Gender and Violence and Blame by Magonsdaughter

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Gender and Violence and Blame

POSTED BY: MAGONSDAUGHTER
UPDATED: Sunday, January 20, 2013 15:56
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Monday, January 14, 2013 7:32 PM

I wouldn't call it inevitable so much as cyclical. If power just kept consolidating forever we'd be pretty screwed. But power and corruption tends to cause the civilizations supporting it to collapse.

But something you can do, besides the other idea I gave of a more democratic market, treating business just like government and elections, is to ditch the fiat currency. The idea of a vote by money isn't a bad on paper, as in boycotting bad corporate citizens, but in practice money is one of the things in this society that can become consolidated, and eventually money consolidated is a vote that drowns out the much smaller vote of smaller wage earners. I think one of the ways we can tackle this is maybe changing just how money works.

Really that's just two ideas out of many. There's lots of different tacks a person or group of persons or individuals could take to avoid or reduce the creep of corruption and power consolidation. increasing government isn't one I would do, but maybe some people have an idea how that could work, so for their society, they can try that.

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Sunday, January 20, 2013 8:50 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

I hate to drag this thread back from the grave, but I've been awfully busy and haven't had a chance to respond.

BYTE: I think you're on to something about money, but it's not just "fiat" money that's the problem, it could be ANY money.... gold, paper, cowrie shells, bullets, cigarettes, water, gasoline.... whatever it is that people are using for more-or-less universal exchange. (The requirements for currencies is that they are fungible, divisible, scarce, and recognizable.) Once something .... anything... is scarce and universally exchangeable, it is possible to hoard it, loan it, use it to pay enforcers etc. So it's not just "fiat" money, it's ANY money. Money of any sort will always be a problem; the only answers are either (1) regulate what can be done with it ... ie outlaw interest-bearing loans and profits or (2) outlaw if altogether.

Also, another source of concentrated power is propaganda and control of the means of communication. There is NO society that can be enforced solely on the basis of violent coercion over a long period of time. People support their oppressors because they share the same assumptions.

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Sunday, January 20, 2013 10:55 AM

BYTEMITE

Pretty much. I think the interest bearing loans and credit are more dangerous than profits, so long as you have a decent employee wage lobby. But... I can see your point there kinda. It's just tricky because while some people are motivated by creativity and discovery, other people really are motivated by the earn-and-buy mentality.

That's almost why I think you have to have multiple independent economic systems going on at the same time, maybe even redundant systems. You won't have one that everyone prefers, which means trouble for a US-based global economy which I'm sure some people like and find a comfort, but you won't have these money overlords like the banks and you also won't have as much danger in the event of economic turbulence or collapse.

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Sunday, January 20, 2013 3:56 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Quote:
it's not just "fiat" money that's the problem, it could be ANY money.... gold, paper, cowrie shells, bullets, cigarettes, water, gasoline.... whatever it is that people are using for more-or-less universal exchange.

Including, of all the bloody things, Tide Detergent.
http://consumerist.com/2013/01/18/how-tide-became-an-underground-curre
ncy/

That being one thing which makes me snicker over certain preppers, yes Gold and Silver are precious commodities which probably would retain some "value", but you can't eat them, heat a home with them or defend it (well, maybe - as a bludgeon, meh heh).

Far more valueable, is KNOWLEDGE, that's always been true, always will be.
Especially in a shortage situation where proper lines of supply are lacking, the guy who can fix your generator with a handful of tools and scraps suddenly becomes a lot more important.
And it doesn't have any weight or space requirements, save maybe books to help share it.

Quote:
There is NO society that can be enforced solely on the basis of violent coercion over a long period of time. People support their oppressors because they share the same assumptions.

Or because they support the agenda of those oppressors despite the historically obvious notion they'll be first under the bus when things tip over - your standard-issue brownshirts, as it were.
As I have pointed out many a time, what gives folks like them power is people willing to take their orders, for without that, they're just one more loudmouth in a world of plenty, no more dangerous than the average mugger if even that.

As for the rest, in many decent societies Usury has been a crime, and rightfully so.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usury
It has ALWAYS been a destructive force, and besides oil and religion, that's also a third drive behind these dumbass neo-crusaders hating on Islam, they're just unaware of WHY the big banks support the drive to war, other than profit, of course.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_banking
Not all causes of conflict are immediately obvious, or primary, but I do suspect this as a secondary drive.

One thing CoTL ran on in order to prevent concentration of power was what I call sand castle heirarchy.
Basically when a situation occurs, someone is selected by mutual accord due to knowledge, experience, familiarity with topic, etc - this usually didn't come to a vote so much as someone "Got Volunteered" cause everyone looked in their direction at about the same time.
And viola, they're in charge, and from that point can assign supervisors and so on, up till the moment the issue is resolved, at which point the whole temped command structure is dissolved.
Of course, yes, a certain bit of laziness crept in after a while and folks started lookin at me by default, at which point I would just grin and say "I have no idea!" thus enforcing a "pass" and they had to get someone else.
It worked pretty well for small groups, but the principle is pretty sound.

-Frem

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