REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Catalan Independence Vote (WSJ)

POSTED BY: SIGNYM
UPDATED: Monday, November 10, 2014 10:55
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Saturday, November 8, 2014 1:06 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

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Sunday, November 9, 2014 11:18 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


As of 3PM local time, 1.1 million Catalans voted ....


Catalonia holds non-binding vote on independence

Quote:


The people of Catalonia in north-eastern Spain are voting in a disputed and non-binding poll on independence. The Spanish judiciary has ruled the vote unconstitutional but Catalan leader Artur Mas warned against any attempt to disrupt it. Spain's constitutional court suspended earlier plans for a referendum on secession.

Prime Minister Mariano Rajoy said the vote would have no effect and urged the region to return to "sanity".

Voters will be asked whether they want a Catalan state and whether that state should be independent.

More than 40,000 volunteers are helping to set up and run the informal exercise.

As of 13:00 local time (11:00am GMT), 1.1 million people had voted, according to the Catalan government.

Catalonia is a wealthy region of 7.5 million people and contributes more to the Spanish economy than it gets back through central government funds. Economic and cultural grievances have fuelled Catalan nationalism.

The BBC's Europe correspondent Chris Morris says many Catalans have always felt that they do not quite fit in a unitary state. He says there is a long history of support for winning independence from Spain, or at least much greater autonomy within it....

Many Catalans [who, BTW, speak a separate language- SIGNY] think of themselves as a separate nation from the rest of Spain. This feeling is fed by memories of the Franco dictatorship, which attempted to suppress Catalan identity...

Catalonia adopted a charter in 2006 giving it "nation" status but this was overruled by the Constitutional Court in 2010.

Independence supporters hope that a strong vote of support will put more pressure on the central government to open negotiations over more tax and political autonomy, ultimately leading to a full-blown independence referendum. They say that support from more than 1.5 million Catalans would add weight to their cause.





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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Sunday, November 9, 2014 6:31 PM

FREMDFIRMA



Didn't work so well last time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolutionary_Catalonia

Mainly cause every motherfucking Government on the planet saw them as a threat and acted against em, including ours.
Which is of course, admission of a failed system, cause if the mere EXISTENCE of an alternative is enough to crumble it, your system (Gov, Corp, Religious, etc) is already a disastrous failure, and if the only way you can keep it going is to eliminate everything else... you're a monster.

Mind you, none of this bodes well for them, cause for one, every time the Catalans have invited non-anarchists to work with them, treachery, perfidy and betrayal have immediately followed, and even from a nationalist perspective they still retain enough of that flavor to draw the ire of every Gov on the planet, just like before, which means they're doomed either way, even if they "win" they'll be so flooded with provocateurs and saboteurs the whole enterprise is doomed to fail.

Until humanity evolves a bit emotionally, psychologically and socially - something our entire society, economy, and so-called-education systems are designed to PREVENT, since it would put the sociopaths out of the loop by destroying a ruinous status quo benefitting the few of them at the expense of the many... the ONLY way you'll ever manage to take and hold an actual anarchist society/nationstate(if the latter applies to em, which it don't, not really) is to build it right on top of a big goddamn nuclear weapon.
And even *that* might not be enough, cause it's worth remembering we're dealing with folk totally willing to blow this whole planet into an uninhabitable radioactive wasteland rather than not be fully in charge of every fuckin scrap of it.

Only place even partially viable to try it anyways would be the scandanavian nations, which are far more culturally sane than the rest of the alleged first world.

-F

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Monday, November 10, 2014 10:55 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


80% of Catalans say 'Yes' to independence in symbolic ‘referendum’

An overwhelming majority of Catalans have said “yes” to independence and secession from the central Spanish government in Madrid in a highly-anticipated but symbolic referendum poll on Sunday.

Some 80.72 percent voted to form a state independent of Spain, Joana Ortega, vice president Catalonia said shortly after midnight, with over two million Catalans reportedly turning out for the unofficial referendum. Ortega could not immediately give an official turnout rate since there was no formal electoral roll for some [estimated] 5.4 million registered Catalan voters.


However, the turnout rate was approximately 40%. The referendum organizers thought that the non-binding election would be a success if over 1 million people voted; 2 million people came out to vote.

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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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