REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

And in ACTUAL news... ObamaCare SURPRISE ! $ 111 BILLION more than expected. ( So far)

POSTED BY: AURAPTOR
UPDATED: Wednesday, March 7, 2012 12:26
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 993
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Friday, March 2, 2012 3:54 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


And I'm guessing this is BEFORE Obama trying to mandate free contraception ,for all.

Soaring cost estimate for Obama's health care law prompts questions by GOP congressman

WASHINGTON (AP) — Cost estimates for a key portion of President Barack Obama’s health care overhaul law have ballooned by $111 billion from last year’s budget, and a senior Republican lawmaker on Friday demanded an explanation.

House Ways and Means Committee Chairman Dave Camp, R-Mich., wants to know by Monday why the estimated cost of helping millions of middle-class Americans buy health insurance has jumped by about 30 percent for an eight-year period, from 2014-2021.

Administration officials say the explanation lies in budget technicalities and that there are no significant changes in the program that would raise concerns.
( WHAT ?? )

Cost estimates for new government programs can be wide off the mark. For example, the actual cost of President George W. Bush’s Medicare prescription drug benefit came in lower than estimated, so it wasn’t as big a drag on federal finances as initially forecast.

Cost overruns for the health care overhaul could create new political problems for Obama by undermining the law’s promise to reduce federal deficits. The revised health care numbers, buried deep in the president’s budget, stumped lawmakers and some administration officials earlier in the week. At a congressional hearing Tuesday, Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius, who is in charge of carrying out the health care law, indicated she was unaware of the changes.
( WOW - big shocker there! )

At issue are subsidies that will be provided under the health care law to help middle class people buy private coverage in new state insurance markets that open in 2014. Last year’s budget estimated the cost of the aid to be $367 billion from 2014-2021.

This year’s budget puts it at $478 billion over the same period.
“This staggering increase ... cannot be explained by legislative changes or new economic assumptions, and therefore must reflect substantial changes in underlying assumptions regarding ... costs,” Camp wrote Friday in a letter to Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner.

http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2012/03/soaring_cost_estimate_f
or_obam.html



" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Sunday, March 4, 2012 7:39 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


No surprise there, they always say things will be cheaper and then drop the actual price on the masses afterwords.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Monday, March 5, 2012 2:44 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by RionaEire:
No surprise there, they always say things will be cheaper and then drop the actual price on the masses afterwords.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya





No kidding. Iraq has cost us about a trillion bucks more than the original claimed price of $17 billion.

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

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Monday, March 5, 2012 8:54 AM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!




Transgender hormone treatments, abortion access for detained illegals irks congressman

Hormone treatments for transgendered detainees, abortion services and extensive outlets for complaints — these are just a few of the reasons Texas Republican House Judiciary Committee Chairman Rep. Lamar Smith is not pleased with the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement’s (ICE) recently released Performance-Based National Detention Standards (PBNDS).

In the spirit of detention reform, in 2011, for the first time since 2008, ICE finished its revision of detention standards for those being held for being in the country illegally. Those new standards were released this month. ICE has already started to implement the changes.

“PBNDS 2011 is crafted to improve medical and mental health services, increase access to legal services and religious opportunities, improve communication with detainees with limited English proficiency, improve the process for reporting and responding to complaints, reinforce protections against sexual abuse and assault, and increase recreation and visitation,” an ICE representative explained in its PBNDS fact sheet.

According to Smith, however, the revisions amount to a vast and expensive expansion of privileges.

“The Obama administration’s new detention manual is more like a hospitality guideline for illegal immigrants,” Smith wrote in a statement. “The administration goes beyond common sense to accommodate illegal immigrants and treats them better than citizens in federal custody.”



The standards chronicle a wide range of amenities and rights accorded to each detainee during their stay, including extensive regulations on things such as body searches, room space, recreational time, visitation, the interaction ICE officials can have with them and food expectations — including adherence to detainee dietary restrictions. (RELATED: Full coverage of illegal immigration)

The standards also outline a wide range of medical procedures available to those in detention facilities, including services such as abortion access, hormone treatments for transgendered people, dental work and a 15-day supply of medications upon release, deportation or transfer.

