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I suspect vaccinations because...

POSTED BY: CHRISISALL
UPDATED: Saturday, January 13, 2024 08:35
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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 7:51 AM

CHRISISALL


So my Son 'developed' Type 1 diabetes.
No genetic predisposition in the family.
What was he exposed to the Wife & I weren't?
Two things: Milk (he drinks hormone-free) & vaccinations.
Diabetes is on the rise in more well-to-do areas (where it's more likely everyone 'has their shots').
It's on the rise in cold areas (where peeps are more likely vaccinated for 'cold season').
And after he was diagnosed it was advised he get a flu shot to avoid getting it, which he PROMPTLY did a few weeks later.

My conclusion? Vaccinations are a scam. A dangerous one. Some peeps die, others get autism, etc.

Also, diabetes began its sharp incline in the early eighties, like, you know, AIDS.
We make our own plagues now, no need for fleas & ticks.

Where are you Signy, I need your comments...


The laughing Chrisisall



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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 8:39 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Even if a vaccine is found to be 99.9% free of harmful side effects, that still puts thousands of people at risk.



"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 8:49 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


It's not a perfect world. DIabetes has many potential causes, and people's systems differ. And what if we all gave up vaccinations, what do you think the death count would be then? I certainly agree that we don't need nearly as many vaccines as we're encouraged to get, and I don't. But to throw the baby out with the bathwater...no, thank you. We'll have to agree to disagree on that one.



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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 9:08 AM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
We'll have to agree to disagree on that one.


Niki, where do you think you are???
This is RWED!!! You MUST see things MY WAY!!! GORRAMIT girl, there will be no AGREEMENT to disagree on this forum!!!!

LOL, okay, SOME vaccines are helpful & even necessary, but like wars, I think the majority are to be avoided, but that's MY opinion; your mileage may vary.


The laughing Chrisisall


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 9:18 AM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Even if a vaccine is found to be 99.9% free of harmful side effects, that still puts thousands of people at risk.

As SOON as my Son was BORN they wanted to pump hep b into him, I told 'em to BACK OFF!
Dumasses.


The laughing Chrisisall


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 9:21 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


You crack me up.
Quote:

SOME vaccines are helpful & even necessary, but like wars, I think the majority are to be avoided
We agree on that one.



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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 9:23 AM

CANTTAKESKY


Here are two links that may shed light on the subject.

http://www.whale.to/v/coulter.html

http://www.vaccines.net/newpage11.htm

Of course, the establishment will produce tons of papers stating otherwise, that there is no link between vaccination and diabetes.

My position has always been that the benefits of vaccinations are greatly exaggerated, and their negative outcomes and dangers are entirely ignored. With a little bit more honesty in the industry, we could be advancing towards safer and more effective vaccines.

-----
Never be deceived that the rich will allow you to vote away their wealth. -- Lucy Parsons (1853-1942, labor activist and anarcho-communist)

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 9:46 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


There is a line of study that is looking at cow's milk as a potential cause of type 1 diabetes. The fact that you mentioned milk on your own got my interest.

"Abstract: Insulin autoantibodies (IAAs) often appear as the first sign of islet cell autoimmunity
in prediabetic children. Because cow's milk contains bovine insulin, we followed the
development of insulin-binding antibodies in children fed with cow's milk formula."

Despite the association, it's a line of study that's not been concluded either way yet. But I know of no similar association between vaccines and type 1 diabetes.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 10:24 AM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by canttakesky:
Here are two links that may shed light on the subject.

http://www.whale.to/v/coulter.html

http://www.vaccines.net/newpage11.htm



Okay, now that my tears are ebbing, I thank you for that CTS. I should have fought against the vaccinations. I was being such a conformist asshole.


Chrisisall


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 10:26 AM

CANTTAKESKY


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
I was being such a conformist asshole.

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic.

Cause asshole you're not.

-----
Never be deceived that the rich will allow you to vote away their wealth. -- Lucy Parsons (1853-1942, labor activist and anarcho-communist)

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 10:27 AM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
children fed with cow's milk formula."


