Steal a ticket... sneak in... watch the inevitable bootleg copy that will soon be posted on the 'net.... I don't care!

But please just realize that opining about something you haven't experienced yourself is a sign of laziness.

Thanks and have a great day!

mattro



Not lazy... Nothing that I have read or seen so far has motivated me to care enough about it to prioritize it to the top of my list. It has no relevance or importance to me content wise, cinematic wise, knowledge wise. There is nothing new to learn or experience in it for me. Spending an hour or two watching a bloated pork sandwich munching walrus (and apologies to the walruses out there, also apologies to pork sandwich lovers out there, it *is* yummy) using underhanded carny tricks to fool easily manipulated idiots on the big screen while wasting $$$ is not my pasttime. I am not going to waste my time and resource and going out looking for it or sneaking into a theatre either.

How about giving us your version of the values that it espouses or why you think people ought to watch it?

You too, can add value to the discussion at hand.

otherwise, you have a nice great summer day too.



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Tuesday, June 29, 2004 11:16 AM

CREVANREAVER


Quote:

Originally posted by Jasonzzz:


Hi Crevanreaver, thanks for the posting. That's a great review. Where's the URL link for the article online?

CREVANREAVER posted:

Unfairenheit 9/11

The lies of Michael Moore.
By Christopher Hitchens
Posted Monday, June 21, 20



Sorry it took me so long to reply to you Jasonzzz. Here is the link to the article by Hitchens.

http://slate.msn.com/id/2102723/

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Tuesday, June 29, 2004 11:36 AM

SUCCATASH


Quote:

Originally posted by Jasonzzz:
Nothing that I have read or seen so far has motivated me to care enough about it.... It has no relevance or importance to me content wise, cinematic wise, knowledge wise. There is nothing new to learn or experience in it for me.

If you don't care, why are you whining so loudly?

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Tuesday, June 29, 2004 12:13 PM

JASONZZZ


hmmm... maybe you missed the context. I'll repeat it in smaller and fewer words this time. And with newer and improved prompting this time around.

[Get Ready]

WRT the content of the movie, nothing that I've read or seen suggests there is anything new for me. There is nothing to learn. Nothing new regarding style of substance either.

[pay attention here, here's the kicker]

What matters is the indecent method that MM is distorting this stuff and spewing it into your lap.

You folks complain about how the Bushites are manipulating the you and the media and how all the sheeps are just absent-mindedly eating it up. Well, why don't you monkeys wake up a bit and see how you are being manipulated by your predisposed hatred for Bush, all ready to empty your pockets for MM's benefit, all google-eyed to praise him for his "greatness", and ready to carry forth the complete desecration of real journalism and real documentarians?

You have traded one master for another. And you don't see it as what it is. You are still being manipulated, but this time by someone professing to be your "friend". Ha. Wake up.

Quote:

Originally posted by Succatash:
Quote:

Originally posted by Jasonzzz:
Nothing that I have read or seen so far has motivated me to care enough about it.... It has no relevance or importance to me content wise, cinematic wise, knowledge wise. There is nothing new to learn or experience in it for me.



If you don't care, why are you whining so loudly?




You know what, nevermind the entire thing. Let's try something else.



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Tuesday, June 29, 2004 1:11 PM

GHOULMAN


Quote:

QUICKSAND wrote brilliantly: Liberal media, my rosey red a**.

XOXO



You rock! It's high time the Right Wing Media is addressed. After all, a Mega-Media Corporation can't be seen as liberal. At least not by anyone sane.

Quote:

Originally posted by Melee:
Quote:

Originally posted by Succatash:

I felt sick the day we attacked Iraq. The country was in a fever to spread Freedom, destroy Evil, and take revenge for 9/11.

The Bush administration fed us loads of crap before we attacked Iraq. They sold us the war, treated it like pure business marketing. Terrorism, Good vs. Evil, Imminent Danger, FREEDOM! Then most Americans started jumping up and down like trained monkeys.

Michael Moore comes around and makes a movie that says, "Wake up and take a look around!"

And lots of monkeys got angry.




