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Originally posted by SignyM:
The only way they stop being addicts is by "hitting bottom".

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Originally posted by Kwicko:
Is it, CTS?

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Levels of radioactive iodine in the sea near the damaged Fukushima nuclear plant have risen further to 1,850 times higher than the usual level, says Japan's nuclear agency. It is believed the radiation is coming from one of the reactors, but a specific leak has not been identified.

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They have only one option: Whether the fuel rods are split or melted (yes and yes), whether the containment vessels and fuel ponds are intact or not (not) they just have to pour water on all of that and KEEP pouring water on it, even if radionuclides get washed off into the ocean in incalculable quantities.

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Originally posted by SignyM:
CTS- It's not about what I think, or what you think, or what Mike thinks. It's about what's real.

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I was just following up.

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Radioactivity in water at reactor 2 at the quake-damaged Fukushima nuclear plant has reached 10 million times the usual level, company officials say.... "High levels of caesium and other substances are being detected, which usually should not be found in reactor water. There is a high possibility that fuel rods are being damaged," the spokesman added...The radiation found in the sea will no longer be a risk after eight days because of iodine's half-life, officials say.

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The water in the Fukushima Dai-Ichi No. 2 reactor’s turbine building was measured at more than 1,000 millisieverts per hour

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Originally posted by SignyM:
But did you take it personally and decide to attack?

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Both iodine-129 and iodine-131 are produced by the fission of uranium atoms during operation of nuclear reactors and by plutonium (or uranium) in the detonation of nuclear weapons.

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Originally posted by SignyM:
One last thing for the week:

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Both iodine-129 and iodine-131 are produced by the fission of uranium atoms during operation of nuclear reactors and by plutonium (or uranium) in the detonation of nuclear weapons.

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Iodine would not be released BY ITSELF. You only get iodine release when the fuel rods have been compromised (cladding has been eroded away or the rods broken or melted) and the uranium or MOX pellets leaking radionuclides to the outside world.

In that way, iodine is like E coli. Not particularly dangerous but plentiful, they are both indicators of more dangerous contamination. Iodine even more reliably than E coli, because it is possible to emit E coli w/o cholera but it is NOT possible to emit iodine without also emitting uranium and (if present) plutonium. That is a fact of physics. Yes there is some "partitioning" going on... heavier particles don't travel as far. OTOH, iodine disappears fairly quickly, the more dangerous nuclides don't.

TEPCO apologizes for its inaccurate statement. We did the calculations here: the radiation levels are "only" 2.9 million times normal, not 10 million.

But whether it is stated as 10 million times or 3 million times, for perspective:

Working in a puddle of 1000 mSv/hr for an hour would give you radiation poisoning and a 10% chance of dying in 30 days;

Working in it for a half-day would almost certainly kill you.

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Tsunami bomb NZ's devastating war secret

Top-secret wartime experiments were conducted off the coast of Auckland to perfect a tidal wave bomb, declassified files reveal.

An Auckland University professor seconded to the Army set off a series of underwater explosions triggering mini-tidal waves at Whangaparaoa in 1944 and 1945.

Professor Thomas Leech's work was considered so significant that United States defence chiefs said that if the project had been completed before the end of the war it could have played a role as effective as that of the atom bomb.

Details of the tsunami bomb, known as Project Seal, are contained in 53-year-old documents released by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade.

Papers stamped "top secret" show the US and British military were eager for Seal to be developed in the post-war years too. They even considered sending Professor Leech to Bikini Atoll to view the US nuclear tests and see if they had any application to his work.

He did not make the visit, although a member of the US board of assessors of atomic tests, Dr Karl Compton, was sent to New Zealand.

"Dr Compton is impressed with Professor Leech's deductions on the Seal project and is prepared to recommend to the Joint Chiefs of Staff that all technical data from the test relevant to the Seal project should be made available to the New Zealand Government for further study by Professor Leech," said a July 1946 letter from Washington to Wellington.

Professor Leech, who died in his native Australia in 1973, was the university's dean of engineering from 1940 to 1950.

News of his being awarded a CBE in 1947 for research on a weapon led to speculation in newspapers around the world about what was being developed.

Though high-ranking New Zealand and US officers spoke out in support of the research, no details of it were released because the work was on-going.

A former colleague of Professor Leech, Neil Kirton, told the Weekend Herald that the experiments involved laying a pattern of explosives underwater to create a tsunami.

Small-scale explosions were carried out in the Pacific and off Whangaparaoa, which at the time was controlled by the Army.

It is unclear what happened to Project Seal once the final report was forwarded to Wellington Defence Headquarters late in the 1940s.

The bomb was never tested on a full scale, and Mr Kirton doubts that Aucklanders would have noticed the trials.

"Whether it could ever be resurrected ... Under some circumstances I think it could be devastating."