Sounds like important info- but my Son was breast fed & only started drinking milk around 5 years of age... still, it's a possible contributor I guess...


Chrisisall


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 10:31 AM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by canttakesky:
I can't tell if you're being sarcastic.


No sarcasm here. I never liked the idea of broad spectrum vaccination, yet I went with it anyway after delaying it for as long as I could so he could attend 1st grade... I should have known.
My Son is paying the price for my folding on the issue.

EDIT: My Wife just reminded that nothing's conclusive. So I'll stop beating myself up here.


Chrisisall


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 11:00 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


"So I'll stop beating myself up here."

I'm so glad you posted that. I've made major mistakes with various decisions, and was berating myself over them. Then I had a revelation: if there was such a thing as perfect knowledge, no one would make any mistakes. But sadly, we must trod forward as best we can in uncertainty and doubt.

Or, as my favorite bumper sticker goes:

ONWARD!!
through the fog

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 11:09 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
It's not a perfect world. DIabetes has many potential causes, and people's systems differ. And what if we all gave up vaccinations, what do you think the death count would be then? I certainly agree that we don't need nearly as many vaccines as we're encouraged to get, and I don't. But to throw the baby out with the bathwater...no, thank you. We'll have to agree to disagree on that one.




Yup.

And hasn't the autism thing been soundly denounced? By everyone but the scientific giant that is Jenny McCarthy, that is.

Sorry about your son, though, Chris. Hope things work out.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 11:21 AM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:


And hasn't the autism thing been soundly denounced?

Denounced ain't dis-proven in my book.
Remember the scientists that said margarine was healthy for you, or the scientists that said formula was healthier than breast milk or scientists that said we actually went to the Moon... wait, we did do that, sorry, PNing a little on that one...


The laughing Chrisisall


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 11:30 AM

CANTTAKESKY


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
And hasn't the autism thing been soundly denounced? By everyone but the scientific giant that is Jenny McCarthy, that is.

No, it hasn't. It has been soundly denounced by people who never needed much evidence to soundly denounce it to begin with.

The rest of us are still on the fence if not convinced there is a link.

I hypothesize that autism has a heterogeneous etiology. Amongst possible causes are genetics, environmental toxins, a retrovirus, electromagnetic radiation (EMR), celiac disease, and vaccines. These variables may all interact for the symptoms commonly known as Autistic Spectrum Disorder.

Take someone with a genetic predisposition. Throw in toxins such as mercury or MSG, both of which kill neurons. Weaken the blood brain barrier with EMRs and gluten (in case of celiac disease), which allows all those toxins to go straight to the brain. Add a retrovirus which causes gastrointestinal, immunological, and neurodegenerative damage, which is activated and crosses the blood brain barrier when the immune system is hyperactivated (as in the case of vaccination). You get all the ingredients lined up, and voila, an autistic kid. You have some of them lined up, and you have a mildly autistic kid. And so forth.

My kid has some symptoms common to autism such as mild stimming and emotional hypersensitivity. I am convinced if he were vaccinated AND assaulted with neurotoxins AND exposed to heavy EMRs, he would be full blown autistic.

-----
Never be deceived that the rich will allow you to vote away their wealth. -- Lucy Parsons (1853-1942, labor activist and anarcho-communist)

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 11:47 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello,

The man who tortures himself for all his ignorant choices should only do so if he is God. The rest of us mortals make due with less than omniscience. For every claim there is counterclaim. For every fact there is proof and disproof. For every piece of knowledge there is trust in those who gleaned it. Our world is so wide and wonderful that we can not hope to experience it all for ourselves, nor even to understand it all for ourselves. We build our lives on tales told, and must place some trust in the tellers. We do this not because we wish it, but because there is too much muchness out there for us to live any other way.

Failures of faulty knowledge are no more causes for guilt than bolts burrowing into us from out of the blue. Who could have seen it coming? Who could have known and been sure of the knowledge? We are lucky to get anything right in this world. We are certainly too small and pathetic to curse ourselves with God's burden of all-knowing.

In short...

It's not your fault.