Nicely put Tash (and on a totally unrelated subject: yay for being one of the only people I still recognize around here!).

Brill.

It's so sad how these Bush supporters go on and on... what are they supporting? The elite rich of thier country. Huh? Why?

Why don't they support bringing home American soldiers before a whole generation is slaughtered yet again?

Why don't they support a strong and trusted USA? A USA that doesn't, you know, illegally invade other countries and bomb the people into the stone age. Iraq WAS a modern state you know.

Why do they protect a government that has made a mockery of the USA? Why would anyone support a President who has used the power of the Office to take America back 20 years into another Vietnam conflict? And yea... American soldiers will be in Iraq for years to come.

Why support Bush/Cheney?

If you are all for the War on Terrorism, then wouldn't you see the Iraq invasion as giving the terrorists exactly what they want? Personally, if I were Osama I'd be happy as a clam that Bush invaded. It gives Ossama far more reason to hate America and insite terror attacks.

Why does the Right Wing Media support Bush? Because the mega-media corporations are... CORPORATIONS! They support politics. They push the agenda. Just like Rush Limbaugh, who is the model, I suppose. And just to give the terrorists everything they ever dreamed of, the press gives them up front air time. Well, it's unethical to give terrorists air time like that because it's what the terrorists want! Why is this forgotten? We knew this in terrorist attacks in years past so...

Why do Americans support the Iraq Invasion? Well, they don't anymore. Why did they before? Because their government lied to them. Because their news estate lied to them too.

Why do the Bush supporters tell us (over and over) that it "wasn't torture". Well, it is. And the USA will pay for that hubris.

I noticed that when someone posts an opinion that isn't supportive of Bush, the Right Wing neocon rhetoric comes out right way from... oh, I won't name names. Let's just say it's those morons who come into 'our' threads and make a mess, while thier own threads die because no one agrees with them (or even likes them). So they just troll and hijack threads in thier ... I don't know. Fiery rightiousness? Yea... that sounds about right.

I'll be going now as my spider sences tell me a list of URLS is about to appear. Oh, and all the URLs will lead to right wing bullplop from writers who are famous for... right wing bullplop. BULLPLOP!!!


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Tuesday, June 29, 2004 7:02 PM

SIGMANUNKI


Quote:

Originally posted by Melee:
*raises hand* Um, ah, not to be rude or anything, and I could be wrong... but wasn't this thread supposed to be a discussion of the movie? When did it turn into an argument about Michael Moore's personal integrity?



Well, when speaking about MM, things tend to get political quite fast.

But, I must also note that I took a break from this site (got really busy) for two days *and look at this *!!!

Everyone (well alot) has gotten *way to irritated* and has gone too far. From calling people names to assuming people live in fantasy worlds. Doesn't anyone know when this thread got out of control? Maybe Haken should enable a lock feature on threads to prevent such things.

*shakes head* Way outta hand.

----
"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show

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Wednesday, June 30, 2004 12:58 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

raises hand* Um, ah, not to be rude or anything, and I could be wrong... but wasn't this thread supposed to be a discussion of the movie? When did it turn into an argument about Michael Moore's personal integrity?


When the right wing decided they didn't like the message so they decided to kill the messenger. Everyone who says somehting negative about Bush- whether it's Karen Kwiatkowski or O'Neill or Joe Wilson or Clarke or "anonymous CIA officer" eventually gets buried with innuendo and slime.

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Wednesday, June 30, 2004 8:33 PM

DORAN


When the right wing decided they didn't like the message so they decided to kill the messenger. Everyone who says somehting negative about Bush- whether it's Karen Kwiatkowski or O'Neill or Joe Wilson or Clarke or "anonymous CIA officer" eventually gets buried with innuendo and slime."

Yeah, what you said! Just look what those guys did to poor Vince Foster.. no wait.. oh never mind.

:O)


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Thursday, July 1, 2004 12:15 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Jasonzzz- what would you say if I told you that I followed the uls and can say unequivocally and definitively that they are 99% cr*p?