An ICE representative said that the new procedures are fiscally sound.

“It is important to note that one of the main goals of the agency, in addition to prioritizing the health and safety of detainees in our custody and improving conditions of confinement, is to increase fiscal prudence and efficiencies within the system,” the ICE representative explained to The Daily Caller.

While the official said these changes are geared toward fiscal prudence, Smith is not buying it.

“Illegal immigration already costs American taxpayers billions each year, and these increased regulations force them to keep an open tab for illegal immigrants,” Smith said.

According to ICE, average agency cost to remove an alien is about $10,043, but that figure does not include the average costs to other agencies that are involved in the immigration enforcement process. Total removal costs taxpayers between $23,000 and $30,000 per alien.

“[P]art of ICE’s detention reform efforts are also aimed at putting detention centers in strategic locations that reduce detainee transfers within the detention system and increase overall operational efficiencies, allowing for a reduction in detainees’ average length of stay in ICE custody (by an average of 14 days) and subsequent cost savings for the federal government,” an ICE representative explained. “Overall, ICE’s detention reform efforts, including the implementation of PBNDS 2011, are designed to improve medical care, custodial conditions, fiscal prudence and oversight of the immigration detention system, and reinforce protections against sexual abuse and assault.”

NEXT: ICE's unhappy union

http://dailycaller.com/2012/03/01/transgender-hormone-treatments-abort
ion-access-for-detained-illegals-irks-congressman
/


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Monday, March 5, 2012 8:56 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Quote:

Originally posted by RionaEire:
No surprise there, they always say things will be cheaper and then drop the actual price on the masses afterwords.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya





No kidding. Iraq has cost us about a trillion bucks more than the original claimed price of $17 billion.




Then you're for limited govt ?

Sounding a lot like a TEA PARTIER there!


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Monday, March 5, 2012 9:10 AM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Obama Slashes Soldiers' Benefits to Pay Back Healthcare Industry Donors
30% to 78% increase in Tricare annual premiums for the first year
In five years, service members will expect an increase ranging from 94% to 345%
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2012/02/29/obama-slashes-soldiers-b
enefits-to-benefit-healthcare-industry-donors



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Monday, March 5, 2012 9:12 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Quote:

Originally posted by RionaEire:
No surprise there, they always say things will be cheaper and then drop the actual price on the masses afterwords.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya





No kidding. Iraq has cost us about a trillion bucks more than the original claimed price of $17 billion.




Then you're for limited govt ?

Sounding a lot like a TEA PARTIER there!


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "




That would mean that you AREN'T a tea partier, since you have never once ceased your unfailing support for both the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.

You also don't believe in any "limited government" when it comes to equal rights, privacy rights, or abortion rights.

So I'd have to say that I probably sound a lot more like a tea partier than you, who supposed IS one of them.

'Course, that's no surprise, really. Remember when that socialist Brit proved that he understood libertarianism so much better than you? :)

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

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Monday, March 5, 2012 9:24 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


KPO never proved that.

You completely distorted my views, again, so that proves nothing. But that's nothing new.

But glad you're sounding like a TEA partier. Maybe you'll get out to some rallies this summer.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Monday, March 5, 2012 9:34 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
KPO never proved that.



Because you bitched out.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, March 5, 2012 9:58 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
KPO never proved that.



Because you bitched out.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"



Isn't that sexists ? Why do you hate women so much, that you'd resort to the use of a derogatory female pejorative for a nonsensical 'duel' that never had any merit from its basis ?




" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Monday, March 5, 2012 10:03 AM

KPO

"Love is natural and real. But not for you my love. Not tonight my love..."


Quote:

Remember when that socialist Brit proved that he understood libertarianism so much better than you? :)




For the record I despise both Socialism and Libertarianism.