--Anthony


_______________________________________________

"In every war, the state enacts a tax of freedom upon the citizenry. The unspoken promise is that the tax shall be revoked at war's end. Endless war holds no such promise. Hence, Eternal War is Eternal Slavery." --Admiral Robert J. Henner


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 11:47 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
So my Son 'developed' Type 1 diabetes.
No genetic predisposition in the family.
What was he exposed to the Wife & I weren't?
Two things: Milk (he drinks hormone-free) & vaccinations.
Diabetes is on the rise in more well-to-do areas (where it's more likely everyone 'has their shots').
It's on the rise in cold areas (where peeps are more likely vaccinated for 'cold season').
And after he was diagnosed it was advised he get a flu shot to avoid getting it, which he PROMPTLY did a few weeks later.

My conclusion? Vaccinations are a scam. A dangerous one. Some peeps die, others get autism, etc.

Also, diabetes began its sharp incline in the early eighties, like, you know, AIDS.
We make our own plagues now, no need for fleas & ticks.

Where are you Signy, I need your comments...


The laughing Chrisisall




I think your son has unfortunately developed a horrible disease and are looking for something to blame.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 12:14 PM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by canttakesky:
Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
And hasn't the autism thing been soundly denounced? By everyone but the scientific giant that is Jenny McCarthy, that is.

No, it hasn't. It has been soundly denounced by people who never needed much evidence to soundly denounce it to begin with.

The rest of us are still on the fence if not convinced there is a link.



Hmm, the science seems to say there is no connection. Those who are so "convinced" as far as I can tell, have little but conviction backing them.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 12:36 PM

HERO


Did your son die of smallpox or polio?

H

"Hero. I have come to respect you." "I am forced to agree with Hero here."- Chrisisall, 2009.
"I agree with Hero." Niki2, 2011.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 12:46 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by canttakesky:
I am convinced if he were vaccinated AND assaulted with neurotoxins AND exposed to heavy EMRs, he would be full blown autistic.


Makes sense. There's usually never 'THE ONE' cause for something.


Chrisisall


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 12:47 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by Hero:
Did your son die of smallpox or polio?


Non-sequiter, your facts are uncoordinated. You will be sterilized.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 12:52 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Hmm, the science seems to say

margarine is good for you?
Do I have to make a list of how 'science' was wrong in the past? Even the very recent past?
And don't get me started on 'science's' tests in Africa & southern Black towns...
Science is a tool to be used or misused, like any other. And remember, 58.6% of all statistics are made up.


The laughing Chrisisall


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 1:03 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by AnthonyT:

The man who tortures himself for all his ignorant choices should only do so if he is God.

Thanks, man.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 2:22 PM

DREAMTROVE


I really agree. It's not your fault, even if it's the vaccine. We've all made a lot of bad choices and we were pushed quite mightily by TPTB to do so, and often they seemed like the right choices, even essential ones. I can't even count the number of them I've made.

I also want to add a word of caution, which makes avoiding any blame game rally important: Be wary of psychological investment. It leads us to bad future decisions, and sometimes self-delusion. I recently came to the conclusion that deaths from war are totally unnecessary, and have been for a while, and that the loss of soldiers is done intentionally to create a psychological investment. I think it's really that bad.

Re: Vaccines? I'm getting more worried about them. I know that sometimes they work, and can be important. I used to work with hep-B+ downs syndrome people, and so I got the vaccine. Everyone who got it did fine, those who didn't, got hep-B. It was one of the new genetically engineer vaccines, but I was convinced it worked. That said, there are dangers that we were not told about. It's possible that one of the four or so mutations that caused my sister's brain cancer came from a vaccine-borne hitchhiker virus.


That's what a ship is, you know - it's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 2:30 PM

CHRISISALL


Good info Dream, and sorry about your Sister.
Strange, peeps scream about Wash dying, but we all have loved ones gone away...


Chrisisall


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 2:36 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


"I recently came to the conclusion that deaths from war are totally unnecessary,"

Hello,

This statement deserves its own thread.