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Thursday, July 1, 2004 4:24 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


going down the posts one by one - looked up Debbie Schlussel

http://www.politicalusa.com/columnists/schlussel/Default.htm

"Debbie Schlussel, a conservative political commentator, columnist, and business, sports & entertainment attorney/sports agent, is a University of Michigan graduate, and holds both Law and MBA Degrees from the University of Wisconsin."

It helps when one has a cv on the commentator.


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Thursday, July 1, 2004 5:08 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


http://www.dailycampus.com/news/2004/02/03/Focus/Christopher.Hitchens.
Explains.Why.Left.Is.Not.Right-595858.shtml


Christopher Hitchens

His support for the Iraq war probably explains his review of F 9/11:

In 2002, following a highly publicized guerre de plume with author Noam Chomsky over American culpability for the Sept. 11 attacks, Hitchens left the weekly liberal magazine The Nation, where his bi-weekly column the "Minority Report" had appeared since 1982.

This and Hitchens' subsequent support for the Iraq war have made him a virtual pariah among the left ...

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Thursday, July 1, 2004 5:32 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


MACBAKER:

First you said

"Read the reviews above, they expose the "propaganda" style fact twisting that Michael Moore is infamous for. He's like P.T. Barnam. He's a showman, but he's no docmentary filmmaker. IMHO" and,
"Sorry Tink, but I'm not the only one calling his tripe propaganda." (Then you posted pages of Debbie Schlussel.)

Then you said

"I agree completely that Debbie's review is right wing, and YES it IS propaganda!!!! ... Your fatal flaw in logic, is assuming that I share her views!"

If you meant you didn't share her views on the movie - then better contradictory words were never spoken !

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Thursday, July 1, 2004 6:07 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


I can't believe all the postings from people who say they have read nothing that makes them think F9/11 is different from Moore's other movies (What were they reading, then?), then go on to summarize the movie as propaganda (but haven't seen it !)

.... sheesh

There's nothing like an 'informed' opinion.

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Thursday, July 1, 2004 6:39 PM

DORAN


"His support for the Iraq war probably explains his review of F 9/11:"

So let me see if I'm understanding you here.. Those that support the troops and the war in Iraq will not have good things to say about Moore's flick - is that about it?

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Thursday, July 1, 2004 7:01 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


Saw the movie:

I thought it tried to cover too much ground. And Moore backed off of topics. There were several parts where he was just getting to the center of an issue ... and then he left it. The movie would have been better served if Moore had cut down the number of topics but pursued the remaining ones in greater depth.

I am a strong believer in first-hand information. Recognizing that, and that even documentaries are not scholarly research referenced up the wazoo, I think Moore did only a fair job of putting up on screen the things the Administration leaves out of its carefully scripted and staged pronouncements.

Some things stood out - at the beginning, before the Administration's 'theatre' goes on and the players are getting ready, putting on their makeup, reviewing their lines, combing their hair, the footage of Bush trying out different expressions for the camera was seriously disconcerting. There was no real connection between the message content and the man - it was faked. And like Dan Rather, I found Bush's reaction during 9/11 to be - horrifying. Words don't do it justice - you'd have to see it for yourself.

I thought the most eloquent part was when a Corporal, who'd served in Iraq, said he wouldn't go back because he didn't want to again be in a situation where one poor person was killing another poor person, for no reason.

On leaving the film, I had two distinct impressions: 1) there was a collage of issues to be sorted out at some later time, and 2) the case that Bush lied about Iraq was skillfully, irrefutably, and subtly made.

You don't have to agree with Moore's musings about why Iraq to know the country was had.


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Thursday, July 1, 2004 7:07 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


Doran,

I didn't generalize. Iraq and this particular author have a well-known history.

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Saturday, July 3, 2004 6:03 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


YOO HOO!!

To those who cite right-wing reviews of MM's film as "proof" that he lied... Unlike you, I actually did look into your URLs. I really don't have the time to go point-by-point with each one, but I WILL give a signficant examples from each one about how they are full of...Oh hell, I'll just call it horseh*t.

--------------------------
MICHAEL DALY

"Moore tries to prove that President Bush was somehow culpable in Islamo-Arab attacks on the US in September 2001...that the US somehow staged attacks on its own soil."