It's not personal. It's just war.

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Monday, March 5, 2012 10:08 AM

1KIKI

To argue with a man who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead. - Thomas Paine The American Crisis


In 2004 Bush hid the real estimates for Medicare Part D from Congress (by threatening to fire the expert if he released his figures), which were 25% higher than original figures, in order to get Congress to pass the bill. In 2006 with only 5% of eligible people signed up, budgetary costs were spiraling out of control. In 2011 total costs came in at roughly 28%-under budget, 17%-under in anticipated participation, and 10%-under in actual medicine costs v estimated.

What I get out of this is

1) Unlike Bush, at least Obama put the estimates in the budget and didn't threaten to fire the accountants to keep the estimates secret. And,
2) Estimates seem difficult to do well and have a large margin of error b/c they are not predictions, they are estimates based on assumptions.


2004

"WASHINGTON - The government's top expert on Medicare costs was warned that he would be fired if he told key lawmakers about a series of Bush administration cost estimates that could have torpedoed congressional passage of the White House-backed Medicare prescription-drug plan.

When the House of Representatives passed the controversial benefit by five votes last November, the White House was embracing an estimate by the Congressional Budget Office that it would cost $395 billion in the first 10 years. But for months the administration's own analysts in the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services had concluded repeatedly that the drug benefit could cost upward of $100 billion more than that."

2006

"This plan, which went into effect on Jan. 1, offers so many baffling options that only 1 million of 21 million eligible Medicare beneficiaries have signed up for it on their own. ... Meanwhile, the estimated cost of this plan that no one likes has already more than doubled and is now projected at more than $1 trillion over the next decade."

2011

Did it come in 40 percent under budget?

There are two official estimates for Medicare Part D costs, one put out by the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office and another put out by the board of trustees for the Medicare trust funds. These reports calculated potential costs differently, so there are different sets of numbers to work with. The board of trustees projected costs higher than the Congressional Budget Office, so if you use the trustees' numbers, the savings are greater and come closer to 40 percent. If you use the Congressional Budget Office numbers, the savings are somewhat lower.

In addition, two analysts we spoke with said you have to subtract the premiums that patients pay, as well as contributions from the states. If you account for those sources of revenue, the program comes in about 28 percent below budget ...

...why is it under budget?

One reason it came in under budget is fairly straightforward: Not as many people signed up for the benefit as the government expected. The government projected that about 93 percent of people who use Medicare would also sign up for the prescription drug benefit. But actual enrollment is only at about 77 percent of those eligible, a significant difference.

The other reason costs came in under budget is that drug spending did not increase in the 2000s as fast as it increased in the 1990s. So initial cost projections likely overestimated how fast drug spending would grow during the first 10 years of the program. Part of the reason for that is that there were more generic drugs coming onto the market and fewer new blockbuster drugs during the 2000s, said Dr. Jack Hoadley, a health policy analyst at Georgetown University."




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Monday, March 5, 2012 10:17 AM

1KIKI

To argue with a man who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead. - Thomas Paine The American Crisis


"Why do you hate women so much ..."

I think it's more about hating dogs. Only you would assume a bitch is human.

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Monday, March 5, 2012 10:21 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Again with the Rap v. Story/Mike/etc. and PN blathering about something or other.

Riona's right, they always understimate when selling something. If he really wanted to talk about possibly the HUGEST understimate of cost, Iraq would be the prime example...with Afghanistan not far behind I'm sure.
Quote:

Retired Gen. Hugh Shelton, the former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff says that President George W. Bush vastly underestimated the financial cost of the war in Iraq. "President Bush told me, '$87 billion is what it will cost, and we can make that up with Iraqi oil money,'" Shelton said.

Of course, the war in Iraq ended up costing more than 10 times that. Estimates differ, but most studies suggest the war cost well over $1 trillion. A recent report from Brown University estimated the military actions in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan have cost around $3.3 trillion so far. http://obsdailyviews.blogspot.com/2011/09/retired-general-bush-underes
timated-war.html
was in September of last year.