--Anthony


_______________________________________________

"In every war, the state enacts a tax of freedom upon the citizenry. The unspoken promise is that the tax shall be revoked at war's end. Endless war holds no such promise. Hence, Eternal War is Eternal Slavery." --Admiral Robert J. Henner


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 2:56 PM

CANTTAKESKY


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Hmm, the science seems to say there is no connection.

Yeah, you can call it "science."

More accurately, the pseudoscience seems to say there is no connection.

Here is an example of why those studies prove nothing.

http://freedom2question.blogspot.com/2009/05/what-is-pseudoscience.htm
l





-----
Never be deceived that the rich will allow you to vote away their wealth. -- Lucy Parsons (1853-1942, labor activist and anarcho-communist)

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 3:03 PM

FREMDFIRMA



Chris, actually I don't think the finger of blame for the spike in Diabetes lands on vaccinations, although they do have issues I'll not argue, but this I think is a different issue altogether.

I think the blame for the Diabetes spike can be firmly laid at the feet of High Fructose Corn Syrup, which *WASN'T* in everydamnthing imagineable when you grew up, and while the boy was growing up, was being crammed into everything possible, as fast as possible - for crying out loud, Bologna??

And worse, just like MSG or Transfats, they OBFUSCATE it with different names in order to dodge truth in labelling laws (if you realize this, and have the list of those alt-names handy, see for yourself, as Meijers "Organic" chicken soup actually contains MORE MSG than the non-organic store brand, as a case in point!) so it's hard to find anything whatever in a conventional diet of a normal person who has not the time and money to spend searching out other options...

Factually I defy you to pick up ten random supermarket food items and wind up with less than 50% of them containing HFCS - NO MATTER WHAT THEY ARE, everything from cookies to cheese, to as I mentioned, Bologna, in stuff where a sweetener of any kind MAKES NO SENSE.

You and me, we got into maturity before they started pouring that crap into every single thing you could imagine, and consider how long it probably went on before anyone twigged to it and started howling - like how long it took for folks to realize Aspartame was freakin poisonous (which you might note, has quietly disappeared from most products, without actually yanno, ADMITTING anyhing, oh no...) so likely there was a point where a lot of stuff in his diet was loaded with it and all of us unawares of the danger since the FDA is naught more than an arm of Big Pharma these days, which has a vested interest in creating a market for their products, obviously.

Now, of course the naturalists will cry havoc, and with them it's more faith than evidence - which annoys the piss outta me cause why bullshit when there IS evidence a-plenty, it demeans the facts one has, right ?

So, this.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/08/070823094819.htm

S'funny, I think, how the so-called "health" experts told us sugar and butter were so bad for us, and all but forced replacement with "healthy" alternatives such as transfats, HFCS, and Aspartame, oh yeah, reallllly healthy, that.

Ergo, their track record of disasters gives me NO faith in them whatever.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 3:10 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


"Here is an example of why those studies prove nothing."

To use one example to label ALL studies as 'proving nothing' isn't very scientific. There are many individual studies as well as several meta-analytical studies that all show the same thing. Unless you address those as well you don't have a good case to make.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 3:40 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by Fremdfirma:

Ergo, their track record of disasters gives me NO faith in them whatever.


To use a phrase from a Walter Hill film I saw in my teens in 1979, "Fuckin' A!"

(What movie, & who said it?)


The laughing Chrisisall


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 3:42 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
To use one example to label ALL studies as 'proving nothing' isn't very scientific.

He's not labeling all studies, just the potential and/or actual FAITH in studies- there's a difference.



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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 3:45 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by canttakesky:
Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Hmm, the science seems to say there is no connection.

Yeah, you can call it "science."

More accurately, the pseudoscience seems to say there is no connection.

Here is an example of why those studies prove nothing.

http://freedom2question.blogspot.com/2009/05/what-is-pseudoscience.



I stopped reading when why they said "As an example, I will use a study frequently cited by government and health authorities as further "scientific" evidence that thimerosal (mercury) in vaccines do not cause autism."

Thimerosal is not mercury. It is Ethyl(2-mercaptobenzoato-(2-)-O,S)
mercurate(1-) sodium, a mercury containing compound. That is like calling table salt, chlorine.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 3:47 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


"He's not labeling all studies ..."