That was not the point of the film! Did he even SEE it???

---------------------------------

DEBBIE SCHUSSEL

Debbie's piece is full of trivia and innuendo. I cut out a lot of verbiage to make her points clearer (I hope)

"The close relationship between ... the current President and the Saudi Royal Family is troubling... They foster and fund madrasas, mosques, and clerics who preach the death of the West, Christians, and Jews. They hold telethons to fund the "martyrs" and allowed Al-Qaeda to grow. Women can’t drive, and non-Muslims are the equivalent of slaves. Saudi Ambassador Prince Bandar is slimy and dishonest. But...given the large Saudi investment in our economy... a change in Saudi leadership could result in the collapse of our economy...That is why it’s important for Bush to remain on good terms with the sleazy country that is the home to public beheadings and 15 of the 19 hijackers."

This might explain POLITICAL delicacy but it doesn't explain the BUSINESS relationships between Bush and the House of Saud, which have been fully documented elsewhere.

"Jim McDermott was on the take from Saddam Hussein.... Mr. Alkhafaji... gave Congressman McDermott $5,000 in October 2002 for McDermott’s legal defense fund"

$5000??? OMG!! Thats sure makes several billion dollars look like peanuts!

"Very telling is the presence of the Al-Jazeera microphone in one segment of a women crying, "Allah Hu Akbar" (Allah is Great). Moore apparently thinks the sympathetic Terrorist News Network (Al-Jazeera) is the epitome of accurate news reporting... Moore exploits the grief of Lila Lipscomb, the mother of a soldier who died in Iraq. She denounces Bush and the War."

Yes, the fact that media is present means it's all faked.

"What about the meeting between hijacker Mohammed Atta and Iraqi Intelligence agents in the Czech Republic before 9-11?"

Meeting with people doesn't mean cooperating with them. Our intelligence officers "meet with" all kinds of people, including terrorists. There IS evidence that al Qaida asked Saddam for help and was turned away.

"What about the Iraqi training camp in Salman Pak where Al-Qaeda used abandoned planes to train to hijack them?"

The information was given by a "defector" supplied by Ahmed Chalabi. Both have since been determined by CIA to be unreliable.

"What about Ramzi Youssef, the Iraqi Secret Service agent and mastermind of the 1993 WTC bombing, who is the nephew of 9-11 Al-Qaeda mastermind, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed?"

Yes, what about Youssef? It's believed he was a native of the Baluchistan area of Pakistan, and grew up in Kuwait. His only connection to Iraq was that he entered the USA on a FAKE Iraqi passport.

OK, I'm tired of wading though crap. You get the idea. On to the next...


-----------------------

CHRISTOPHER HITCHINS




"Fahrenheit 9/11 makes the following points about Bin Laden and about Afghanistan, and makes them in this order:

1) The Bin Laden family (if not exactly Osama himself) had a close if convoluted business relationship with the Bush family, through the Carlyle Group.... (so) Either the Saudis run U.S. policy (through family ties or overwhelming economic interest) or they do not...As allies and patrons of the Taliban regime, they either opposed Bush's removal of it, or they did not. "

The business relationship has been documented in great detail. And Chris must realize that both USA and Saudi foreign policy are not an either-or proposition. Afghanistan is small potatoes compared to other Saudi interests

2) Saudi capital in general is a very large element of foreign investment in the United States.

Yes, this is true.

3) The Unocal company in Texas had been willing to discuss a gas pipeline across Afghanistan with the Taliban, as had other vested interests.

So is this. I got this off the Unocal website. They were in competition with the Argentinian firm Bridas, which eventually got the contract.

4) The Bush administration sent far too few ground troops to Afghanistan and thus allowed far too many Taliban and al-Qaida members to escape.

OBL is still at large, isn't he?

5) The Afghan government, in supporting the coalition in Iraq, was purely risible in that its non-army was purely American.

I've looked across a number of websites. In 2003, there were NO Afghanistan troops deployed in Iraq. Whatever troops were "from Afghanistan" were USA troops.
www.theglobalist.com/DBWeb/StoryId.aspx?StoryId=3592


6) The American lives lost in Afghanistan have been wasted.