Whoever is in government ALWAYS understimates what they want to sell the public. Let's just hold up Bush as an example:
Quote:

In a cynical attempt to gain the support of senior citizens in 2003, they enacted the Prescription Drug Benefit (Medicare Part D). This was a historic piece of legislation which had been favored by Democrats for many years, but Democrats were unwilling to violate the PAYGO rules to enact it. Republicans swept aside the PAYGO rules, ignored sound fiscal principles, and enacted Medicare Part D without providing any way to pay for it! The Bush administration deliberately underestimated the cost of the program, which has been described as "the most fiscally irresponsible piece of legislation since the 1960s" by former US Comptroller General David Walker.

The Medicare Part D bill was passed in 2003, and as of 2008, had cost $50 billion. The Department of Health and Human Services predicts that the total expense for Medicare Part D will rise to $700 billion by 2018 as the baby boomers reach retirement age. People are also living longer as well. This program is a windfall for pharmaceutical manufacturers, who can sell their products without competition, and a benefit for private insurance companies, who are relieved of the burden of providing expensive medications needed by the elderly. The cost is deferred for future generations to pay. http://www.williambarnesforcongress.com/news/a_history_of_the_deficit_
creating_republicans_in_washington
much for all the screams of leaving our grandchildren with the debt...

As to Obamacare itself,
Quote:

House Republicans claim they want to reduce government spending and shrink the deficit. The nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office estimates the Affordable Care Act will cut the deficit by roughly $143 billion over the next 10 years. House Republicans' plan to repeal healthcare reform would increase the deficit by approximately $230 billion by 2021, according to a preliminary analysis from the Congressional Budget Office. http://www.seiu.org/a/healthcare/gop-healthcare-reform-repeal.php] How much are we hearing about this budget and that budget "saving money", and that doing away with "Obamacare" would save billions?
Quote:

Results from a new Congressional Budget Office (CBO) analysis released yesterday confirm that the House Republican budget's end result is a dramatic increase in the financial burden of health costs, with future retirees paying up to nearly three times as much for their health care than they would if current law continued. http://democrats.waysandmeans.house.gov/media/pdf/112/CBO_GOP_Budget_D
ismantles_Medicare.pdf
try some GOP estimates from states:
Quote:

Gov. Chris Christie’s proposed 10 percent across-the-board income tax cut will cost the state budget hundreds of millions of dollars more than previously acknowledged. http://southbrunswick.patch.com/articles/christie-team-underestimates-
cost-of-income-tax-cut
] The flush tax was the brainchild of a Republican governor whose chief mistake was to underestimate the cost of upgrading sewage treatment plants. In 2004, the price tag was estimated at $740 million. Now, it's $1.4 billion. http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2012-01-26/news/bs-ed-flush-20120126_
1_flush-tax-septic-systems-chesapeake-bay-restoration-fund
]

Good gawd, if we looked up how many times EITHER SIDE has (deliberately or otherwise) underestimated the cost of something they were pushing, we'd be at it all day!

So I'll see your $111 billion, and raise you JUST the $700 billion Part D will cost and ignore the #3.3 TRILLION underestimate of the wars!

In other words, non-story, unless you want to play Partisan Jihad, and we know who does...

Ooops; I took too long looking it up, Kiki beat me to it. Oh well...



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Monday, March 5, 2012 10:24 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by kpo:
Quote:

Remember when that socialist Brit proved that he understood libertarianism so much better than you? :)




For the record I despise both Socialism and Libertarianism.

It's not personal. It's just war.




Oh, no worries - I just know that it's kind of a given among the right wing here in the States that ALL Europeans are socialists!

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

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Monday, March 5, 2012 10:24 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
"Why do you hate women so much ..."

I think it's more about hating dogs. Only you would assume a bitch is human.



I asked the question. ' Bitched out' , to me, refers to when someone yells at another person. As in he got bitched at, bitched out, yelled at by his boss, etc...