No, YOU are labeling all studies. "Here is an example of why those studies prove nothing."

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 3:51 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello,

I think the real factor at work here is this-

Many citizenry of this land no longer trust the country, nor the businesses which operate in this country, nor any institution created with a supposed concern for their welfare. This mistrust is so deep that it is easier for some to assume that a palliative is actually a poison if an authority claims the reverse. This is seen as preferable rather than believe the statements of government, corporations, or researchers whose motives are obscure and perceived as sinister.

The doubt runs so deep that it becomes a perverse twist upon The Emperor's New Clothes. If we see a clothed politician or businessman or their endorsing scientists, we assume that they are naked. So much does our mistrust command our senses, that any fact labeled by such people falls into question even against the evidence of our eyes. The people have been fooled before, and on so many occasions, that a declaration of the fact of gravity will have people buying parachutes, and a declaration about the spherical nature of the world will have people discarding their globes and atlases.

This is the problem. It is a profound loss of faith in the many multitudes of people that we rely upon for the truths we can't personally verify.

And most tragic of all is that this: They have earned this mistrust. They purchased this mistrust in regular payments of blood and betrayal.

It is a situation where we all lose.

--Anthony


_______________________________________________

"In every war, the state enacts a tax of freedom upon the citizenry. The unspoken promise is that the tax shall be revoked at war's end. Endless war holds no such promise. Hence, Eternal War is Eternal Slavery." --Admiral Robert J. Henner


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 3:54 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
"He's not labeling all studies ..."

No, YOU are labeling all studies. "Here is an example of why those studies prove nothing."

Oh, gloves off, Fuck you, asshole.
Read what you need to into things.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 4:01 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by AnthonyT:
The people have been fooled before, and on so many occasions, that a declaration of the fact of gravity will have people buying parachutes, and a declaration about the spherical nature of the world will have people discarding their globes and atlases.


Yeah, and this is why we need to find the truth between the lines for ourselves. Not every scientific study is a set of lies, nor is every one to be believed in like Gospel.

Unfortunately, not every person has the time to be a driven self-educated doctor/lawyer/sociologist- what have you.

BUT, no questioning inevitably leads to no hugs & no puppies.


The laughing Chrisisall


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 4:13 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


"Oh, gloves off, Fuck you, asshole.
Read what you need to into things."

Hmmm. All I did was point out that CTSky made a very global statement. What she posted was not 'a few studies' or 'some studies', or 'many', or 'the majority', or 'most', or 'nearly all', or 'with few exceptions' - but 'those studies', without exception.

And in the previous post I pointed out that without addressing the other studies that seem credible and indicate no connection between autism and thimerosal, she really didn't back up her claim.

What I was TRYING to point out was that there is a lot of evidence that's trending one way, which seems a pretty non-controversial position.

But OK. Be pissed off about it. It actually doesn't matter to me though it seems pretty silly.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 4:16 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:


What I was TRYING to point out was that there is a lot of evidence that's trending one way,

Be trendy, it actually doesn't matter to me though it seems pretty silly.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 4:19 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


And like all believers, you have THE TRUTH. Because apparently, the process of investigation and result is meaningless to you.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 4:24 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello,

I'm not sure why this thread suddenly degraded into personal insult. I think it is a bad trend. And a silly one.

--Anthony



_______________________________________________

"In every war, the state enacts a tax of freedom upon the citizenry. The unspoken promise is that the tax shall be revoked at war's end. Endless war holds no such promise. Hence, Eternal War is Eternal Slavery." --Admiral Robert J. Henner


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 4:27 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by AnthonyT:

I'm not sure why this thread suddenly degraded into personal insult. I think it is a bad trend. And a silly one.


Point taken. Thanks.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 4:41 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
And like all believers, you have THE TRUTH. Because apparently, the process of investigation and result is meaningless to you.

You do not SEEM to understand that investigation is absolutely what I'm promulgating. Not blind belief in so-called conclusive studies. Nor blind belief in anecdotal evidence. Or mere suspicions.
It's almost December & it's near sixty degrees here in the state if Massachusetts. It's NOT rocket science to observe that something's not quite normal.
THAT'S what I'm saying. Individual intelligent analysis counts for more (sometimes) than corporate-sponsored & (sometimes) skewed results.