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=14727

Project Seal ( also known as the Tsunami bomb) was a programme by the New Zealand military to develop a weapon that could create destructive tsunamis. This weapon was tested in Whangaparaoa off the coast of Auckland between 1944-1945. The experiments were conducted by Professor Thomas Leech. British and US defence chiefs were eager to see it developed and it was considered as important as the atomic bomb. The weapon was only tested using small explosions and never on a full scale. If it were to be fully produced and used, it would have created huge amounts of damage to coastal cities; it could have even been used with a nuclear charge. After 4000 test explosions over a seven-month period, none of which generated an appreciable tsunami, the project was closed down when it was determined that there were errors in the theoretical basis of the plan. The top secret documents on Project Seal were only declassified in 1999. A copy of the declassified report is available to the public at the Scripps Institution Of Oceanography Library in San Diego, California. Portions of the report can be viewed online at www.centerforufotruth.org... in the Shared Documents section.
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread673758/pg1

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I guess it sounds more dangerous to say '1000 millisieverts' than ' 1 sievert', even though both are describing the exact same thing.

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Originally posted by SignyM:

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I guess it sounds more dangerous to say '1000 millisieverts' than ' 1 sievert', even though both are describing the exact same thing.

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Although "1 sievert" doesn't "sound" like much, it'll put you in the hospital with a 10% chance of dying in 30 days. And although "4 sieverts" doesn't sound like much more, you will likely be dead in 30 days. So 1 sievert, while not seeming like a high number, is high enough to worry about, and at a "mere" 10 sieverts you may as well kiss your ass goodbye bc that's about all the time you'll have.

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The main point, however, from the workers perspective, is that radiation levels are 1,000 milliseverts/hour. That does not change at all with this new calibration. This means that workers will come down with radiation sickness withonly 15 min. of exposure. Some workers will die after 6 hours of exposure.

The meaning of all this is: if radiation levels continue to rise, and one day all workers are forced to evacuate, it means that the accident will be in free fall. If the workers abandon ship, and the cores will all be uncovered, then that is the point of no return; 3 nuclear power may inevitably have meltdowns making a tragedy worse than Chernobyl. Time is not on their side. Already, a new 6.5 earthquake has hit Japan, creating a small tsunami. Earthquakes, pipe breaks, cracks, etc. might cause radiation levels to increase until evacuation is unavoidable, then all hell might break out.

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Originally posted by SignyM:



They need to bury the fucking things.

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Originally posted by 1kiki:
As an observation (which may have been made elsewhere):

They don't REALLY need to be agonizing about where, exactly, is the radiation coming from, or what specifically is being released (unit 3 is fueled with MOX - mixed uranium and PLUTONIUM oxides).

They could stop this slow-motion trainwreck in a few hours. They could take the Chernobyl option: dump tons of sand, cement and boron on top. The facility would be rendered completely stable.

The fact that they aren't indicates something is more important than the lives of people already exposed and those who will be, more important than environmental contamination some of which is far longer-lived than iodine, more important than the threat of 150 tons of fissile material per reactor going critical (by comparison "Little Boy" used only 141 lbs of uranium).

I'll leave you to speculate what that could be.

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Originally posted by piratenews:

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Originally posted by SignyM:



They need to bury the fucking things.

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What if...all the spent nuke fuel rods on Earth were piled together someplace deep underground, where there is no water aquafer, so that it would overhead and go all China Syndrome and sink to the Earth's core, where it will do GOOD THINGS, like provide free geothermal electricity.

Jus sayin...

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How is the shortfall going to be made up? I guess we can just fuck all those folks on life support and the babies in incubators during the rolling blackouts.

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Originally posted by Hardware:
I've seen the first reliable reports today that plutonium has been identified outside the containment building. This is very bad. Remains to be seen how bad the contamination is. However, to this point the volatile isotopes had a very short half life. I stand by my earlier statements. The world is not coming to an end.

I'm just wondering why you aren't calling PN on his statement that the reactor core was going to explode and the spent fuel rods were going to burn? You want to encourage doomsayers? Or is this a type of schadenfreude?

When there is an accurate accounting we can assess the damage.

The more I get to know people the more I like my dogs.

...and he that has no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. Luke 22:36

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The fact that they aren't indicates something is more important than the lives of people already exposed and those who will be, more important than environmental contamination some of which is far longer-lived than iodine, more important than the threat of 150 tons of fissile material per reactor going critical (by comparison "Little Boy" used only 141 lbs of uranium).

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Originally posted by 1kiki:
H-ware - please explain to me what boron does in a nuclear reactor.

Also, I would like to see references for your assertion that the boron+ made things worse at Chernobyl. Otherwise, I'm going to be thinking you're making things up --- again.

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Originally posted by Hardware:
Kwicko,
How many times have you flown on a commercial jet?

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Originally posted by Kwicko:

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Originally posted by Hardware:
Kwicko,
How many times have you flown on a commercial jet?

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Not sure I ever have. Flew commercial once, but that was on a Lockheed Constellation. Anyone remember those?



Beautiful bird.

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