However, this term seems to imply something different. From Ubran Dictionary...

Bitched Out

When a male species tends to act like a female species after being frightened and or scared.


Is that not the description which you're implying ?

Again... do you hate women?


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Monday, March 5, 2012 10:24 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
KPO never proved that.



Because you bitched out.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"



Isn't that sexists ? Why do you hate women so much, that you'd resort to the use of a derogatory female pejorative for a nonsensical 'duel' that never had any merit from its basis ?




" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "



And there ya just did it again.

Is it a sexist comment - to a degree. But the term has expanded beyond that over the years, and you well know it.

Sure, you'll play victim, because that's your go-to dodge when cornered. So go right ahead. No one actually cares about your feigned offense.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, March 5, 2012 10:25 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
"Why do you hate women so much ..."

I think it's more about hating dogs. Only you would assume a bitch is human.



Its really about hating the Raptard, and saying anything to get a rise out of the moron - which granted, doesn't take much.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, March 5, 2012 10:29 AM

1KIKI

To argue with a man who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead. - Thomas Paine The American Crisis


"When a male species tends to act like a female species after being frightened and or scared
Again... do you hate women?"


Yeah little Rappy I get it. When you read SPECIES you think WOMAN, b/c, in your very very tiny world in your very very tiny mind, there is only 1 species.

You know, the more you post the more I understand that you can't read.

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Monday, March 5, 2012 10:42 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:


Yeah little Rappy I get it. When you read SPECIES you think WOMAN, b/c, in your very very tiny world in your very very tiny mind, there is only 1 species.

You know, the more you post the more I understand that you can't read.



Actually, in this situation, I was thinking 'human', and not 'dog'.

The more you post, the more I understand that you read ONLY what you want to, and ignore the rest.




" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Monday, March 5, 2012 10:43 AM

1KIKI

To argue with a man who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead. - Thomas Paine The American Crisis


Plus the fact that in YOUR mind, the only kind of bitch there is is women. B/c clearly dogs can't be bitches, and neither can 'species' as per the urban dictionary YOU quoted.

Tell me little Rappy, why do you hate women so much?

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Monday, March 5, 2012 11:12 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
The more you post, the more I understand that you read ONLY what you want to, and ignore the rest.




The prize for "Most Ironic Line of the Day" goes to RAPPY!!

YAY!

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, March 5, 2012 11:22 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Plus the fact that in YOUR mind, the only kind of bitch there is is women. B/c clearly dogs can't be bitches, and neither can 'species' as per the urban dictionary YOU quoted.

Tell me little Rappy, why do you hate women so much?



A bitch is a female dog. I saw that on Family Guy once.

But since you were talking about humans, and since 'bitch' is a common term used to describe female humans, you didn't clarify as to what 'bitch out' meant.

And you still haven't.

I wonder why.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Monday, March 5, 2012 11:33 AM

1KIKI

To argue with a man who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead. - Thomas Paine The American Crisis


Bitched Out

When a male SPECIES tends to act like a female SPECIES after being frightened and or scared.

Is that not the description which you're implying ?

Again... do you hate women?

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Monday, March 5, 2012 2:11 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
KPO never proved that.



Because you bitched out.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"



Isn't that sexists ? Why do you hate women so much, that you'd resort to the use of a derogatory female pejorative for a nonsensical 'duel' that never had any merit from its basis ?





Huh. Someone called "AURaptor" posted this on another thread here:

Quote:

...gonna accuse me of hating women for using THAT word too ? Go right ahead, it fits your M.O. ) to distract everyone from the REAL issues.



Couldn't have been you, right?

Or are you finally coming right out and admitting that you ARE trying to distract everyone from the real issues?

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

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Monday, March 5, 2012 3:25 PM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
KPO never proved that.



Because you bitched out.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"



Isn't that sexists ? Why do you hate women so much, that you'd resort to the use of a derogatory female pejorative for a nonsensical 'duel' that never had any merit from its basis ?