The laughing Chrisisall


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 4:56 PM

HERO


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:

Originally posted by Hero:
Did your son die of smallpox or polio?


Non-sequiter, your facts are uncoordinated. You will be sterilized.


Actually if you read the original post he concludes that vaccines are a scam.

So, polio, smallpox, parvo, distemper, bird flu, that red dust that drove most of the original visitors away, what did he die from?

H

"Hero. I have come to respect you." "I am forced to agree with Hero here."- Chrisisall, 2009.
"I agree with Hero." Niki2, 2011.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 5:22 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


"Not blind belief in so-called conclusive studies. Nor blind belief in anecdotal evidence. Or mere suspicions."

Well, that's why I used the word 'trending'. See, something could come along and be the key to elucidating all those studies in a new way. Or, a whole bunch of studies could be conducted and reverse what we now think are reliable observations. I'm not claiming 'fact' (though I admit I use that word when I'm referring to robust observations) or 'proof', but so far, that is the way studies are running.

I personally know a few people of my generation who are type 1 diabetics. When I was growing up vaccines were few and far between, produce came off the farm, and organic pesticides hadn't been synthesized yet. So it's something that definitely happens even without the NEW usual suspects. Nature does sometimes suck all on its own.

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 5:24 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by Hero:

Actually if you read the original post he concludes that vaccines are a scam.


Apologies, I will now clarify:
MOST vaccines in TODAY'S world and time are at best a harmless economic scam, and at worst a serious health risk given the political agenda, the amateurish preparation by minimum wage, ill trained personnel, and the desire to trust in those that know 'better than you do' despite sloppy, rushed and incomplete data.
Some vaccines are, however, necessary and vital (like the one that Robert Neville took to save him from dying or becoming one of 'The Family').


The laughing Chrisisall


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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 5:29 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Nature does sometimes suck all on its own.

Agreed. Okay, I take back the effueahole and apologize. I'm a might touchy today, more than is usual for me. This whole diabetes thing has spun me about.



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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 5:41 PM

CANTTAKESKY


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
"Here is an example of why those studies prove nothing."

To use one example to label ALL studies as 'proving nothing' isn't very scientific.

I didn't say, "This example proves all studies are worthless."

I said, "The studies are poorly conducted and are pseudoscience. This is an example of such pseudoscience."

Big difference.

Quote:

There are many individual studies as well as several meta-analytical studies that all show the same thing. Unless you address those as well you don't have a good case to make.
Yes, and I CAN address those as well. The arguments would be similar to those made in this study.

But I won't. Cause you know, I have a life. Plus, even if I spent the next 3 months writing books about this topic, it still won't sway you, so why bother?



-----
Never be deceived that the rich will allow you to vote away their wealth. -- Lucy Parsons (1853-1942, labor activist and anarcho-communist)

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 5:47 PM

CANTTAKESKY


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:
I stopped reading when why they said "As an example, I will use a study frequently cited by government and health authorities as further "scientific" evidence that thimerosal (mercury) in vaccines do not cause autism."

Thimerosal is not mercury.

Uh, nitpick much?

The concern about thimerosal is that it contains mercury. When someone says, "Thimerosal in vaccines does not cause autism," what they really mean is "Mercury in vaccines does not cause autism."

Stop reading if you wish, but it would be like rejecting an article discussing eating paint chips (lead) and brain damage because paint chips are not the same thing as lead.

You're missing the point.

-----
Never be deceived that the rich will allow you to vote away their wealth. -- Lucy Parsons (1853-1942, labor activist and anarcho-communist)

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Tuesday, November 29, 2011 5:47 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:

Originally posted by AnthonyT:
I think the real factor at work here is this-

Many citizenry of this land no longer trust the country, nor the businesses which operate in this country, nor any institution created with a supposed concern for their welfare. This mistrust is so deep that it is easier for some to assume that a palliative is actually a poison if an authority claims the reverse. This is seen as preferable rather than believe the statements of government, corporations, or researchers whose motives are obscure and perceived as sinister.