I certainly didn't get this message from the film. But if this is Chris' point, then he must know that the fruits of our interventions don't ripen for ten years or so. The UNINTENDED consequences take 40 years to come home to roost.

------------------------------
The other URLs have similar SIGNIFICANT flaws. If MM's critics can dissemble or be mistaken so egregiously, how can I take what they say seriously?

I do agree with Rue- I thought the film didn't explore things deeply enough. But then, it would have been dry and boring and MM was going for emotional impact. Knowing what I know from other sources, MM's movie is mainly correct. I found the seven minutes of Bush in the classroom deeply disturbing- a point that NONE of the critics touch on because it is so painfully obvious that without someone telling Bush what to do he's frozen.

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Sunday, July 4, 2004 12:38 PM

ZIL


I've had to deal with a lot of the insanity surounding moore's movie these past weeks... questions and accusations... I'm the manager of a movie theater. and we were one of the 3 theaters in maine to get the film. I had to fight to get it and I'm glad we have it. sad to say I'm not that politically minded, thats my own fault, I'd rather vote for broccoli than any of the candidates nominates thus far... but I'll tell you I think its a brilliant film. not for its views, not for its factualness, not for the shock and awe factor, but because its doing something thats been needed for a long time. its getting people interested in their government! and thats an awesome thing. weither they go out and vote to get bush out of office or they vote for bush because the film effected them negatively it gets them to vote! if all this film does is that... its good.

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Tuesday, July 6, 2004 12:27 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Huh.

Interesting to hear about it from YOUR viewpoint!

MM's movie was the only one in many years where people actually clapped at the end of the movie... and where two police cars were parked out in front.

Glad to hear that you're taking a bigger view on it all than just $$$.

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Friday, July 9, 2004 8:55 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Doran, I have a question for you (and others) under the "demonization" thread. It's a real question. Hope you read and respond. Thanks!

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Wednesday, August 11, 2004 11:46 PM

JAYNEZTOWN


might be a good enough film to watch ( hopefully provide some good ideas about why Bush has made a mess of things )

there may be another powerful film on tonight
Quote:

..
09:30 PM ET -HBO-
Filmmaker James Miller and reporter Saira Shah, who previously worked together on the award-winning documentaries "Unholy War" and "Beneath the Veil," set out in the spring of 2003 to make a film about the culture of hate that permeates much of the Middle East. Starting in Palestine, the team met three children -- 12-year-old Ahmed, 12-year-old Mohammed and 16-year-old Najla -- who make up a small part of the "next generation" being groomed to continue the creed of Jihad. Unfortunately, Miller himself was shot down by extremists before filming was completed. A timely and thought-provoking special is the result..




hard to get un-biased media today



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Thursday, August 12, 2004 12:28 PM

HKCAVALIER


http://www.troubletown.com/cartoons/index.html

I love Troubletown!

"The Middle East is so evil, the place should be nuked to Hell! That's what I'd do...but George Bush has so much compassion, he wants to give 'em a chance!"

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Wednesday, March 29, 2006 8:40 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


FREE VIDEO DOWNLOAD: Fahrenheit 9/11
www.patridiots.com/001092.html


www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0611-02.htm

Quote:

Michael Moore wrote:

pirate my film, no problem (since I already got paid $100-million)