Huh. Someone called "AURaptor" posted this on another thread here:

Quote:

...gonna accuse me of hating women for using THAT word too ? Go right ahead, it fits your M.O. ) to distract everyone from the REAL issues.



Couldn't have been you, right?

Or are you finally coming right out and admitting that you ARE trying to distract everyone from the real issues?

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill



Golly, guess Rappy didn't want to revisit this one.

Can't blame him. After coming off like such a lying tool over the bumper sticker gag - it's a bitch when one's words come back to haunt them.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, March 5, 2012 3:29 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Bitched Out

When a male SPECIES tends to act like a female SPECIES after being frightened and or scared.

Is that not the description which you're implying ?

Again... do you hate women?



I'm asking you. I didn't use the phrase. Storybook did.

And why do you keep asking that silly, false question?


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Monday, March 5, 2012 3:34 PM

STORYMARK


Oh, and to be specific, the definition I was using, also from urban dictionary - so we know the intended target saw it, was:

Quote:

"bitch out" 4: The failure to perform a task based not on a lack of skill but a lack of willpower or courage or possibly due to overwhelming fear.


It tying back to his own words, as Kwick posted, was purely a bonus.

An awesome bonus.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, March 5, 2012 3:46 PM

1KIKI

To argue with a man who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead. - Thomas Paine The American Crisis


And why do you keep asking that silly, false question?

B/c you are the only one assuming bitch means women. Yanno, you assume it so strongly, it gave me real insight into you. Even when NO ONE ELSE uses the word 'women' to define the word, it's all you can cognate. You ASSUME it means woman, and accuse others of hating women b/c of it. But in fact, it's you.

Come to think of it, I don' think I've EVER seen you lay into anyone who is white AND male. Blacks yes. Women, yes. Immigrants from darker countries yes. Anyone who is poor and NOT white AND male yes.

But white males get a complete fee pass from you on everything.

Wow. It's pretty mind boggling to come across a living, breathing caricature.

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Monday, March 5, 2012 3:48 PM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:


Come to think of it, I don' think I've EVER seen you lay into anyone who is white AND male. Blacks yes. Women, yes. Immigrants from darker countries yes. Anyone who is poor and NOT white AND male yes.

But white males get a complete fee pass from you on everything.




Not true, there's Bill Clinton and Jon Stewart.

But yeah, that's like 2 to a billion.



"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, March 5, 2012 3:55 PM

1KIKI

To argue with a man who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead. - Thomas Paine The American Crisis


Oh, maybe I should have qualified. His disdain is categorical. 95% of 'them' don't pay taxes. Feminazis. The poor. The sick. Muslims. Libruls. But I've never seen him disparage rednecks. Macho shitheads. Bubbas.

His mind is formed around the category of us versus the category of 'them'.

This sweeping hatred by category really does drive his mind. It's the basis of how he approaches the entire universe.

What a sad, impoverished, little life.

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Monday, March 5, 2012 3:58 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:

It tying back to his own words, as Kwick posted, was purely a bonus.

An awesome bonus.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"



But Kwickie did no such thing, or y'all have a really poor reading/ comprehension skills.

Go back and look at what I ACTUALLY said...

If you can.

I was ASKING .... gonna accuse me of hating women for using THAT word too ?

FOR USING THAT WORD.

IT WAS A QUESTION, not a declarative statement.

Learn the difference.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Monday, March 5, 2012 4:19 PM

STORYMARK


That's a pretty damned dense justification, even from you.

Holy hell.



"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, March 5, 2012 4:22 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
And why do you keep asking that silly, false question?

B/c you are the only one assuming bitch means women. Yanno, you assume it so strongly, it gave me real insight into you. Even when NO ONE ELSE uses the word 'women' to define the word, it's all you can cognate. You ASSUME it means woman, and accuse others of hating women b/c of it. But in fact, it's you.



In fact, it's not. But it helps you to think like that... so you've made your choice.