The doubt runs so deep that it becomes a perverse twist upon The Emperor's New Clothes. If we see a clothed politician or businessman or their endorsing scientists, we assume that they are naked. So much does our mistrust command our senses, that any fact labeled by such people falls into question even against the evidence of our eyes. The people have been fooled before, and on so many occasions, that a declaration of the fact of gravity will have people buying parachutes, and a declaration about the spherical nature of the world will have people discarding their globes and atlases.

This is the problem. It is a profound loss of faith in the many multitudes of people that we rely upon for the truths we can't personally verify.

And most tragic of all is that this: They have earned this mistrust. They purchased this mistrust in regular payments of blood and betrayal.

It is a situation where we all lose.



Allow me to present another viewpoint there Anthony...

What you're seeing, not just here but in all the world around you is a combination of Santa Claus effect and that whole stages of ideology thing we discussed elsewhere, because for whatever reason many people these days are finally questioning a lot of the basic assumptions they've held or had foisted on them...
And discovering THAT THEY ARE LIES.

And so, this opens the horrible can o worms question - WHAT ELSE DID THEY LIE ABOUT ?
How much of what I believe, what I thought I knew, is actually true ?

There is, quite literally, *mindbreaking* horror in those concepts, they can destroy a person, which is why I am so cautious in leading people down a path that leads to that impasse of thought.

Now for a time, simply because of the terrifying thought that they might have dismissed something important, that may be critical to their survival in this new mental world of theirs - sure, they will at least hear out even the looniest of barking moonbat crazies, cause in discarding external values they must then set their own - this phase passes soon enough, with the rare exception of someone so broken they cannot survive without an external value set and latch on to one "cause' or another simply to have one as a core to rebuild themselves around, which is mostly what happened to PN, although he's not nowhere near as batshit as he puts off, and quite on purpose, too.

Worst of it is the ones who go straight to denial, and will viciously attack those who question or defy, in much the same manner as a distraught relative screaming HE IS NOT DEAD over a corpse with zero vital signs despite what the obvious realities are - I use that as a metaphor for our current system, cause frankly, it is dead - cue the howling harpies swarming on ME for that comment, but better me than those who have just discovered their mental training wheels in a world now strange and unconfortable to them.

And as I mentioned, eventually comes the point where the collusion of Big Pharma, Government, the FDA and the scourge of so-called protectors totally breaks any faith in them, that this was coming I pointed out ages ago with all the assurance of a physicist telling you just how long a rock of a known weight will fall from a certain height - ain't MY fault most folks choose denial, is it now ?

This is a messy process, it is - I point that out a lot, cause it's also dangerous, for example if a pandemic does occur before a trustworthy medical system can be reconstructed, we're fucked cause folks would rather risk it than trust bastards who've PROVEN they are untrustworthy, and it rooks me worse because right after developing and then "accidently" wilding a version of the 1918 flu (only to watch it get stomped by 80-some years of human immune system evolution as I laughed up my sleeve) now they're trying to lab-grow some horrific hybrid variation of an H-series jumper flu which has Captain Trips written all over it, and I am far from sanguine about their motives here.

But worse, is that said process comes with lots and lots of rage, both on behalf of those angry at being decieved, and those angry at being essentially FORCED to look at the cracks in their own ideology and being pissed off cause it infringes on the basic denials that make it all work for them - and with not very bloody much provocation they'll lash out at each other, or even anything nearby.

And that can get very, very ugly, especially in combination with a set of existing and established powers that be who are hell bent on remaining so even if they have to blow the very planet into a lifeless radioactive hell to keep it that way.

All that said, while it is impossible to plan for all eventualities, those who prepare for the eventualities they do forsee are often the ones left around burying the less fortunate - only in this case many of them chose to take actions to protect those less fortunate because otherwise, what's the point ?

My only real concern at this juncture is the point where it all tips over and those in power act in the fashion of temper tantrum toddlers as they have so far, and act to destroy all than share - mainly that those who could stop it will not be fast enough, ruthless enough, to do what must be done at that point.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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