Fury as Fahrenheit 9/11 director backs allegedly "illegal" not-for-profit downloads - Controversial film-maker Michael Moore has welcomed the appearance on the internet of pirated copies of his anti-Bush documentary Fahrenheit 9/11 and claimed he is happy for anybody to download it free of charge. The activist, author and director told the Sunday Herald that, as long as pirated copies of his film were not being sold, he had no problem with it being downloaded. “I don’t agree with the copyright laws and I don’t have a problem with people downloading the movie and sharing it with people as long as they’re not trying to make a profit off my labour. I would oppose that,” he said. “I do well enough already and I made this film because I want the world, to change. The more people who see it the better, so I’m happy this is happening.” Moore’s views have not been well received by Hollywood’s establishment, which is fighting a war against the online pirates it claims cost the industry £1.6 billion a year in lost sales. Jack Valenti, the outgoing president of the Motion Picture Association of America (MPAA), an industry that steals billions of dollars in "venture capital" from private pension funds and from government CAFR pension funds, said: “Piracy is having a dramatic impact on the creators and copyright owners of this nation, and its defeat depends largely on the commit ment and resolve of the entire industry. File sharing causes tremendous financial loss to the movie business, untold hardship to support workers, and costs thousands of jobs.” Distributed via websites such as suprnova.org, which lays claim to having served more than 17 million downloads, Moore’s documentary critique of the Bush administration’s red, white and blue rush into war with Iraq is among the web’s hottest properties. Thousands of copies of Fahrenheit 9/11 have already been downloaded, each taking about 3.5 hours over a broadband connection. Moore said: “Is it wrong for someone who’s bought a film on DVD to let a friend watch it for free? Of course it’s not. It never has been and never will be. I think information, art and ideas should be shared.” Fahrenheit 9/11 exposes CIA Bush family partnership with CIA Bin Laden family in Carlyle Group that owns Universal Studios, and exposes George Bush Jr's bizarre alibi on 9/11. Moore is Jewish and his documentary was funded by Jew Michael Eisner at Disney ABC News which censored Jewish General Lemnitzer's Operation Northwoods treason by Pentagon to hijack and bomb US robot airliners by remote control and terrorize US cities to blame an innocent nation - This is Hollywood's only megabuck attempt to tell at least part of the truth of Bush Gang's treason - POTUS LIHOP Theory: Bush Let It Happen On Purpose (But Never Mind That He Made It Happen On Purpose) - By WWW.MichaelMoore.com



FREE 9/11 VIDEO DOWNLOADS:
www.piratenews.org/video-archive.html

Quote:

Kevin Smith: Well, you don't have to have them come out and say it. Look at their body of works. Look what they're doing. What did Joss Whedon's Serenity and Firefly series tell you? What are they trying to tell you through their craft?

Alex Jones: What does V For Vendetta say?

Kevin Smith: Even better. I just saw it last week. I left V For Vendetta walking on a cloud. I say, we're gonna win!

Alex Jones: Let me tell ya what's happening. I can't get into details. But major Hollywood people are being pressured Big Time to SHUT UP. If I could only tell you folks. I then confirmed from a prominent 9/11 leader, that one of the biggest musicians in the world, one of the most loved, is very close to going public. It's so close. And they're watching to see what happens with Charlie Sheen, who hit the barbed wire for us. But again, CNN wouldn't have Ed Asner on last night. They were gonna have him, then they cancelled him. They cancelled because they cannot deal with it.

Infowars Radio, March 29, 2006
www.infowars.com/articles/sept11/asner_on_cnn.htm

CNN VIDEO DOWNLOAD: "GEORGE BUSH IS A DICTATOR."
BUFFY'S SETH GREEN SUPPORTS CHARLIE SHEEN:
www.infowars.com/video/clips/news/september_11/032406_showbiz_tonight_
guests_wm.htm


Red Dawn FOR REAL: Charlie Sheen says Bush perped 9/11
www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=18&t=19100



"You can't stop the signal!"
-Mr Universe, STM, Pirate TV

FIREFLY SERENITY PILOT MUSIC VIDEO (VERSION 2)
Tangerine Dream - Thief Soundtrack: Confrontation
http://radio.indymedia.org/news/2006/03/8912.php

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Thursday, March 30, 2006 7:02 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Since this has been revived...

Moore is an employer of what I call 'reverse-spin.' In his 'documentary' Bowling for Columbine, he re-edited footage to make it appear that things were being said out of context and even out of chronology.

I'm grateful I saw Bowling first, because I'd elsewise be inclined to believe everything he said at face value.

The fact is, Moore just spins things in the opposite direction of the administration. Neither the administration nor the Moore films show a plain, balanced view. Both people have agendas, and it behooves us all to take both mouthpieces with a saltshaker.

--Anthony


"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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