Quote:

Come to think of it, I don' think I've EVER seen you lay into anyone who is white AND male. Blacks yes. Women, yes. Immigrants from darker countries yes. Anyone who is poor and NOT white AND male yes.

But white males get a complete fee pass from you on everything.

Wow. It's pretty mind boggling to come across a living, breathing caricature.



Gee, I didn't know my dislike for individuals, or their political views, had to be based on the quota system.

And never has my 'laying into anyone' been based on their race, their color, their gender... that's how YOU see people, but not I.

Want a list of 'white males' I've not given a pass to ?

Al Gore, Michael Moore, Bill Maher, the late Ted Kennedy, Bill Clinton, Ed Schultz, Keith Olbermann, Ted Rall, George Soros, ( does it count if they speak w/ a creepy, Adlai Niska like accent ? I mean, he's white, but he's foreign sounding, so... I'm gonna need a ruling on that one )

Good enough start ? Do I have enough southern males ? I mean, the entire KKK bunch , those who are still left, they qualify, right? Oh, I've never actually said anything bad about them, because they kinda do their own bad PR...but yeah, they suck horse dung as well.

Oh, and then there's Jimmy Carter. What a colossal failure of a human being. Sides with terrorists over a freedom loving people, but what the hell, he helped build homes for poor and needy people, so that makes him a great guy ? Nah, not in my book.



" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Monday, March 5, 2012 4:26 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
That's a pretty damned dense justification, even from you.

Holy hell.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"



Translation: Damn I was had by Raptor, and now I don't have a damn thing to say.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Monday, March 5, 2012 4:30 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quick - look over your head, Rappy! There goes the point, yet again!



I posted YOUR words back at you to show how YOU are the one trying to whine about sexism now, in what you yourself have claimed is an effort to change the subject and avoid the real issues.


Did you not get that?

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Monday, March 5, 2012 6:36 PM

STORYMARK


This is perhaps the first time he's ever said something so stupid I was speechless. Im genuinely amazed at this point. This is even further than the Wilbur joke.

Im actually gobsmacked.

I think I may have to stop poking fun at him so much now. Feels like Im picking on the disabled.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, March 5, 2012 6:56 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
This is perhaps the first time he's ever said something so stupid I was speechless. Im genuinely amazed at this point. This is even further than the Wilbur joke.

Im actually gobsmacked.

I think I may have to stop poking fun at him so much now. Feels like Im picking on the disabled.


Feels like ?

Just sayin...

-F

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Monday, March 5, 2012 7:01 PM

STORYMARK


Fair point.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, March 5, 2012 8:33 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


I don't get that Wilbur joke either, its probably from some nasty show I don't watch, clearly I'm not missing much because it sounds dumb.

I don't think there is actually anything wrong with Raptor in the technical sense, except for that he behaves stubbornly and pigheadedly a lot of times.

Who the rut is Wilbur? On second thought don't answer, its probably a waste of my time.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Tuesday, March 6, 2012 6:03 AM

FREMDFIRMA



*sigh*

It was a sideways snark on Animal Farm, Riona.
He threw out the more equal than others comment and I prodded him with a reference to both Charlottes Web (civility) and the conduct of the pigs from Animal Farm (hypocrisy & double standards) while insinuating the latter resembled his...
And followed on a bit later with a slapstick/merry melodies reference at his expense, cause I just couldn't resist.

Okay, yeah, I have a really esoteric and obscure sideways sense of humor, and occasionally make three-layer jokes like that which few but Byte ever really catch - but it blew completely over his head and much hilarity ensued.
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=18&t=50874

I believe the continued use of the reference however, is a spit-take on his ability to demean himself and his own arguments even harder and faster than other people TRYING to do so.
*eyeroll*
Not sayin it's untrue, but pokin the monkey with a stick gets OLD after a while, yeah.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Tuesday, March 6, 2012 6:12 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by RionaEire:
I don't get that Wilbur joke either, its probably from some nasty show I don't watch,



Yes, nasty. A children's book....

You didn't get it, fine - not everyone would have.

They key point is, when you didn't get it - you didn't stamp your feet and insist that not only DID you get it, but you were the only one who did, and everyone else was missing the "real" joke.

Because you are not mentally stunted.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Tuesday, March 6, 2012 6:44 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Ri - The whole Wilbur nonsense is lost on me as well. Where I like to drop references to the book 'Animal Farm' in on political discussions, as it's a book written with clear political messages.

It's an apt association. However, Charlotte's web, I'm less familiar with, and has zero to do with anything connected to my references to Animal Farm. Oh sure, it has barn animals, and pigs, as does 'Animal Farm', but so what ? It's a weak connection, at best.

Which is why I think Frem was trying to obscure MY point, by dropping in any random literary 'pig' reference, in a failed attempt at being clever.

What Frem and others fail to get is that , even though some may 'get' their attempt at humor, it doesn't make it funny. If it makes them feel better to say " he's stupid, he doesn't get it because he's not laughing " , then so be it. As I said in the other thread, humor is subjective.




" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Tuesday, March 6, 2012 6:59 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...



What would you people talk about without Raptor here to egg you on, I wonder?



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Tuesday, March 6, 2012 7:02 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
What Frem and others fail to get is that , even though some may 'get' their attempt at humor, it doesn't make it funny.



Very true.

What DID make it funny as hell, was you clearly not getting it - while insisting over and over that you did.

Hi-larious. Had me rolling with laughter.

Much like the comment Kwick quoted you on above, which you still don't grasp.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Tuesday, March 6, 2012 8:52 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Storybook -

I say I 'get it', but that it's not funny, and some how you continue to read and interpret that to mean that I don't get it.

Frem openly admits that the snark was sideways, or obscure, but you insist that, in order to perpetuate your view of me with what you WANT it to be, that I really didn't 'get it', and that anything I disagree with you on ANY thing, it's because I'm stupid, slow, or uneducated.

Quite an illusion you have set up for yourself there.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Tuesday, March 6, 2012 9:04 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
What Frem and others fail to get is that , even though some may 'get' their attempt at humor, it doesn't make it funny.



Very true.

What DID make it funny as hell, was you clearly not getting it - while insisting over and over that you did.

Hi-larious. Had me rolling with laughter.

Much like the comment Kwick quoted you on above, which you still don't grasp.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"




Well, hell - THEN he went and did the exact same thing AGAIN! His line about people reading only what they want, and ignoring the rest - and then completely missing the relevant Urban Dictionary definition for the term "bitch out", because when searching for something to whinge about, he fixated on that, and then when looking for a definition for it, he utterly ignored the ONE definition that would make sense in the context in which the phrase was used!




"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

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Tuesday, March 6, 2012 9:23 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Well, hell - THEN he went and did the exact same thing AGAIN!



Well, of course he did. Skynet set his chip to "Read Only".

Quote:

His line about people reading only what they want, and ignoring the rest


That was a highlight for me as well. Thus his reciving the "Ironic post of the day" award.

Though really, I doubt there will be a more ironic post for months, possibly years, so perhaps I was too narrow in my scope.

Quote:

and then completely missing the relevant Urban Dictionary definition for the term "bitch out", because when searching for something to whinge about, he fixated on that, and then when looking for a definition for it, he utterly ignored the ONE definition that would make sense in the context in which the phrase was used!




Well, as mentioned before, I don't think he's even cognitively capable of recognizing or admitting a mistake.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Tuesday, March 6, 2012 9:39 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



You could play this childish game for another 100,200, 500 replies, if you want. I don't care to, myself.

I openly admitted I was unfamiliar w/ that term, and then asked about it. UD has multiple definitions, yet you neglected to specify which one applied.

And this entire nonsense goes back to a pointless, meaningless 'duel' which I clearly showed was completely invalid. I didn't 'bitch out', because there was nothing to bitch out FROM.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Tuesday, March 6, 2012 9:42 AM

STORYMARK


Case in point. ^^

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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